# 7-8 wt shoot out Rod, Reel, and line.



## krash (Jan 9, 2007)

I'd like to see a shoot out on lower end fly setups. I know last year there was some post on inexpensive chineese reels, how did they hold up ?

What is a good enough to get the job done, inshore flats 7wt size, fly-reel in the $100.00 price point range ?


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## 994 (Apr 14, 2008)

krash said:


> I'd like to see a shoot out on lower end fly setups. I know last year there was some post on inexpensive chineese reels, how did they hold up ?
> 
> What is a good enough to get the job done, inshore flats 7wt size, well fly-reel in the $100.00 price point range ?


Check out the Redington Crosswater.


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## Backwater (Dec 14, 2014)

IMO, I think Trident only test products that they carry. So it's a bias shootout.

In your post, you keep saying.... "We!" Who is the "We?"


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## Timucua_Outdoors (Oct 15, 2016)

By “We” I mean the people who want to give feed back to some what determine the best set up.


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## Rick hambric (Jun 24, 2017)

You truly need to do two classes. Below and above $500.00
Of course you need the new loomis, Helios, the new method, T&T Exocett, the salt hd, hardy, meridian, & echo.... (if someone wants another high end add here.)

Then the tfo mangrove and axiom2, the t&t zone, st croix, and what else is out there???

For reels,it’s hard to beat a tibor. Signature or Everglades. It doesn’t matter to me. Some rods need the extra weight.


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## bugslinger (Jun 4, 2012)

Clutch Arc7
Hatch 5+ 
SA Redfish Warm 

Thats my go to inshore set


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## Chaser88 (May 7, 2018)

I picked up a Lamson Guru reel, recommended by a couple guides down in the Florida Keys. I have it on a Moonshine 8wt rod. Combo came in at right around $500.


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## coconutgroves (Sep 23, 2013)

Rick hambric said:


> You truly need to do two classes. Below and above $500.00
> Of course you need the new loomis, Helios, the new method, T&T Exocett, the salt hd, hardy, meridian, & echo.... (if someone wants another high end add here.)
> 
> Then the tfo mangrove and axiom2, the t&t zone, st croix, and what else is out there???
> ...


I just had a Tibor fail on me for the first time ever. Drag would not completely tighten. I just sent it back 3 or 4 years ago to have it serviced, so I was surprised it had an issue. Turns out the drag knob bearings were worn out. I always loosed my drag all the way when I store them. Pretty disappointed in it - but I ended up changing it out during the trip for another Tibor that worked fine. This was during a trip for big tarpon - had a few that were beating me up pretty bad since I couldn't tighten it all the way down. Pics are on my instagram.

Long story short, I'll be getting a Nautilus Silver King soon for my next big tarpon trip.


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## TheAdamsProject (Oct 29, 2007)

I think picking setups geared for specific tasks, in multiple price points would be more helpful than any of the “shootouts” we have seen before. Might help new people pick something that would best suit their fishery or specific situation like mangrove snook or flood tide redfish as examples. Personally I am proud to be a Tibor guy knowing they dont send freebies to be featured in these circus shootouts. 

You might also need to do a 4wt Redfish shootout to help the up and coming Bros who think that using a 4wt for redfish makes them an elite FlyBoi.


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## Str8-Six (Jul 6, 2015)

The Behemoth 11/12 has served me very well on big tarpon. Faught fish right next to Nautilus and couldn’t notice a difference in the drag. At $129 it can’t be beat when it comes to bang for buck. I put that on a Scott Tidal I got for $350 and some Rio Tarpon line to keep it just above $500.

I’ve had my Pro series 2 now for about 7 years on a sage 2280. $170 for rod and I think $140 for reel. With SA bonefish line. This is a great starter setup. I’ve caught Reds, Bonefish, snook and tarpon on this setup and never had any issues. Last time I was out my buddy caught his biggest tarpon on fly which was around 70# on a 9wt Pro 2.

I would say best budget 8wt setup would be from my experience: Behemoth 7/8 reel
Tfo Pro 2
SA Bonefish line (love this line and worth the money)

Haven’t splurged enough to comment on the more expensive stuff. Maybe one day, for now I’ll keep catching fish on what I have.


