# Bilge Pumps in your Pathfinder 17T tunnel-hull and other considerations



## hawkman (May 19, 2018)

I understand a bilge pump isn't going to save me in the case of a hull failure, but I've always got enough water in my hull(s) when I come out of the water that it'd give me the peace of mind to have them. Googling 'best bilge pump' and the like isnt' much help. 

I imagine that I need a *500-gph* bilge pump per side with a separate (or integrated) float switch. Since floor space is limited down there, I might go integrated. I have to get an old transducer off the floor on one side to mount a new one or I just have to put the transducer on the other side.

*Any comments on capacity and brand* would be helpful, as well as *where to mount the exit* hole on the stern, and *how to wire it*. I've looked this all up but I like discussion and hearing opinions. I've seen a diagram about the wiring that I found confusing that I'll share with you when I find it.


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## Mako 181 (May 1, 2020)

hawkman said:


> I understand a bilge pump isn't going to save me in the case of a hull failure, but I've always got enough water in my hull(s) when I come out of the water that it'd give me the peace of mind to have them. Googling 'best bilge pump' and the like isnt' much help.
> 
> I imagine that I need a *500-gph* bilge pump per side with a separate (or integrated) float switch. Since floor space is limited down there, I might go integrated. I have to get an old transducer off the floor on one side to mount a new one or I just have to put the transducer on the other side.
> 
> *Any comments on capacity and brand* would be helpful, as well as *where to mount the exit* hole on the stern, and *how to wire it*. I've looked this all up but I like discussion and hearing opinions. I've seen a diagram about the wiring that I found confusing that I'll share with you when I find it.


*Size - As big as you can fit !*

The smaller the boat the bigger pump you need.
500 GPM does not do much when you have water in your boat.


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## hawkman (May 19, 2018)

Here is the writing diagram I was curious about, taken from How To Wire A Boat | Beginners Guide With Diagrams | New Wire Marine:

It shows power from battery through an inline fuse I guess (even though image is of a blade), straight to the float switch, power continues on to the bilge pump. ALSO, power comes from the switch through the bus bar and is spliced into the power line between float and pump. It states: "Splice here puts manual bilge switch in parallel with the float switch so either can turn the pump on."

As a newbie, it _appears _that there will _always be power to the float switch.....*OOPS. I get it now. You always want power via float switch....\*_

Then, my question is: *do you need and on/off/on switch if you always have power to the float?* You would just need an on/off switch for manual use of pump? This way, it seems, prevents you from accidentally leaving it ALL OFF and your boat sinking at the harbor overnight.

While we are at it, _*do the two blade fuses in this diagram represent inline fuses with the other fuses implied by the switch panel and bus bar?*_ (maybe breakers there).


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## lemaymiami (Feb 9, 2007)

Item #1... I have two bilge pumps on my old Maverick skiff (16' 10") each one is 1100gph... since my skiff is not self- bailing... One is a standard pump with float switch and override, the other has no float and it's strictly a single switch on/off and is used as a backup (or to be able to pump at 2200gph in an emergency..). Each pump is separately wired, fused, switched, powered, and they even have separate plumbing / through-hulls... I've been swamped out on one occasion over the years with eight inches of water on top of my deck.. and with both pumps working was dry again in about five minutes... That's some serious pumping power - but once again - my hull isn't self-bailing...

Item #2... that diagram is just fine - but a bit overly complicated since it's showing two batteries and not explaining the fine points... In essence a properly set up bilge pump with a float switch has power coming to a switch (after passing through a fuse or circuit breaker - then the switch (a three way on - off - then on again) allows you to choose whether you want the pump working only after the float switch trips or whether you want the pump to turn on - right now... without waiting for a float switch that might not be working properly... One more thing about switches it's very very handy if whatever switch you install also has an idiot light (red for bilge pumps) so you'll know at a glance if your pump is coming on - or if you've left the switch on... When you look at a basic wiring diagram it's a bit simpler to rig out properly... What you can't change is the size of your pump once it's installed without cutting and fitting the new one with greater capacity... All of that is on land - out on the water you'll want as much pump as you can install if your hull is taking on water... 

