# THE "PLYTANIC" (new build)



## anytide (Jul 30, 2009)

i'm glad your moving on- ,, good luck ,now you know what to expect when building a skiff ,, you'll have even more fun this time ,, i'd like to donate to the cause, let me know if you need anything from me 
-anytide


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## rkmurphy (Nov 2, 2008)

I know nothing about boat building...so if what I say sounds stupid...please disregard. Here's my suggestions:

1. Sponsons (which you have) and maybe a small pocket tunnel. Nothing crazy...running sub 12" is pointless for our area.

2. Make the keel go back half the length of the hull and ad some sort of bow flare, reverse chine, and/or spray rails (which should be easy since YOU are building). The long keel and bow flare will help us flat bottom-ers cut through the Tampa Bay chop.

3. If you go with sponsons, bust your jackplate back out. Sure...you'll defeat SOME of the purpose of the sponsons but you'll be able to trim the boat without the sponsons digging. Plus, with the setback and the sponsons, you can raise the motor higher.

4. Add some sort of grab bar console for extra storage and comfort.

5. If you can, go with a little longer hull in the 16 or 17 foot range. Better planing ability, better for cutting chop, and better riding.

6. Change the name...the Titanic sank and it makes me scared for you.

7. Build it with the same attention to detail and craftsmanship you did the last one. 

Like I said...I could be full of shit...just some of the things I would do.

I like the way you're going with this one, though!


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

Thanks man, if things work out as I am envisioning a wooden poling platform and a wooden pushpole to go with it so I may be hitting you up soon for a pole kit and clips.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

RK,
I'm not going with a pocket/tunnel drive this time, I learned some lessons from the last boat and the pocket was more of an issue then a help. I don't want to run in less then 10-12 inches of water, but I do want to be able to pole/troll in 6-8inches and the sponsons will help me do that by offsetting the motor. I can't really go with anything bigger then 16ft due to garage space and once the sides and decks are on I'll be in the 15 1/2ft range.
Before I throw the jack plate back on I am going to try and cut the transom to the height I want. The jackplate is a back up incase I need more setback.
A grab bar may be in the future, not sure just yet. 

And the name stays! Everyone called my last boat that even though the name was TGIF (Thank God It Floats).


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

Models...pictures...more boat porn...YES!


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## Swamp (Jul 12, 2010)

Good on ya!  Looking forward to seeing it take shape.  Maybe you can add an anti SUV device. A howitzer maybe?


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

Actually I was thinking of hanging a "STAY BACK 200 FEET" flag from the poling platform ;D


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## Swamp (Jul 12, 2010)

You could hang your push pole back about 10' with a flag on it. Kind of like a curb feeler. Write "If you can read this you are about to be poked in the eye!" on the end of the pole. I still don't know how you managed to not go postal. 

Can't wait to see the first pieces of the hull.


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## B.Lee (Apr 29, 2008)

A $15k agreed value insurance policy would be sufficient, and you probably wouldn't mind someone crashing into it! But larger than that, it protects against Murphy's Law, in that when it's protected financially, bad things are less apt to happen to it.

More importantly, we have a new build in the works! Certainly looking forward to that, it's hard to keep down the building bug once it gets you.

So, new baby yet?


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

My baby is due on saturday, but who knows when it will come, we really didn't think it would stay in this long. Once things settle down I'll start the build, so I figure about a month. I may need to build a cooler for a friend first who does gator trapping.


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## popcorn (Apr 11, 2010)

Things won't calm down for about 20 years. Just help the wife out with the diapers and stuff and you might be able to squeeze in some building here and there. Congratulations, Dad!


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

What he said x2


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

Thanks guys, hopefully today is the day, but since yesterday wasn't here's a little model teaser.


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## Gramps (Nov 1, 2007)

You're killing me FC!  Good luck on your new build, I'll be watching intently.


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## Andrewp (Jul 23, 2010)

FC: Your new model (and previous builds by othere here)has gotten me off the fence and registered here at Microskiffs -- thanks! 

I'm planning to build my first wooden skiff (have built pirogues and small stuff) and the design is incorporating sponsons. My question is: do you have dimensions for your sponsons yet? Anyone any ideas on proper width, length or height? My plans call for a 48" wide transom, so I was originally planning for a 1' wide, 1' long and 1' high sponson. That would leave 2' width for motor, but I'm not sure if that is enough.

Very excited to watch your work here ....