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## backbone (Jan 4, 2016)

coconutgroves said:


> I just had a Tibor fail on me for the first time ever. Drag would not completely tighten. I just sent it back 3 or 4 years ago to have it serviced, so I was surprised it had an issue. Turns out the drag knob bearings were worn out. I always loosed my drag all the way when I store them. Pretty disappointed in it - but I ended up changing it out during the trip for another Tibor that worked fine. This was during a trip for big tarpon - had a few that were beating me up pretty bad since I couldn't tighten it all the way down. Pics are on my instagram.
> 
> Long story short, I'll be getting a Nautilus Silver King soon for my next big tarpon trip.


I got one of the Kings to try and up my street cred amongst the Hipsters, and it MAY of had 10lbs of drag cranked all the way down.
Make sure you try before you buy.
I'm back to Tibor The Pacific for all my big Poon adventures.


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## flyclimber (May 22, 2016)

Just an idea, coordinating would be the challenge, microskiff is a large community and if 10% of the members showed up in a location with their setups there could be hundreds of fly rods to throw at one time? Its similar to the shoot out trident puts out with the benefit of having the option bringing/testing out different lines. 

I should preface this by saying it would be a gentleman's agreement of you break you buy, keep your opinions to yourself, ect. 

I have a bucket list of rods I want to try with an even larger amount of lines, without the unlimited amount of funds/time for each!


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## Checkers (Jul 25, 2018)

In the 8wt category I rock a sage method as my go to rod and a tfo mangrove as back up. Love the mangrove for what it costs. 

As far as reels go, hatch 7+ I'd never skimp on a reel. Have had too many price point "saltwater" reels corrode.


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## Backwater (Dec 14, 2014)

Timucua_Outdoors said:


> By “We” I mean the people who want to give feed back to some what determine the best set up.


Everybody has opinions and will mainly praise the rod they happen to have or ended up with. But most haven't had the opportunity to cast and even fished everything or even most out there. So their opinion on what is the "best" is skewed just by that factor. So they lean on what they happen to be fishing with at that time and will tell everyone "this is the best!", but based on what?

If a true Shoot-out can be done, the following is what it would take to do such a thing;

For at least the rods, you'd have to have every single rod out there, made from all of the well known mfgs, be lined up together in one central location, with a variety of lines and the same weight reel or even several different reels with different weights (light, avg and heavier), with a panel of non-bias, seriously expert fly casters with a full understanding of the differences in rod nuances and casting dynamics, and be able to express those differences in a full report and chart, that people can understand and a rating system that everyone can agree on. I'm guessing a minimum of 12 professionals iwith the expertise in that field (and the "key" being non-bias towards one mgf to another). Then all the results being averaged across the board into a final report that most people would understand. Also, it would have to be with every rod weight rating, because some rods suck in a 5wt, but are beautiful in a 8wt, while others are like a club in a 10wt, but are a dream to cast in their 7wt version, respectively.

The participation and variables can almost be endless. However, no real mfg or organization will sponsor or endorse it. It's like I said where the AFFTA fly line weight guidelines need to be re-charted, but nobody is willing to do it and AFFTA will certainly not get involved for political reasons in the industry. And then, it changes every year where new rods, reels and fly lines come and go each year, so it would have to be an annual thing to be current and accurate.

Good luck with that one.  Believe me when I say I've been thinking about this for many, many years, but the hopes of putting something like this together, the right way, is a very large undertaking that nobody is willing to do. George Anderson himself personally told me his little shootouts he does can take over a month from start to finish, to do each one. Sure he profits from it in the end with residue traffic and business for his fly shop, but to do it in a non-bias method, would take months, lots of people to do the right way, with lots of expenses occurred, and who's going to lay out the dough to get it done each year? At this point, I have no idea who can really make that happen the way it needs to be done, especially without the funding. I for one would step up to the plate to volunteer, but AFFTA, FFI and some other non-boas fly rod industry guild(s) needs to help sponsor it and put it all together.

At this level down here in our measly little fly fish forum, I don't think there is much we can do in that dept, because there is too many people from too many different fly fishing backgrounds with too many different opinions with too many differences experience(s) with everything out there, all living and working in too many different places, to be able to come together with like minded opinions.

I hate to sound negative about it, but it's a sore subject for me.

Oh well.

