# 4x4 or 4x2



## skelly (Dec 16, 2006)

I tow a Mitzi 15 with a 4cyl Honda and am going to buy a truck. Is the 4x4 worth the extra money for a boat this small? Is anyone having trouble at ramps with the 4x2 Tacoma or Frontier? 

Also, is it worth going with the V6 for a boat as small as this? I never tow anything more than the Mitzi and even on the highway, I'm only going 40 miles at the furthest. Thoughts?


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## iMacattack (Dec 11, 2006)

If you are using unimproved ramps or need to drive on poor, sandy/muddy paths then maybe 4x4, but otherwise 4x2. Plenty of tips and tricks on microskiff on keeping your rig from ending up in the drink at the boat ramp.


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## skelly (Dec 16, 2006)

Most of the ramps are improved, so I'm not so worried about much at there except the rear wheel and spinning tires. 

I'm more interested if whether it is really worth the extra $4000 for 4x4 and V6 if I am just towing a micro skiff. 

Both the Tacomas and the Frontiers are rated fine, but I don't want to save the money only to find out that 4x4 V6 is what I really need.


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## iMacattack (Dec 11, 2006)

> but I don't want to save the money only to find out that 4x4 V6 is what I really need.



Well ask yourself how am "I" going to use the vehicle? Daily commuter/general use vehicle? Off road use? Tow a sub 1500lb BMT (Boat Motor Trailer) combo to typical improved ramps? 

If it were me, 4x2, save the money on the 4x4 (including fuel economy hit) and buy a good trailer with features that allow you to just touch the trailer tires right at the edge of the water at the ramp vs. having to dunk the trailer up to the receiver to get the boat on and off.


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## FlatCat (Aug 18, 2007)

Sounds like the extra cost/drivetrain/fuel cost are not worth it in your situation.
I'd go with a Ranger or Colorado. I've had fleets of both the nissans and toyotas.....the nissans don't hold up and the toyotas are not worth the extra cost.....plus all toyotas coming into Florida get an extra distributor markup on top of sticker price,


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## skelly (Dec 16, 2006)

> Sounds like the extra cost/drivetrain/fuel cost are not worth it in your situation.
> I'd go with a Ranger or Colorado. I've had fleets of both the nissans and toyotas.....the nissans don't hold up and the toyotas are not worth the extra cost.....plus all toyotas coming into Florida get an extra distributor markup on top of sticker price,


Thanks, that's helpful. The Colorado is one that I am thinking about. Wish Jeep had a pickup.


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## makin moves (Mar 20, 2010)

I use to love the pickup jeep made wish the would make another one. I have a v6 sport trac and tow a suv 17 or my copperhead and Ive never had a problem at ramps. I belive the insurance is also more on a 4x4, not by much but it adds up


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## makin moves (Mar 20, 2010)

This will work


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## skelly (Dec 16, 2006)

> This will work


That Gladiator is a sweet concept. If they are coming onto lots in 2012, I'd wait. Who knows the sticker on something like that. My bet is low $30s.


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## WhiteDog70810 (May 6, 2008)

If you don't bite off more than you can chew, the 2wd will never let you down. I've towed a boat that is probably a touch heavier than a Mitzi a lot with a 2wd Toyota, 2wd Izusu or 2wd Mazda. They do fine. There will be times you want the 4x4, but you don't need it. Steep slick ramps weren't a big issue, although we had to stand on the bumper a couple of times. We never used unimproved ramps.

I find the 4 cylinder engines work really hard to maintain highway speeds on climbs while towing even light trailers at 65+ MPH. It isn't a big deal, but just understand that it is a little engine and don't expect it to pull like a 3/4 ton. If you downshift or use Tow/Haul and don't just stomp the gas pedal to the floor on climbs, you can baby it up and over. I've had four 2wd compact trucks that made it well over 150,000 despite towing (2 actually cleared 200K), so don't worry about ragging your truck out as a weekend warrior unless you know you are traditionally hard on vehicles.

I am partial to Rangers/B2300's due the low purchase price and operating cost, but the fit and finish of the Toyotas and Nissans are better in my experience. Durability and performance have been equivalent between the makes I've driven. I have no experience with Nissans.

Nate


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

I don't think 4x4 is really needed in most situations on improved ramps and a light load. I second the chevy colorado, it's 4cyl engine puts out alot more power and torque then the rest from what I remember when I was shopping around.


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## tguasjr (Mar 9, 2009)

Dont rule out the dodge dakota. I Had a 4 door dakota v6 2wd that I used to pull my 22 foot seafox without a problem. That was one of the best trucks I've ever owned.


