# Getting smaller hooks to ride point up...



## bananabob (Jun 3, 2015)

A lot of it depends on the pattern you want to fish. Tying more material on the point side helps as well as using a jig hook or bending the shank yourself so that the eye of the hook is between the shank and point even if only slightly. This helps with both slow or fast sinking flies that fish close to or on the bottom or in very shallow flats situations ie. bendbacks. And these are w/o adding more than or no necessary weight.

More details on your particular application needs will help with usable answers.


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## permitchaser (Aug 26, 2013)

I tie a shrimp fly that has palmered grizzly hackle. I cut all protruding hair from the bottom and it sits up-right
No need for weight


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## coconutgroves (Sep 23, 2013)

@bryson - what size hooks? You can tie bendbacks down to small hooks if you get ones with a good enough shank.


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

I use the xs tungsten scud body weights on most of my shrimp and baitfish patterns. They provide enough weight but aren't too heavy. Combine with the majority of the material riding back up toward the point they always ride hook up. If thats too much weight I tie in some thin lead wire and wrap in a section along the backside of the shank of the hook. 
You can also control sink rate by the amount of material you tie in.

I throw plenty of size 2 hooks like this on my 5 wt without any problems.


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## Nway93 (May 9, 2016)

I fish a 6wt a lot and have chucked some pretty heavy stuff on it without too much trouble. I've thrown merkin style crabs with med brass eyes at floodtide reds on it with no problems. You should be fine with like medium or large beadchain on a 5wt. If it's a kwan/toad type body tie the material on the inside of the hook, even with med beadchain on a #4 daichi 2546 it'll ride hook point down if you tie it the other way. I've also found that tying rubber legs in on the top of the shank makes a huge difference even with unweighted flies as they're quite buoyant. A strip of lead on on the bottom of the hook helps too.


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## bryson (Jun 22, 2015)

Thanks for all the replies! I'll use the rod for bass in neighborhood ponds, and for reds on calm days. Might get some juvenile tarpon and snook action a few times a year. I will throw baitfish patterns when I can, but I may want to throw clousers for bass or trout or weighed crab/shrimp patterns for reds sometimes. I haven't experimented with bendbacks, but it's definitely something worth trying out. 

I haven't really decided what size hooks I will throw - I imagine that the less weight I need to add to keep the hook riding up, the larger/heavier hook I can use. I have some patterns I typically tie on #1 SC15 and #2 Owner Flyliner that I could downsize.

I tied some fluouo leaders with 14lb tippet to help get more lightly weighed flies down, so hopefully that will help make it a little easier to cast as well. I've only ever casted 5wt lines with yarn flies, so I might be making a bigger deal out of this than it will end up being.


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## lemaymiami (Feb 9, 2007)

Most that have heard of using lead on their flies have never been taught (or shown) the best method for using wire to add weight to a fly. I have a few patterns that are leaded - and here's how... Before tying the pattern I lay a course of down the shank of the hook (with the hook in the vise conventionally -point down). Then I use pre-cut segments of .040 square lead wire (round will work just at well but the square wire is easier to lock into place on the shank with thread) that are a bit shorter than the hook shank, wrapped into place with the thread - then super glued. Remove hook and turn over barb up then tie your fly with all (or as many as possible) on the point side of the hook (on top, when your hook is in the vise, point up...).

The resulting pattern will ride hook point up all day long. If as noted above you have a collar or palmered body, then simply trim the materials on the bottom side of the fly so that it sits as flush as possible on the bottom.

I learned this technique while doing tons of bonefish flies for one shop or other. It's quick to tie, and most anglers never notice the added weight (unless you get carried away with the lead...). By the way solid lead solder wire in various diameters makes a great substitute for the square lead wire - which can be a bit tough to come by....


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## coconutgroves (Sep 23, 2013)

@bryson - while you can throw #1 and 2s on on a 5wt, that is still considered a larger hook size. I've tied bendbacks on #4 and #6 that would throw no problem on a 5 wt. Even some smaller bead chain can be used to turn that hook over even more.


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