AP


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

> FC: Your new model (and previous builds by othere here)has gotten me off the fence and registered here at Microskiffs -- thanks!
> 
> I'm planning to build my first wooden skiff (have built pirogues and small stuff) and the design is incorporating sponsons. My question is: do you have dimensions for your sponsons yet? Anyone any ideas on proper width, length or height? My plans call for a 48" wide transom, so I was originally planning for a 1' wide, 1' long and 1' high sponson. That would leave 2' width for motor, but I'm not sure if that is enough.


Welcome to the nuthouse AP! 

I thought long and hard when I was drawing out my plans, and the biggest obstical is making sure you have enough room to swing the motor around. Luckily I still have my wrecked yamaha 20 in the garage so I was able to take some rough measurements. Here is my plan and then I'll explain a little further.










When I measured the swing of the motor at 12 inches it needed like 29 inches, but at 10 inches it just needed 26. Then I figured in the angle of the transom, 14 degrees, and at the top of the transom where the motor will mount will only be about 6-7 inches depending on how high I made the sides so it will only need like 21 inches or so......does any of this make sense to anyone? :-?

So depending on what type of motor you are looking at you will need to adjust your plans. If you run a 2-stroke then they are skinnier so you can get away with larger sponsons, I'm running a 4-stroke so mine will be slightly skinnier. But just remember the demensions at the bottom of the hull and the top will be much different due to angling the sides and transom. 
As it sits right now my sponsons will add about 280 square inches or so if my math is right, to the water surface which really might add about 1/2-1" of less draft if I'm lucky. But the really good benefit will be allowing me to push my platform back a few inches increasing cockpit space and less steering interference with the tiller. 

Disclaimer: I've been working all night so I may be off on my figures a little ;D


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

When it comes to sponsons on a custom hull,
I'm of the opinion that the best method is cut to fit.
Hang the outboard you plan to use on a test transom,
then fit the sponson shape to the steering radius of the lower unit.
Remember to maintain clearance for tip wash off the prop blades, and thrust vector.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

Brett my plan was to have the bottom and side panels extend all the way to the back of the sponsons for added strength so I gotta figure this out ahead of time. I may cut them narrower by an inch just to be safe, not sure yet.


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

Understood FC.
That was the reason for a "Test Transom".
To be able to hang the motor in operating position,
then to cut a template for the sponson bottom outlines
to trace onto the hull plywood before construction.

That make sense?  I can see it in my head,
but painting a verbal picture...not so easy.

                             ;D


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

it does, but I won't be purchasing the motor till much later, unless I stick with a 20hp then I have one to use in the meantime unless I sell it first. I think I might build a new stand for it and make some cardboard templates.


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## Andrewp (Jul 23, 2010)

> it does, but I won't be purchasing the motor till much later, unless I stick with a 20hp then I have one to use in the meantime unless I sell it first. I think I might build a new stand for it and make some cardboard templates.


Yep, that's my issue as well -- probably building the boat long before getting the motor, and sponson bottom will be part of hull bottom, not added on (same with side panel sides)  .......  glad to see my thinking isn't way off.

I see you slanted your sponsons aft -- mine were going to run straight aft.  Brett, is this what you were referring to when you said " Remember to maintain clearance for tip wash off the prop blades, and thrust vector."   Want to make sure I understand the concerns ......


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

AP, that angle is important.
Without it, when you turn the engine fully to one side
you'll either interfere with the rotation of the prop, crunch,
or the thrust needed to control the steering.
Unless...the top of your cavitation plate is below the bottom of the sponsons.

                                 
It's important to maintain clearance from the prop.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

Here is mock up #2. The curve on the bow is less aggressive and the V down the keel has a gradual increase from 0 to 7 degrees up towards the front. I think this will lend better to my needs.





































I'll be doing up the sides and all in a bit, I might even throw some epoxy fillets in there so I can really see what I'm dealing with.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

I did a little tweaking and then tossed some epoxy putty in there so I could see it without all the supports in. Here is the final draft , The way it looks is deceptive since it's in 1/6th scale, the curves will be much more natural and flow better in full size.


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## Swamp (Jul 12, 2010)

Those curves look pretty good to me. Is that 1/8" fiber board (masonite)?


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

yep it's masonite, I find it works well for this because it is very consistant. I've tried to use luan but when working in such small scale it is hard to get things to match sometimes.


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## Swamp (Jul 12, 2010)

I had wondered about using that. I thought about that and also door skin. I wonder if door skin might act more like "real" plywood. Do you find that the shapes are true to the later boat when you use the fiber board? Masonite sure is easy to cut and shape, cheap too!


