# Is Kevlar worth it?



## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

A resounding NO.

How many inches will one save in draft per thousand dollars?

A heavier boat rides better.

Do u really need a fish that bad or a new better fishin spot.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

X2

Definitely not worth it to me. I don't think they are pure kevlar hulls, I think they are carbon kevlar hybrids. It's been a while since I looked into it, but if memory serves Carbon fiber has great strength to weight ratio, but little impact resistance. Kevlar has amazing impact resistance but not as much mechanical stiffness. So by combining the 2 they get the best of both worlds. The carbon/Kevlar looks like carbon fiber, but instead of all black and gray, it will be checkered black and yellow. 

Ultimately it might save you 100-200lbs in a sub 20ft boat, and since it is distributed throughout the entire hull it will effect draft at rest very little. Maybe 1/4-3/4" depending on hull design and size. 

But it is 100lbs you don't have to push with a pole or motor....


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## RTS (Jul 9, 2012)

> It is my understanding that using Kevlar reduces hull weight by around 10 pounds per foot. Dolphin claims 200 pounds for the 16 Super Skiff Pro at a a cost of $3495. A new 18 Waterman made with Kevlar costs roughly $10k more than a new Caimen made without kevlar. I know the Waterman is a bigger boat from a builder that is known for having upper end prices so you can't attribute all the cost difference to Kevlar. 17 BT Elite (? weight) is $11k more than a 17 BT Strike (550 pounds).
> 
> I can't really find anything else to make cost comparisons because the builders pimping Kevlar don't make a non-Kevlar version of the same boat, while the manufacturers not using kevlar have an upcharge that brings the cost up to roughly equal that of similar boats from the kevlar builders.
> 
> ...


Using Kevlar does not reduce hull weight.  It allows you to use less material to achieve the same or better puncture resistance, hence the weight savings.

IMHO, your answer is here:

http://www.wingmasterboats.com/how-we-do-things/

Many charge much more because they can.  HB, it's just part of a build but you are already paying for a premium build.

I wouldn't want a hull with Kevlar unless it was "bagged".

General rule of thumb is you "can" realize about a 10% weight savings so lets say we keep this in the microskiff market at a 250 to 400 pound hull.  The estimated weight savings is 25 to 40 lbs, not that much, but when it allows to to run a smaller motor to achieve the same performance you now have the weight savings of the larger motor resulting in a more significant draft reduction.  That said, the reality on this site is that the boat gets used as the "primary" in lieu of it's intended purpose as a "get'r done" boat and gets overloaded with options and gear negating the advantages.  This would make my answer no, it's not worth it to most but definitely worth it to those who "do more with less"


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## MariettaMike (Jun 14, 2012)

> , the reality on this site is that the boat gets used as the "primary" in lieu of it's intended purpose as a "get'r done" boat and gets overloaded with options and gear negating the advantages.


Hey, I resemble that remark. (But I agree, and thus the thread.)


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## CurtisWright (May 9, 2012)

If your going to be loading it on top of your car then yes. Otherwise you can save 100lbs by just not getting a trolling motor and 2 batteries.


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## Robb_Smith (Oct 3, 2014)

I have a Maverick 15' HPXV that is a carbon fiber/kevlar blend.
The boat is very light (comparatively) but it's like trying to stand on a cork when drifting or anchoring. When you have your sea legs under you it is fine but then you take someone with you that isn't use to being carefull about how they move around and somebody may get wet. The ride is really good in a heavy chop and you can run to your fishing spots but you give up some stability at rest. If I stay on the poling platform and the angler stays on the bow no problem. It's when you get into a boil of fish with teeth that it gets comical. Retying leaders and hooks and moving around the small console with 3 rod holders on each side that the boat feels small. If the poler would not fish it could be better but where is the fun in that. I am not getting paid to pole my friends around. ;D


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## Vertigo (Jun 3, 2012)

In a previous life I owned a company that designed and manufactured composite aircraft components. We dealt with all types of fiberglass (there are a ton of types, weaves and finishes), Kevlar, Spectra (Dynema), carbon fiber, etc.

In general there's not much of a weight savings with a pure Kevlar layup over pure glass because it takes more resin to fill the Kevlar matrix than it does glass; further, because Kevlar is very difficult to sand, the surface coating will probably have to be a little thicker. When core material or a mixture of materials is used in the layup, the question becomes more complicated. 

In comparison of the fibers (not a layup including resin):
Kevlar fiber is about half as dense as E-glass.
Kevlar fiber has about the same tensile strength as E-glass.
Kevlar fiber is much less strong than E-glass in compression.
Kevlar fiber has about twice the strength to weight ratio as E-glass.