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## noeettica (Sep 23, 2007)

V6 2 wheel drive ...


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## iMacattack (Dec 11, 2006)

> V6 2 wheel drive ...


Or do what I did... 5.7L turbo diesel I6 2 wheel drive ;D


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## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

V6 2wd [smiley=1-thumbsup3.gif]


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## hookemdano (Feb 9, 2007)

I have Toyota w 4cyl and 4wd. There have been several times I have been glad I got the 4wd at some of the ramps I use. 
If you are never gonna tow any distance then 4cyl is okay. I have towed my boat (similar weight to yours) to the Keys twice and other long trips and hate the small motor. Doesn't have enough a## to get out of it's own way and mpg gets cut in half due to work load. 
Getting a new truck this fall and it will have a much bigger motor and prob stay w 4x4. Won't be my daily driver so I can swallow the loss of mpg due to both.


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## fsae99 (Apr 8, 2010)

I pull my 15 boat with my wife's Ford Escape V6 FWD 2WD, with traction control. I have been very impressed, pull boat out in some very steep ramps and no tire slippage.

If you think you may go outside of your normal area, I'd suggest V6. As other posters said a 4cycl is going to be light on power on hills and acceleration to merge. I also suggest you really consider front wheel drive. It puts the drive wheel under the weight of the engine keeps them most of the time on the dry and above the algae on ramps.


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## iMacattack (Dec 11, 2006)

Again, save the money on the 4x4 and get a good trailer. This is from Chittum Skiff website. When properly setup the trailer tires just kiss the waters edge. 










Cheers


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## High + Dry Adventures (Apr 11, 2011)

2004 Dodge Ram 1500 Hemi 

4x4 is one of those things that if you dont get it u will regret it.

I even use mine sometimes to drive in rain and its amazing.

I have NEVER spun a tire at ANY ramp.  My truck practically creeps out of the ramp on its own in 4x4.  

The sweet thing is that its paid off...ohhh yeah


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## Charlie (Apr 5, 2010)

I drive from Fort Lauderdale down to Flamingo (200+ mile round trip) with a two wheel drive Honda element. Never had a single problem with power or loading and unloading. So long as you don't back your car into the water you should be fine.


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## tom_in_orl (Dec 9, 2006)

> If you are using unimproved ramps or need to drive on poor, sandy/muddy paths then maybe 4x4, but otherwise 4x2.


X2


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

I have the Dodge Dakota 4 door 5.9 and it is amazing. Over 220,000 and has never spent the day in the shop.

I would recommend this over the V6 even if you don't need the bigger engine. It gets better milage than the V6 and if you ever need to pull more than a micro, you can. 

Another thing that I may have missed is the maintainence of the 4wd.

I am a duck hunter and go to some pretty remote locations and only wish I had 4wd a few times but never enough to buy another.


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## SilentHunter (Jun 14, 2010)

i tow a 18ft center console wellcraft with a 97 1500 ext cab chevy with a 4.3v6 2wd with 274k miles

ive never had an issue pulling my rig out and my rig probly weighs 3x as much as yours. 

4 banger 2wd will serve you fine.... but its always nice to know you got a little extra power incase "stuff" happens


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## backwaterbandits (Dec 15, 2006)

I'm a Chevy guy thru and thru, But
I've heard real good things about the
new Eco-Boost V-6 in the F-150.


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## Les_Lammers (Feb 17, 2007)

40 miles max? Just use you Honda and save your money.

I have an '05 CRV 4 banger AWD and have no problems pulling a small skiff and have never slipped at a ramp.

If you are getting a truck because you *need* another vehicle get a V6 2WD. The new 'small' trucks are underpowered with a 4 banger.


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## cutrunner (Jun 8, 2010)

I had a 2 wheel drive single cab shortbed 4cyl s10. It pulled my little skiff just fine. Even took it too the keys. From my house (2 miles from the i-95 on ramp) in stuart fl to cudjoe key. I filled up right before getting on 95, then refilled when i got to Cudjoe. Towing the boat and doing 80mph down 95 it only took $25 when i refilled at my destination in cudjoe!!!!!!!! I still dont believe or understand how.... I still miss the heck outta that truck


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## thawk (Apr 1, 2011)

> Sounds like the extra cost/drivetrain/fuel cost are not worth it in your situation.
> I'd go with a Ranger or Colorado. I've had fleets of both the nissans and toyotas.....the nissans don't hold up and the toyotas are not worth the extra cost.....plus all toyotas coming into Florida get an extra distributor markup on top of sticker price,


You got this information where? Don't bash Toyota because they "cost more." You get what you pay for, and when you turn around to resell that vehicle, or even if you make a purchase that you plan to drive until you croak, I think it's a bit better to go for quality than cheap.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

> You got this information where? Don't bash Toyota because they "cost more." You get what you pay for, and when you turn around to resell that vehicle, or even if you make a purchase that you plan to drive until you croak, I think it's a bit better to go for quality than cheap.