Ted Haas


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## flyclimber (May 22, 2016)

@Backwater What if we did it as members with personal gear? I get having latest and greatest would be sweet but rather unfeasible.


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## Str8-Six (Jul 6, 2015)

To avoid multiple and biased opinions, everyone should just send me their rods and reels and I’ll test them and right up a report. I’ll send them all back when I’m done...... in a couple of years.


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## Rick hambric (Jun 24, 2017)

Well I can bring some t&t setups. 8,10,&12 all tibor. Let’s get it going!


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## flyclimber (May 22, 2016)

I have BVK 8 wt litespeed, sage motive 10wt and scott STS 9 & 12! Lets do it!


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## Backwater (Dec 14, 2014)




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## ifsteve (Jul 1, 2010)

Yeah so I am going to travel to do some rod testing instead of going fishing? I don't think so....lol


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## Timucua_Outdoors (Oct 15, 2016)

ifsteve said:


> Yeah so I am going to travel to do some rod testing instead of going fishing? I don't think so....lol


This was not meant to be a “meet up” I was thinking that this could be more of a discussion of what rods,reels, and line we think make a great set up. And if we could all agree on what set up is best we could have a “winner”. It is very unrealistic to get everyone together and have every fly rod, reel, and line on the market all in one place. That is not at all what I was trying to pull off. Just a little discussion of what rods line and reels we think make a good set up. Sorry for the misunderstanding.


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## ifsteve (Jul 1, 2010)

Timucua_Outdoors said:


> This was not meant to be a “meet up” I was thinking that this could be more of a discussion of what rods,reels, and line we think make a great set up. *And if we could all agree on what set up is best we could have a “winner”.* It is very unrealistic to get everyone together and have every fly rod, reel, and line on the market all in one place. That is not at all what I was trying to pull off. Just a little discussion of what rods line and reels we think make a good set up. Sorry for the misunderstanding.


Yeah like that will ever happen.....lol. Having guys post up how they use a certain rod/line combination and its pros and cons isn't a bad idea. It at least gives guys a starting point when looking to get something for themselves. But at the end of the day its still a dang crapshoot. So many variables in casters that you still gotta try before you buy. Or just buy and try then sell and move on to the next thing to try. The shops love that $$$$ LOL


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## 994 (Apr 14, 2008)

I take other peoples’ opinions on fly fishing gear with a boulder of salt. Lots of people have horrible mechanics and will have quadruple rotator cuff surgeries by the time they’re 50. It’s my opinion that it’s the casting that needs addressing, not the equipment. These graphite rods will handle grain weight fluctuations within 20-30 grains either direction. A proficient caster with fine tuned mechanics will throw a $100 combo with the same accuracy and distance as a $2000 combo. Look at Lefty casting 80’ with just the butt of a rod. Enough with the “shootouts” let’s work on mechanics.

By the way Timucua, you tie really nice flies!


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## ifsteve (Jul 1, 2010)

mosquitolaGOON said:


> I take other peoples’ opinions on fly fishing gear with a boulder of salt. Lots of people have horrible mechanics and will have quadruple rotator cuff surgeries by the time they’re 50. It’s my opinion that it’s the casting that needs addressing, not the equipment. These graphite rods will handle grain weight fluctuations within 20-30 grains either direction. *A proficient caster with fine tuned mechanics will throw a $100 combo with the same accuracy and distance as a $2000 combo*. Look at Lefty casting 80’ with just the butt of a rod. Enough with the “shootouts” let’s work on mechanics.
> 
> By the way Timucua, you tie really nice flies!


Your overall point is spot on. However, the highlighted part is quite debatable.


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## Caleb.Esparza (Jan 31, 2016)

nativejax said:


> I think picking setups geared for specific tasks, in multiple price points would be more helpful than any of the “shootouts” we have seen before. Might help new people pick something that would best suit their fishery or specific situation like mangrove snook or flood tide redfish as examples. Personally I am proud to be a Tibor guy knowing they dont send freebies to be featured in these circus shootouts.
> 
> You might also need to do a 4wt Redfish shootout to help the up and coming Bros who think that using a 4wt for redfish makes them an elite FlyBoi.


Get out of here with your truths Chris! And lol to the 3/4wt gheenoe crew out there abusing redfish in the summer heat. Anything for a prostaff hat am I right?