So, it really comes down to the precise application as to which material is best. Unless weight is extremely critical, Kevlar is usually just too expensive to justify its use. On the other hand if you need impact and abrasion resistance Kevlar is hard to beat. Probably the best blend of cost to weight to stiffness would be obtained using carbon fiber in areas stressed in tension, glass in areas under compression and Kevlar in areas that will experience high impact and abrasion. If cost to performance is the only consideration, glass is the winner. (for boats, wood or aluminum beat resin and fabric for strength/stiffness to weight every time)


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

> I have a Maverick 15' HPXV that is a carbon fiber/kevlar blend.
> The boat is very light (comparatively) but it's like trying to stand on a cork when drifting or anchoring. When you have your sea legs under you it is fine but then you take someone with you that isn't use to being carefull about how they move around and somebody may get wet. The ride is really good in a heavy chop and you can run to your fishing spots but you give up some stability at rest. If I stay on the poling platform and the angler stays on the bow no problem. It's when you get into a boil of fish with teeth that it gets comical. Retying leaders and hooks and moving around the small console with 3 rod holders on each side that the boat feels small. If the poler would not fish it could be better but where is the fun in that. I am not getting paid to pole my friends around. ;D


The characteristics you described are not a result of the carbon fiber layup, they are a result of displacement and the hull design.

Can't say the carbon / Kevlar is worth it since I have owned boats with both layups and haven't been able to tell a difference in performance.


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## cutrunner (Jun 8, 2010)

No
Theres are much better ways to save weight in a skiff, especially a simple poling skiff.
In my eyes the prime super light poling skiff would be vaccum bagged, epoxy, carbon fiber s glass mix that is cored on the bottom, sides etc, built with a design shape in mind that maximizes strength and minimalizes surface area/weight, no floor, minimal everything, painted not gelcoated, etc, in the relative design of a gladesman. That would be one bad ish


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## MariettaMike (Jun 14, 2012)

forgot to put the "carbon" in, but this older thread on THT has beat this horse before.

http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-forum/333775-carbon-kevlar-worth-extra-money-4.html


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## Jhw (Jan 13, 2019)

Thanks for these quick responses. I am aware that I am scatter shooting.
I‘m much more interested in stability than a 1/4” in draft. I don’t pole so what is the lightest cat? What is The most shallow cat? Other variables?
JW


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

You need to do some research. Call and go to vendor websites and see what they offer. This is more of a MicroSkiff forum so big cat hulls are not prevalent on here. 
I don’t understand what you mean by stability. Kevlar vs glass isn’t going to change much but weight. Stability gains would be in wetted hull width. Heavier hulls ride better in chop generally speaking so there’s that nugget. 
You should contact these shops for starters:
Tran Sport
Haynie
Shoalwater
Catalyst
Simmons Custom Boats
Shallow Sport
Mowdy
Fat Cat
There are many more but these are off the top of my head


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## devrep (Feb 22, 2009)

I think some people think that kevlar in a poling skiff hull will give the bottom some magic resistance against rocks and oyster bars. my understanding, kevlar in a vest has many layers and has give as an object hits. kevlar in 1 layer in a ridged structure is not going to save your ass from the hull ripping open. CM says similar in his blog. my old waterman has kevlar and I'm not counting on it to save my ass in rock city. gimmick.


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## Jhw (Jan 13, 2019)

1. Like everyone I want shallow 2. Skiffs go Kevlar to get light to get shallow 3. Cats are fairly shallow but NOT light. 4 hence my question WHY DON’T SMALL CATS GO KEVLAR TO GET LIGHT TO GET SHALLOW?
i don’t poll so beam is not too important (?)?q


Smackdaddy53 said:


> You need to do some research. Call and go to vendor websites and see what they offer. This is more of a MicroSkiff forum so big cat hulls are not prevalent on here.
> I don’t understand what you mean by stability. Kevlar vs glass isn’t going to change much but weight. Stability gains would be in wetted hull width. Heavier hulls ride better in chop generally speaking so there’s that nugget.
> You should contact these shops for starters:
> Tran Sport
> ...


Glass vs kevlar is not a stability question. It was a draft question. 
Catamaran is far more stable than any micro or even bay boat I’ve been on so...for a guy who is not going to pole why not a shallow catamaran? Bigger motor$, fuel+$, What else am I forgetting?
jw


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## TroutNreds12 (Jan 4, 2016)

Kevlar at the prices these high end builders charge is definitely not worth it!! 
Even if you don’t pole cats are loud as hell...hull slap scares fish worst then anything IMO...I have friends with cats and they can’t get near as close to a fish as I can even with trolling motor being used on both boats, not to mention bigger boats displacement of more water fish feel it...I was recently in Louisiana and proved this day in and day out. Fishing same areas I was cane poling fish under my bow in my skiff. My friends in cat hulls couldn’t get within 20-30 ft of the same fish.


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## Jhw (Jan 13, 2019)

Thanks. I didn’t know about the noise issue. I Once had a catamaran but never a micro or bay. Maybe that’s why my Flyfishing was so poor . Duh.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Are you trolling us, just being difficult or very young?


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

Jhw said:


> Thanks for these quick responses.


Quick response - ummm, it took 4 years to respond or you revived a 4 year old thread.


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