# lure tangle with leader on retrieve, help/advice



## tailchaser16 (Sep 23, 2008)

I throw twitch baits like Rapala Twitchin Rap, MirrOdine all the time.
I tie 50# Ande mono leader to a loop knot (no, not going to tie anything less). Loop size varies throughout the day for no particular reason. I find that every third cast the front treble keeps getting hooked up to my leader line on the retrieve (a slightly fast walk the dog type retrieve). I do change the trebles out to one size larger on all my plugs. And if it matters I am using a bait caster not a spinner.
Anyone have a remedy for this tangling? It gets aggravating after a while.


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## MatthewAbbott (Feb 25, 2017)

Are you using a swivel to attach your leader to your mainline? Sometimes with shorter leaders the swivel will sink the line enough to foul.

Switch back to the correct size treble on the front hook or go to a single.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Why are you using 50# leader? I’ve fished 20# Trilene Big Game clear mono as a leader on my inshore braid rigs with no issues and fish mirrodines, fatboys, soft plastics, toowaters etc all the time and fish around heavy shell a lot.


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## MatthewAbbott (Feb 25, 2017)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> Why are you using 50# leader? I’ve fished 20# Trilene Big Game clear mono as a leader on my inshore braid rigs with no issues and fish mirrodines, fatboys, soft plastics, toowaters etc all the time and fish around heavy shell a lot.


Maybe the 50# mono is creating enough drag that the bait pushes past it on the retrieve?


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> Why are you using 50# leader? I’ve fished 20# Trilene Big Game clear mono as a leader on my inshore braid rigs with no issues and fish mirrodines, fatboys, soft plastics, toowaters etc all the time and fish around heavy shell a lot.


sometimes I fish up to a 40# leader in snooky waters


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

yobata said:


> sometimes I fish up to a 40# leader in snooky waters


I understand using heavy leader/rod for pulling snook from around structure but for typical inshore trout, redfish etc I use 20# and maybe twice in a decade have been broken off. That heavy leader could be his issue.


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## tailchaser16 (Sep 23, 2008)

Mathew
No swivel, Uni to Uni from braid to mono. 
Stock hooks are too small and do not hold as well as 2X.




yobata said:


> sometimes I fish up to a 40# leader in snooky waters


This!

Snook! I fish mangrove shorelines, downed trees and oyster bars with somewhat locked down drags.


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## FishWithChris (Feb 6, 2019)

mono floats; that with oversized trebles are creating a push-back where they are essentially do-si-do'ing back around and catching the leader. drop to a 30# leader, put the proper size trebles back on (because I can almost guarantee that the action has changed on the lure), and go to town.


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## MatthewAbbott (Feb 25, 2017)

tailchaser16 said:


> Mathew
> No swivel, Uni to Uni from braid to mono.
> Stock hooks are too small and do not hold as well as 2X.


If your having issues with hook breaking or straightening out go to a single hook up front.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

You can use 4X strong VMC round bend trebles, same size as stock but thicker. I swap them out on all my plugs.


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## FishWithChris (Feb 6, 2019)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> You can use 4X strong VMC round bend trebles, same size as stock but thicker. I swap them out on all my plugs.


love those VMC hooks; some of the best trebles on the market


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

FishWithChris said:


> love those VMC hooks; some of the best trebles on the market


Owner ZO are better but more expensive and will absolutely outlast the lure they are on but then if you break off a fish the lure will be hanging out of it’s face and not rust out. I’ll use them a lot on topwaters.

https://www.google.com/search?q=owner+zo+wire+hooks&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-us&client=safari


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## LowHydrogen (Dec 31, 2015)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> Why are you using 50# leader? I’ve fished 20# Trilene Big Game clear mono as a leader on my inshore braid rigs with no issues and fish mirrodines, fatboys, soft plastics, toowaters etc all the time and fish around heavy shell a lot.


Reds have been good to fair over shell with morning glory she-dogs


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## MatthewAbbott (Feb 25, 2017)

Lol


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

LowHydrogen said:


> Reds have been good to fair over shell with morning glory she-dogs


My son...


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## Forcefed (Aug 5, 2016)

Stop using a loop knot to tie the plug to leader. Unfortunately tying something other than a loop knot with heavier mono will dull the action of the lure a bit.


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## lemaymiami (Feb 9, 2007)

Here's my recipe... drop from 50lb mono to 40lb fluoro for that leader... It's okay to up the size of the rear hook - but leave the front hook the way it came... 