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## BayStYat (Sep 12, 2012)

Ahhhhh. the bench press thread. they come up every few weeks. fly fishing has turned into look at me I am cool with all my gear and accessories. kinda like the way women compete with each other about purses and shoes. sad really


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## GulfCoast (Jul 10, 2012)

BayStYat said:


> Ahhhhh. the bench press thread. they come up every few weeks. fly fishing has turned into look at me I am cool with all my gear and accessories. kinda like the way women compete with each other about purses and shoes. sad really


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## Fishtex (May 10, 2014)

What kind of shoes will make you cast a hundred feet and look cool.....probably need to start a new thread....


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## BayStYat (Sep 12, 2012)

Fishtex said:


> What kind of shoes will make you cast a hundred feet and look cool.....probably need to start a new thread....


Think about it. How did this guy in the 1960s catch this fish? He don’t have the new release 2018 3rd quarter sage (insert name here) rod, latest reel that will last 1200 years that cost $1000.000, cool boat that drafts 1/2 inch (love them threads by the way), hats, buffs, bocas, instagram, Facebook, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc. 

Flyfishing is now nothing more than like getting buff at the gym. If you ain’t got the look, you ain’t a fly fisherman. I am convinced the pictures of people catching fish 50 years ago is in the Matrix. This forum taught me that it ain’t possible without 2018 gear. Mandela effect.


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## ifsteve (Jul 1, 2010)

That fly reel looks to be a anti reverse Seamaster and back then THAT was a 2018 $1000 reel!


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## BayStYat (Sep 12, 2012)

ifsteve said:


> That fly reel looks to be a anti reverse Seamaster and back then THAT was a 2018 $1000 reel!


Yes, and to catch a fish like that takes a $1000 reel. Most people are catching slot redfish.


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## GulfCoast (Jul 10, 2012)

true...... and just saying, the only reason yeti makes 50$ dog bowls and 250$ backpacks now is because of the social media “geared up” fashion show. 

i wish fly fishing was humble and nostalgic like it once was . but....... those days are long gone.


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## Fishtex (May 10, 2014)

GulfCoast said:


> true...... and just saying, the only reason yeti makes 50$ dog bowls and 250$ backpacks now is because of the social media “geared up” fashion show.
> 
> i wish fly fishing was humble and nostalgic like it once was . but....... those days are long gone.


Lay off Yeti, they were a client, I work in Engineering and design, they do sweat the details like few do, and I do appreciate those who do, it just costs more, you don’t have to buy it, but sometimes it’s nice to get something really good.


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## GulfCoast (Jul 10, 2012)

Fishtex said:


> Lay off Yeti, they were a client, I work in Engineering and design, they do sweat the details like few do, and I do appreciate those who do, it just costs more, you don’t have to buy it, but sometimes it’s nice to get something really good.


evidently you didn’t understand my comment and i prolly shoulda kept my mouth shut from the beginning but i’ll clarify for you.
here,
no one attacked yeti cap’. hats off to them and their marketing scheme. the fact is, yeti can make those things because they will sell. that’s because of the “gear collecting look at me name labels on social media” experiment that we are living in. 
the twilight zone....
thanks for the reply though


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## BayStYat (Sep 12, 2012)

Fishtex said:


> Lay off Yeti, they were a client, I work in Engineering and design, they do sweat the details like few do, and I do appreciate those who do, it just costs more, you don’t have to buy it, but sometimes it’s nice to get something really good.


Who owns yeti now?


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## Backwater (Dec 14, 2014)

Timucua_Outdoors said:


> This was not meant to be a “meet up” I was thinking that this could be more of a discussion of what rods,reels, and line we think make a great set up. And if we could all agree on what set up is best we could have a “winner”. It is very unrealistic to get everyone together and have every fly rod, reel, and line on the market all in one place. That is not at all what I was trying to pull off. Just a little discussion of what rods line and reels we think make a good set up. Sorry for the misunderstanding.


Again, you have different takes (different opinions) on what a great casting rod can be with each person. Variables differ with each person, including, targeted species and conditions where they fish them, experience, casting techniques and so forth.