Item #3... Not familiar with your hull - if water gets into it, is it trapped on one side of the hull or other.. or is water able to flow from one side or the other (where a single pump would be able to sort you out) - or are two pumps mandatory...? Remember as well that wherever you install that pump (almost always as close to the stern as possible and at the lowest point on the hull...) it has to be where water in your hull can reach it and the bilge hose needs to be the largest size that fits (avoid those cheap corrugated plastic hoses - they don't last very long at all) , and lastly, the through hull where the water will pump out.. needs to be far enough above the water line that you're never in danger of it allowing water to come into your hull... I have seen some hulls that trap water at one place or another - not allowing it to flow back to where your motor is (the heavy end of the boat..). 

Item #4... If I remember correctly every Rule pump (pretty good pumps...) comes with a good, simple wiring diagram on the back of the package. They also sell a three way switch with a light just for their pumps... Might be a good starting point... just do your best to insure that every wiring connection from pump to wherever your switch(s) are as much above any waterline as possible - and any wiring you need for that entire pump installation is tinned copper and also the same size as the wiring that comes with your pump... 

Hope this helps... "aren't boats fun?"


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## hawkman (May 19, 2018)

*please forgive the last photo. I took it after returning from a fishing trip where I travelled down a long dirt road to get to the ramp! *



lemaymiami said:


> Item #1... I have two bilge pumps on my old Maverick skiff (16' 10") each one is 1100gph... since my skiff is not self- bailing... One is a standard pump with float switch and override, the other has no float and it's strictly a single switch on/off and is used as a backup... That's some serious pumping power - but once again - my hull isn't self-bailing...


I like it. I don't think I've got that much room (floorspace) or clearance (height) below deck in the bilge for that. I'll see.
My hull is not self-bailing either. More on that later.



lemaymiami said:


> Item #2...In essence, a properly set up bilge pump with a float switch has power coming to a switch (after passing through a fuse or circuit breaker - then the switch (a three way on - off - then on again) allows you to choose whether you want the pump working only after the float switch trips or whether you want the pump to turn on - right now...
> 
> ...One more thing about switches it's very very handy if whatever switch you install also has an idiot light (red for bilge pumps) so you'll know at a glance if your pump is coming on - or if you've left the switch on...


If you have a rocker switch with on-off-on positioning (one for float and one for manual on), will the light remain OFF if the float is down when set to the float side of the switch or will those switches light up regardless of which ON position its in, regardless of power flowing through the circuit? That's be cool.



lemaymiami said:


> Item #3... Not familiar with your hull - if water gets into it, is it trapped on one side of the hull or other.. or is water able to flow from one side or the other (where a single pump would be able to sort you out) - or are two pumps mandatory...? Remember as well that wherever you install that pump (almost always as close to the stern as possible and at the lowest point on the hull...) it has to be where water in your hull can reach it and the bilge hose needs to be the largest size that fits (avoid those cheap corrugated plastic hoses - they don't last very long at all) , and lastly, the through hull where the water will pump out.. needs to be far enough above the water line that you're never in danger of it allowing water to come into your hull... I have seen some hulls that trap water at one place or another - not allowing it to flow back to where your motor is (the heavy end of the boat..).


I'd say the* two sides are independent* of each other. There MAY be a way for water to get across but not in conditions you'd want to be in! (like bow down at 45-deg angle!).
I access the bilge area through a round inspection cover. I'm putting a larger one in now and on both sides. They put it in only to install a transducer! At that point, there is only *six inches of height/clearance* in the bilge. It is *12 inches wide at the most. Not a lot of room for anything, let alone two bilge pumps per side and a transducer... :|

The day I bought the boat. You can see how narrow the two bilge areas are: 12 inches across at the stern.*

















*(Took this pic after returning from a boat ramp located down a long dirt road)
The floor of the boat has two scuppers in the aft corners. One is visible in the far corner, just beyond that rod rack you see here. I keep plugs in them when on the water b/c they sit below the waterline!!!. So, not self-bailing. Water in this part of the boat does not reach the bilge. It all comes from leaks.*









*This is what you see in my bilge in the current inspection hole. *I'd like to remove the old transducer but I have hardly any room to maneuver there. I'm increasing the hole size to 8 inches or so, but still... how do I get that old piece of junk out with all that epoxy in there? I've removed the wires.