Lastly and probably more important is to have someone that knows plug rods and that old "walk the dog" routine to watch you as work the lure.... I've noticed on more than one occasion that how my anglers work a plug is directly related to how often they either foul the tip of the rod (braid laying a couple of half hitches on the rodtip) or foul the plug... A bit less rod motion (keep your movements with the rod scaled back a bit...) usually goes a long way towards stopping any tendency to foul... 

Lastly with any leader, watch it closely to make sure it's nice and straight - a leader that's become kinked near the lure will cause you to repeat the fouling over and over again on your retrieves... That's actually one of the most important reasons I use and recommend fluoro as a leader material since you can easily straighten out any fluoro leader by simply hanging your hook, lure, or fly on something solid then pulling that leader tight and holding it there for a moment or two (pull hard enough that the leader is hurting your hands to do it right...).
Occasionally the fouling occurs when the cast isn't nice and smooth allowing the leader to land onto the hook, lure, or fly. Slow down your cast a tiny bit and that tendency will disappear.... 

Hope this helps -but don't think for a moment that the rest of us don't have the same problem from time to time....


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## tailchaser16 (Sep 23, 2008)

Great info from all have to remember it all, except for fishwithchris second part of going stock and using 30#. Sorry nothing personal. 
It is just when you hook up to a better then slot snook and she throws the plug cause the rinky dinky stock hooks don't set or they straighten from the tight drag, you feel it all day long! 
Does the action change? Probably! but I don't care. I don't finesse fish, it gets twitched fast walking the dog action. Guess it's a reaction strike, not sure but, it works! 
Lastly, I have taken some friends with me and when I ask them what size leader are you throwing and they tell me 25 or 30, I laugh. The faces they make when I tell them 50 is standard and 60 at night is priceless. Had one guy loose 2 lures to snook, before asking me for some 50 and we were in a tournament. Could of left him on that island that day!!


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## Big Fish (Dec 20, 2019)

tailchaser16 said:


> I throw twitch baits like Rapala Twitchin Rap, MirrOdine all the time.
> I tie 50# Ande mono leader to a loop knot (no, not going to tie anything less). Loop size varies throughout the day for no particular reason. I find that every third cast the front treble keeps getting hooked up to my leader line on the retrieve (a slightly fast walk the dog type retrieve). I do change the trebles out to one size larger on all my plugs. And if it matters I am using a bait caster not a spinner.
> Anyone have a remedy for this tangling? It gets aggravating after a while.



Dont fish mirrodines with a loop knot, just straight tie it to the leader with a conventional knot (such as clinch). This will really help keep it from hooking your leader. Also try a lighter leader if possible. I throw 15# flouro with mirrodines while targetting trout. I'd move up to 20# if fishing for reds.

I also wouldnt trade hooks for a larger size, a better hook perhaps but not larger.


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## lemaymiami (Feb 9, 2007)

We’re all using the same gear... differently. When I hand my angler a #17 Mirrolure it’s with 30lb fluoro leader - and a loop knot even though I have it on the lightest rod on my skiff using only 10lb braid.


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## Snakesurf (Jun 18, 2019)

TC16,
Try a little bit slower rod with your set up that you are using with 50# leader. It sounds to me like the rod action is causing this. Braided line is stiff and doesn't flex as much as mono and the heavy leader isn't giving as much either, so to make up for that you need a more flexy rod. Basically a stiffer faster rod is better for mono because the line stretches and a more moderate slower rod is better for braid. You most likely will improve hooking and keeping the fish on line also. If you have an older rod that is a little more flexible I would try to see if it works out, then you can go out and find something that will work out with a similar flex. Good luck.


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## mwolaver (Feb 6, 2014)

I think this has been said... kinda: try to twitch the lure a bit less. When I started fishing the rapala with the J hooks, I fouled the front hook about every 5 casts. Sometimes on the leader and sometimes on the lure itself. I worked on this in the pool, where you can really see what's happening. Especially with braid, you are imparting almost every inch of rod movement to the lure. When I adjusted my rod twitching (not the speed of the overall retrieve), I decreased my problems to once in about every 20 casts. I thought this was acceptable. Good luck.


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## jimsmicro (Oct 29, 2013)

In the summer I fish a heavier 40-50lb mono leader to prevent tarpon and jack breakoffs and had problems working Skitterwalks and such. I eliminated the loop knot. It subtracts a little from the action but so does hooking your own leader every cast. I don't find it affects the action enough to where the fish care.


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