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

Masonite is good, the cardboard off the back of legal pads also works for 1/12 scale.
Doorskins for 1/3 or 1/2 scale models. FC, save your epoxy.
For quick modeling get a bottle of super glue...
I've even used super glue to hold plywood in place before epoxy filleting.
Saves a great deal of time.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

This is the cheap crap epoxy from walmart I bought when my boat got wrecked to plug the holes, I wouldn't waste my good stuff on a model.

The fiber board does a good job especially in the smaller scale where the plywood or luan wouldn't flex as much so you couldn't see what it will look like. This model is only 1/6th scale so the shape isn't anything like it will end up. However being I've done this before I can tell by the shape that the curves will work out nicely and my dimensions are fitting well. I may build one more at 1/4 scale just for kicks since I have enough fiber board left for it. The bigger you make the model the more true to form it will be.


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

Interesting that your model looks an awful lot like this...


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

Even from the top view...

I can get you a good deal on one of these.  ;D


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

it will be like a mini hewes or copperhead ;D but it will be all my own


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## victor78 (Dec 18, 2009)

That's my Hewes and it is for sale, and yes it is a deal!


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## oysterbreath (Jan 13, 2009)

>


AP, take note man...see the way he built out his sponsons by extending his hull bottom panels beyond the motor transom. That's how I was decribing it when we were in Arby's about 3 months ago.

Also, welcome aboard! It's about time you stopped lurking! lol


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## Andrewp (Jul 23, 2010)

FC:  I ended up using thin balsa sheets .... built this model in 1" = 1' scale, notice sponsons (square, will have to change that given earlier discussions with you and Brett) ...  Please excuse untidy work; this was thrown together rather quickly .....



I too just getting an idea on how the plans will actually unfold.  Areas of concern (design and build-wise) are sponsons and hatches ....


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

AP, because your boat will be narrower then mine you should definately angle and taper the sponsons to maximize water contact. about the hatches, I spent a ton of time building and rebuilding mine and in the end they looked good, but were far from watertight. IMHO it just isn't worth the time and effort so this time I'll just buy commercial hatches and save the headache. Plus I found out just how nice it is to have atleast a little dry storage and I intend to have some this time.
The model looks good, make sure to go to atleast 1/4 scale before you build. I'm not going to since I still know most of the dimensions from my last boat, but if it was radically different I would.


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## Conch_and_Cracker (Apr 16, 2010)

yea looks good


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## oysterbreath (Jan 13, 2009)

> IMHO it just isn't worth the time and effort so this time I'll just buy commercial hatches and save the headache.


 I hear ya' I have thought the same thing. I wonder if the store bought ones would "catch" fly line though...


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## B.Lee (Apr 29, 2008)

I think it would depend on the style hatch, some are very low profile and slick, others kinda bulky.

And I too agree, homemade hatches are cheap and relatively easy, but far from dry. Very labor intensive to build a dry hatch lid with drain channels too. I use plastic dry boxes inside my non-dry storage! Keeps stuff organized too.


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

Don't go thinking the commercial hatches don't leak.
The designs are injection molded plastics with neoprene o-rings/gaskets for seals.
Temperature changes can pull the hatch loose from the installation sealant
or the fit to the o-ring isn't tight enough and you still end up with leaks.
Which was why mine was installed vertically through the bulkhead
instead of through the deck. Water flows down hill.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

Now this is what I call a major delay! ;D










Baby girl born on friday after some complications. You start to worry when you're in surgery having a C-section and the Dr. yells "IT's stuck! I need 2 more sets of hands!" But everything worked out in the end and everyone is home and safe. I'll hopefully be back to doing stuff in the next month or so.


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## Swamp (Jul 12, 2010)

Wow! Fishing buddy in training! Congrats and give my best Mrs. Firecat. Hope you get some sleep soon.


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## B.Lee (Apr 29, 2008)

Right on! Congrats brother, she's finally here!

It's a fun time, enjoy it. The boat build will always be there, and it'll get done eventually (trust me!) 

[smiley=1-beer-german.gif]


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## Flyline (Mar 3, 2008)

Congrats on your newborn baby! Enjoy!


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## Swamp (Jul 12, 2010)

Okay we know you bought resin and hardener the other day. Well????


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## floridanative1028 (May 30, 2009)

> Hope you get some sleep soon.


Sleep?  He'll soon be forgetting what that word even means.  You'll remember what its like again around 6 months and then they start teething which starts the late night game all over again.  Its worth it though, congratulations!


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

Sleep is now a dream, I'm looking foward to a busy night at the firehouse tomorrow.

As far as buying fiberglass supplies, I have just enough right now to make me dangerous. However I have 2 other projects to do (a art deal for my wife, and a big cooler for a friend) before I get started again.


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