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## hawkman (May 19, 2018)

A pic to show you what I mean about water not getting from the floor to the bilge. I accidentally left the scupper plugs in after a trip home, I guess. Got a gully-washer of rain and found the 'tub' full of water. Oh hey, my boat was cleaner.


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## Shallows (Mar 29, 2020)

hawkman said:


> I've always got enough water in my hull(s) when I come out of the water that it'd give me the peace of mind to have them.


How exactly are you getting water into a fiberglass hull?!


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## hawkman (May 19, 2018)

Shallows said:


> How exactly are you getting water into a fiberglass hull?!


I haven't found the leak but water can get in through the top hatch into the storage area/battery compartment, which does drain into the bilge. However, leaving the plugs open with boat tilted back lets that water out. (The hatch door/lid, has a folded-over lip all the way around that sits in a channel in the deck. If the boat is tilted bow-down in the driveway, the water would follow that channel and drain into the floor (see most recent photo). However, it wouldn't drain out of the scuppers. When it's tilted bow-up, then the water fills the channel and eventually overflows into the storage area/bilge.)

There IS a lot of silicone plastered on the back of the hull around the rub-rail. I haven't dared take the rail off yet but it's worth a look-see.

I DID have my son put the plugs in and fill the boat with water using a hose. I expected to see a leak from the through-hull for the livewell or around the plugs themselves, but nope. I had to go to work so I had him sit there until he saw something or until I deemed the boat too full! He said it did leak at the rubrail. Not sure if that would be normal or if that joint is sealed. During this experiment, I had the boat tilted bow-up. I'd be curious to try it bow-DOWN and see if there's a spot (the keep strip?) that water may be getting into. The boat does sit low in the water but not so low that the rub-rail is in the water! There's a LOT of spray from the trim tabs that splashes toward the boat but that can't be it either.

The keel strip *IS damaged. *I need to look at that and replace it.


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## lx-88 (2 mo ago)

For me, water came in from two places.

1. a bilge drain housing was letting water in around the edges. Unscrewing it and resealing with semi-permanent silicon sealer worked.
2. The bilge pump outlet hoses would fill when coming off plane and let water out though the bilge because there aren't any check valves. I added a good quality check-valve on each hose.

Both issues together yielded a bone dry bilge after a full day. Before that I had a ton of water in the bilge (10-20 seconds of draining through bilge plugs).


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## jonny (May 1, 2007)

I’ve seen people drill holes in the corners of the cockpit. Straight into the bottom of the hull. Don’t know if I would recommend this. Because there’s a lot going on under that deck. Not exactly sure what they are trying to work around. And the three I have opened up had floatation foam damming water flow up. I think I have a pic somewhere still of the last one I did stringers on. I will try dig up. And you can see what’s underneath which may help you.

I have also seen water leak through the keel strip. The screws they used go all the way inside the hull. So definitely pull that off and seal it with some 4200. But that should not let a bunch of water in.


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## jonny (May 1, 2007)

Found it
You can see the hole in the back. They had filled the original hole with Marinetex or something.

Is there a hose to your cockpit drain going to the bilge now?

And get under it and push on the hull bottom to see if your stringers are busted lose. This customer’s left MBG with unbonded stringers from day one. And he had already paid a guy $3500 to fix them. All that low life did was open a big hole on the starboard side. And slapped some roving up the side of the stringer. I cut the whole floor out. Added two layers of 1708 to the hull. And built three new stringers for $3600. I don’t think I charge enough😂


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## jonny (May 1, 2007)

Unbonded area from the factory 😩


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## jonny (May 1, 2007)

All fixed👍
you can see the grey patched area in this pic.
What you can’t see is my repair😉


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