Tell us how many years you've been fly fishing the salt? You may only have 3 yrs fly casting experience, while someone else may have 30yrs experience. How does create equal opinions. You may only cast to freshwater bass and trout, while the next guy surf cast to stripers and large bluefish. So many difference in people with so many different opinions on what is good or not.


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## Backwater (Dec 14, 2014)

ifsteve said:


> Your overall point is spot on. However, the highlighted part is quite debatable.


Let's go.... I have a retail $149 fly rod that I keep for certain reasons. Get the average caster out there with the most expensive rod they can find to help allegedly improve their casting. Then let's go head to head on distance and accuracy. MosquitolaGOON has a valid point.


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## Backwater (Dec 14, 2014)

Fishtex said:


> What kind of shoes will make you cast a hundred feet and look cool.....probably need to start a new thread....


 Stilettos 

But personally, I prefer the barefoot method. 









Ahh yes.... Joan was a babe back in her day!


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## ifsteve (Jul 1, 2010)

For those who would like to get back to the days when fly fishing was more gentlemanly and humble etc. No doubt it is worse today with the advent of the internet and social media. And while those things have their value they certainly have their downside!

But I worked in a well known fly shop in the early 70s. And I can tell you that there was plenty of had to have the latest name stuff and had to look the part on the stream going on way back then almost 50 years ago. The difference is that advertising was much more local and not all over social media like today.

But here's the difference between then and today. Back then there were a heck of a lot less people on the water especially flinging flies in the salt! And back then most everybody learned from a close relative or family friend and the ethics were passed along with the actual learning to fly fish. Today a lot of people pick up their sport of choice (this is limited to fly fishing by any means) from the internet. There is nothing wrong with that but what happens then is that the focus on the learning is the actual mechanics of fishing. Time isn't spent on the other aspects.


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## RunningOnEmpty (Jun 20, 2015)

Backwater said:


> Stilettos
> 
> But personally, I prefer the barefoot method.
> View attachment 36332
> ...


That's the Echo logo


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## ifsteve (Jul 1, 2010)

Backwater said:


> Let's go.... I have a retail $149 fly rod that I keep for certain reasons. Get the average caster out there with the most expensive rod they can find to help allegedly improve their casting. Then let's go head to head on distance and accuracy. MosquitolaGOON has a valid point.


Two points Ted. 
1. First off my comment was general in nature. Even really good casters will not do as well with low end stuff as better stuff. Are there exceptions? Sure. Especially for a specific individual where a certain rod may just be perfect for their cast. But in general I stand by my comment.
2. The poster said a $100 outfit. A $149 rod is a bit different. Plus when did you buy that $149 rod? Last year or 10 years ago? So please show me your $100 *outfit* and lets have a go.....And for the record I wouldn't put my casting "skills" in any competition....LOL


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## Rick hambric (Jun 24, 2017)

Backwater said:


> Stilettos
> 
> But personally, I prefer the barefoot method.
> View attachment 36332
> ...


She was a babe and could sling a silk line like it was nobody’s business!!! I tried a circa 1960 rod once with a silk line just for fun...: let’s just say going from a (then) st croix legend x to that was comical.... form and timing has to be perfect!!!! Most of us don’t realize how much we get away with thanks to the technology we have nowadays..


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## krash (Jan 9, 2007)

I think the poster used an example of a $100.00 reel, and he might go $150.00. Even at that price point we are talking with a matching priced rod at $150.00, backing $10-$30, and a 7wf line at $90.00 we are over $300.00 to enter the hobby and that's without tippet or flies.... but the poster is still reading and appreciate's all the comments.

Wish I still had my dad's old split bamboo setup.


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## Backwater (Dec 14, 2014)

ifsteve said:


> That fly reel looks to be a anti reverse Seamaster and back then THAT was a 2018 $1000 reel!


And we didn't still get it done with reels less than that, with click and pawl drags and palming reel spools? Not everyone owned a SeaMaster or a Wedding Cake.


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## Backwater (Dec 14, 2014)

ifsteve said:


> 2. The poster said a $100 outfit. A $149 rod is a bit different. Plus when did you buy that $149 rod? Last year or 10 years ago? So please show me your $100 *outfit* and lets have a go.....And for the record I wouldn't put my casting "skills" in any competition....LOL


M...laGOON did say "$100 outfit," tho hard to find these days. I can buy one from China still. Bass Pro, Cabelas and Redington all made $99-$119 outfits that were decent enough to make it happen, cast a decent fly line loop and catch fish. I've also watched guys with $2000 outfits that couldn't hit the broad side of a barn 50ft away. Point is, good casting techniques can find the sweet spots in most outfits and can still become proficient in casting them. But spending $1000's more on technology doesn't make you a better caster, just hides some of your flaws a little better. 