I'm not trying to start a debate, but Toyota's are not what they used to be IMO, especially in the lower line vehicles! Toyota's typically don't cost much more these days, and you can only get the 4cly in the basic package now. Couple that with the fact they are only offering a 36k warranty when most other manufaturers have moved up to a 60k, and there known paint issues which I have had first hand experience with I would look elsewhere first. 
I went from being a diehard chevy fan, to a diehard Toyota fan, but after owning 7 in the family over the last few years it is easy to see they are getting greedy and not putting out the product they used to so now I'm leaning back to chevy. I still say check out the Colorado, it has a lot more power and torque, sometimes more then the V6's, and still can get almost 30mpg. Not to mention it is a heck of alot more roomy then the tacoma and has a 100,000 miles powertain warranty, and no tune ups for 100,000 miles too. Our last toyota cost us over $1000 in regularly scheduled maintenence in the 3 years we had it. :


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## Frank_Sebastian (Oct 15, 2007)

I didn't hear any mention (read actually) of a limited slip rear axle. Many of the older trucks were available with a tow package. For a manual transmission you got a lower ratio rear axle, limited slip rear axle and heavy duty radiator and rear springs. All this on a 2008 Silverado cost me all of $400 including trailer hitch.

Frank_S


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## cutrunner (Jun 8, 2010)

^agreed. BUY AMERICAN!!!!!!!!!!


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## AfterHours2 (Aug 2, 2010)

Having owned every body design of the Tundra, 2000-Current, the only thing I have ever had to replace was a single plug coil at around 115k miles. Never had any issues with anything else and I must say the resale value speaks for itself. Having 4wd on every truck I have owned not only pays off when you need to use it but also when you go to sell it. They add much more value/need to the vehicle and are often harder to find. Most folks who challenge the need and usefulness of 4wd wish at times they would of forked out the few extra bucks for the option. Personally, I just like the idea of being able to snatch and grab my boat in any type of situation without the worries... just my opinion...


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## boggob (Feb 20, 2007)

I tow my Panga with my 2002, 4 cyl, 4X2 Tacoma Prerunner. I've never had any issues but imagine that I would prefer a V6. The gas mileage now on later models is the same, if not a little better than my 4 banger.


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## thawk (Apr 1, 2011)

> ^agreed. BUY AMERICAN!!!!!!!!!!


Sure, why not...except I think my tax dollars have bailed out that company enough. Not to mention that Toyota trucks are produced in the states and provide jobs for tons of Americans.

Edit: Toyotas come with complimentary maintenance for two years now..and I hate to say it, but if you take every "routine maintenance" package they offer you you're bound to pay an arm and a leg! I'm pretty sure every dealership will offer services you may not need in order to increase their revenues...that's how they make their money. Plus, who needs a 100k mile warranty when nothing will go wrong with their Yota ;D.


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## thawk (Apr 1, 2011)

Brand loyalty aside, 4x4 is worth the extra couple thousand just for the occasional "oh-shit" scenario and, like someone mentioned above, adds to the value of the truck if you decided to resell it.


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## HighSide25 (May 15, 2007)

here you go!


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## cutrunner (Jun 8, 2010)

> > ^agreed. BUY AMERICAN!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> 
> Sure, why not...except I think my tax dollars have bailed out that company enough. Not to mention that Toyota trucks are produced in the states and provide jobs for tons of Americans.



When did we bail Ford out?


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## thawk (Apr 1, 2011)

> > > ^agreed. BUY AMERICAN!!!!!!!!!!
> >
> >
> > Sure, why not...except I think my tax dollars have bailed out that company enough. Not to mention that Toyota trucks are produced in the states and provide jobs for tons of Americans.
> ...


Correct me if I'm wrong, but both of those posts mentioned Chevy, not Ford...


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## cutrunner (Jun 8, 2010)

Your right, they did. But i generally stated "buy american", which Ford still is.


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## thawk (Apr 1, 2011)

> Your right, they did. But i generally stated "buy american", which Ford still is.


Indeed..the new ford trucks are nice too. Ecoboost claims some great mpgs for its size. I'll never support Chevy though after all the bs that occured.