So to the audience reading this, my advice is, tune up your casting and fighting techniques and you may just be fine with that outfit(s) you have instead of rushing out to buy the latest and greatest to try to skip the most important step, which is to improve your casting skills. 

In the mean time, I'll look for that $100 outfit at today's prices and let you know what I think.


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## GulfCoast (Jul 10, 2012)

ifsteve said:


> For those who would like to get back to the days when fly fishing was more gentlemanly and humble etc. No doubt it is worse today with the advent of the internet and social media. And while those things have their value they certainly have their downside!
> 
> But I worked in a well known fly shop in the early 70s. And I can tell you that there was plenty of had to have the latest name stuff and had to look the part on the stream going on way back then almost 50 years ago. The difference is that advertising was much more local and not all over social media like today.
> 
> But here's the difference between then and today. Back then there were a heck of a lot less people on the water especially flinging flies in the salt! And back then most everybody learned from a close relative or family friend and the ethics were passed along with the actual learning to fly fish. Today a lot of people pick up their sport of choice (this is limited to fly fishing by any means) from the internet. There is nothing wrong with that but what happens then is that the focus on the learning is the actual mechanics of fishing. Time isn't spent on the other aspects.


i couldn’t agree more. although i was born in 80, i respect the fact that years ago technology was evolving into getting more efficient and longer lasting tools for the job. today it is as well but the “who’s got what and what label is better than yours” mentality is, like you said, in the forefront rather then the actual foundation and mechanics of the sport. learning something every time you step on the water is something very few know how to do anymore, and what’s crazy is, it’s free........ 
when i was 11-12 years old my dads friend and his sons were minimalist when it came to throwing big flies at big south louisiana redfish. i always had a lot of respect for that. but they did have the right tools for the job. and i learned a lot cause i listened. as a kid every time i went into the fly tying room i would look at the orvis reels and sage rods wishing i could afford them. but, my dad was even more a minimalist so Shakespear Eagle Claw and a 25$ Martin click drag reel had to get the job done....... hahahah 
but yeah, again i do agree with ya and don’t hate anyone for enjoying what’s fun, cause it surely is. but i guess the respect for how something originated will always overide what’s cool and hip in my book. cause “originality” in today’s world is some silly..... well you know. 
Peace Steve


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## Shadowcast (Feb 26, 2008)

Clutch Core 7 wt.
Nautilus XL
Royal Wulff Bermuda Shorts 7 wt. line
For a $300 rod, the Clutch Core is overbuilt and under-priced. Shoots like a cannon!


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## krash (Jan 9, 2007)

So what's peoples thoughts on the Sage 2200 series reel... 2280 in particular ?


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## Str8-Six (Jul 6, 2015)

krash said:


> So what's peoples thoughts on the Sage 2200 series reel... 2280 in particular ?


I fished one pretty hard for 7 years(only fly reel). Caught everything from bones to little tarpon on it. It works fine just not the first reel I’d get for the money. Very low outgoing drag sound and drag isn’t as smooth as others. I’d get a Behemoth, actually I did and I like it a lot better.


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## BayStYat (Sep 12, 2012)

Str8-Six said:


> I fished one pretty hard for 7 years(only fly reel). Caught everything from bones to little tarpon on it.


not possible. 

/sarcasm


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## krash (Jan 9, 2007)

Ok so after lots of procrastination.. Almost pulled the trigger on the Sage 2280 which Sage has on sale for $95.00, it was a toss up against the Behemoth 7/8 knocking on the door bigger and heavier with a better drag at $109.99. but the demon's in my head said go better and you won't have to look back, decided on what I thought will be a better option cause I do get into the hard charging Bonefish and ordered an Orvis Hydros SL found a 15% discount and got it for under $200.00 free 2 day delivery... waiting for the UPS truck now.

Thx, for all the advice, and sorry if I hi-jacked this thread..


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