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## cutrunner (Jun 8, 2010)

Yea, i would buy an ecoboost, just wanna wait a couple years and see how they fare first. I have nothing against Toyota, truth is they made great trucks, just like an old chevy with a 350 or a Ford with a 351. All companies still make good cars. I just like chevys cuz i was raised in one, and they still make pushrod v8s. Those LS based motors are friggin bulletproof. Just like the 22re was in the yotas


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## boggob (Feb 20, 2007)

That Jeep Gladiator concept may be released as a 2012, so I've read.


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## thawk (Apr 1, 2011)

> Yea, i would buy an ecoboost, just wanna wait a couple years and see how they fare first. I have nothing against Toyota, truth is they made great trucks, just like an old chevy with a 350 or a Ford with a 351. All companies still make good cars. I just like chevys cuz i was raised in one, and they still make pushrod v8s. Those LS based motors are friggin bulletproof. Just like the 22re was in the yotas


Same here, I'm pretty stoked to see what Toyota and Ford may come up with on that new joint venture they're on in the Hybrid field. Hybrid truck with the same towing capacity but double the mpgs? I'm all in


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## SilentHunter (Jun 14, 2010)

Royce... i seen the dime creepin down us1 the other day. blacked out windows and all.


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## WhiteDog70810 (May 6, 2008)

[smiley=threadjacked.gif]

I've been drooling over the Gladiator since '07 when I saw the concept vehicle in person at the Texas state fair. It is just as awesomely as the pictures lead you to believe. It has been going to come out "next year" every since, but from what I read, Chrysler can't justify making it because they already make the Dakota, which is the meat-and-potatoes mid-size truck in their line-up. No matter how good of a vehicle it was, the Gladiator would be a niche vehicle for the few guys that love Jeeps and wish they'd kept their Scrambler from college, but really need a truck. The money invested wouldn't justify the money it made. I might have cried when I read that and my heart still jumps a bit every time I hear someone say it is coming in`12.

Now back to get back on track,

I recommend going big or keeping it little. Don't piddle around in between. If you feel a V6 would would better for you, get the 4x4. It can do anything you have any business doing while towing a light skiff, the resale is better and the operating cost/maintenance ain't much worse than a 2wd V6. If you need a cheap daily driver that can tow a light skiff, a 2wd 4-banger compact truck will take good care of you.

Nate


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

> because they already make the Dakota


NOPE. Dakota as we know it is only a memory.

That Gldiator above is in the Jeep museum at their headquarters in Auburn Hills. Already a dinosaur.

2012 compact pickups are scarce. But an interesting model is a rebadged Nissan sold at a lower price by Suzuki.


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## chew (Feb 26, 2010)

why not keep you current ride, and find a good cheap used jeep wrangler?? I-6 4.0... very tuff very dependable... i have towed everything from my gheenoe classic up to a 21ft alum Express tunnel no probs.... i bought my current jeep for less than $4k have it insured as an occasinal driver and pay like $55 a month on insurance.... avg 15 city / 22 hwy. and with the back seat removed makes for a nice little truck bed...... and i have used mine on nice ramps as well as right off the side of the dirt banks to launch..... again, all about your personal likes...... and as just my 2 cents


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## mudd_minnow (Oct 13, 2010)

If you ever had wished you could put in at a place where there are no ramps or a place that the ramp was washed out? You'll wish you had a 4x4. Get it you won't regreat it.


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## draggingcanoe (Dec 11, 2006)

I like 4x4. When towing the RV, I can take the Highsider. Have saved a little money on launch fees in Florida. Just got back from a 7200. mi. coast to coast trip w/ the RV. Didn't need 4x4 on the trip, but would in places if it had been wet.

Can back this into some rough places:


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## JimCameron (Jan 3, 2010)

Draggin, you are my new hero.


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## JimCameron (Jan 3, 2010)

> I tow a Mitzi 15 with a 4cyl Honda and am going to buy a truck. Thoughts?


If you are going to buy a truck because you want a truck, disregard the following.

If you are going to buy a tow vehicle for a microskiff, and you want tow capacity, combined with capability and still have great fuel economy, consider a Subaru. I tow with a Subaru Outback. It has tow capacity of 2700lbs, and has symmetrical all wheel drive. Most small "suv's" have an all wheel drive system that is an after thought add on to a FWD system. Subaru has always been a symmetrical awd system designed to be an awd system from the git go. I have blown by Jeeps that were railed in the sand, (can happen to anyone) and towed up and down the East coast. 

Here's the kicker, around town, always 26-27 mpg, highway without towing, 30-32mpg. Highway towing is dependent on how fast, how heavy, and how hilly.

Just a thought. Down side it has a higher Geezer number than a Frontier, but it gets about 10mpg better fuel economy. BTDT


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