# Downsides of aluminum hulls?



## SClay115 (May 18, 2009)

Just curious, I've never owned one, so I'm curious. I don't see many of them out there, so I'm wondering if there was a big reason why. 

I was doing some boat ramp watching today, some family was in town. And a group floated up in a Hewes Tailfisher, I didn't know what it was at the time, only that it was a Hewes. But what I DID know, was that it shared a lot of hull design characteristics with some of the tinny boats I see for sale. 

A quick search at home revealed the boat's model name, and that on the used market, they are being listed for a considerable amount. So I got to thinking, with the one forum member that is putting together a Tracker on here, and the fact that the front end of the Tailfisher looks like the front end of a Tracker hull, I was wondering if you could really put together a shallow drafting, quiet, poling skiff, that would be basically bulletproof. 

Thoughts? 

Steve


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## Mike_Poczik (Jan 24, 2010)

I have a G3 1448 and the true flat bottom
Shallow draft - yes
Quiet - not as quiet as glass but doable
Poling- ?? poles great from the front while flounder gigging, 
never poled it from the rear
Bulletproof- doubt it would stand up to a bullet but takes oysters, logs, stumps and rocks and looks for more.

Mine is very lightly modded, basically added seats, lights, motor and trolling motor.


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## mark_gardner (Mar 18, 2009)

hard to beat an aluminum hull for durability but they are a bit more noisy than glass and the usually darker colors on a jon get hot as heck  during the mid day sun in the warmer months


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

Some of the turn off are the noise and that they can heat up alot. I was set to buy another one a while back, but the main thing that turned me off was the durability. I'm not refering to bouncing off oysters and rocks, I mean the welds or rivets. I've had jon boats for bass fishing, still have one down south, and they all seemed to get leaks after a few years. Mine were all riveted, but I've heard the same about welded jons too. 

Basically most small aluminum boats are made for lakes and streams, and not to run a chop where they will be subject to fatigue and stress that a fiberglass boat would take better.

That being said, some of the better aluminum boats are made of thicker material and hold up much better. I have a friend with a G3 that he has been beating on for years.


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## tbutler (Dec 16, 2008)

I had a Tracker Backcountry 16 many years ago when I lived in Satellite Beach, and fished it extensively in Mosquito Lagoon and IRL. There is definitely hull slap when poling into a ripple or chop. I would counter that by drifting downwind through the area I intended to fish. I now have a different jon (Lowe 1652 VT tunnel hull that I bought about a year ago to use as a combination bass / flats boat. I opted for aluminum due to the oysters where I now live in NC. I think unless you take it offshore into heavy chop, the weld durability should not be an issue.


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## SClay115 (May 18, 2009)

Well, a thought on that, what about seam sealer to keep the thing from springing leaks? I just think it'd be pretty interesting, they seam inexpensive, durable, and the way I see it, a blank slate. 

While the colors are dark, one could easily refinish one, add some decks, seal up the seams, and probably come out about say, 12k$ shy of a used Tailfisher. And not that the Hewes is the only comparison, I am just using it since it, to me, resembles a metal Tracker hull. 

This is all just conjecture, and I'm just brainstorming. Always thinking ahead!

Steve


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## Salty_South (Feb 25, 2009)

My buddy has a welded jon, I think a tracker that is decked out and very flats worthy.  It does slap but it takes chop better than my Gheenoe and floats pretty shallow.  It doesn't pole half bad unless there is any wind.  If you wanted to go for a hull that could do it all and get the crap beat out of it, than go for it!


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

A welded aluminum is very hard to beat for the value. Extremely tough and durable. The only downside is that customizing them is more difficult than a fiberglass craft. 

Look around for the model that fits as close to what you want so the customization will be minimal and go for it.


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## WhiteDog70810 (May 6, 2008)

I have used a lot of aluminum boats and they are great. The fact that this subject comes up so frequently means that the advantages of aluminum and the advantages of FG pretty much equal each other out on average and you'll be happy with whatever you get so long as the hull design fits your use and your budget. The material is a secondary priority. All boats, aluminum or FG or wood or kevlar, eventually require repairs/modifications. I like FG because I can fix it and modify it by myself in my garage without learning to heliarc. Most of us can't fix aluminum stress fractures on our own.

Forget the seam sealer in an aluminum boat unless you are trying to hold a POS together for one more year. It will add unnecessary weight to a good hull. You want to see the leak so you can fix the fracture that caused it. A stress fracture in an aluminum hull will not end a trip. You bilge pump will just kick on a few times. Anything big enough to end a trip won't be stopped by seam sealer.

Nate


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## kwhite108 (Apr 12, 2011)

While it is not typical to see aluminum jon's in use in New England salt water, aluminum V and mod V hulls are a dime a dozen up here...and you would be amazed at how much a beat down 20 year old 14-16 foot beater will fetch. The bottom line is they are cheap to run due to the low weight and they can take an unbelievable beating.


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## boggob (Feb 20, 2007)

I came very close to buying a used one of these:
http://www.gregorboats.com/alaskan_baja.htm

Seems like aluminum would be louder - hull slap.
You would need be vigilant for galvanic corrosion and pitting.


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## SClay115 (May 18, 2009)

Well this isn't something I would be doing soon honestly, I was just looking more for a discussion, but it's certainly something I am going to keep in mind. 

I do wonder though, is a metal hull physically more weight than a FG hull of the same size? Shooting from the hip, I'd say yes, but then again...maybe not, since you do not need as much material to be as strong...

Steve


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

On the upside...
Lightweight, strong, durable, inexpensive, recycleable material.
Doesn't need a lot of horsepower to push, so fuel consumption is kept down.

On the downside...
Lightweight (makes for rougher ride), noisy hull, 
major repairs need to be done by a welder.

But, compare initial cost, minimal maintenance, no finish worries
ease of transportation and the fact that they catch just as many fish
explains why I'm looking at them very seriously for my next hull.

                                          

Also, rivet leaks can be solved with a ball peen hammer and a backing dolly.
Dolly held to the loosened rivet on the outside of the hull
hammer taps the rivet on the inside and tightens it up.
Yeah, been there, done that a few times.


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## jeross (Jun 6, 2009)

Aluminum is lighter versus the same size hull in fiberglass. The positives seem obvious, but on the down side it means that you'll blow around easier in the wind. I have a hard time fishing solo on windy days (I need a buddy to hold down the bow).

Modding is also more difficult. Cutting aluminum braces and patterns and riveting together a floor, seat, well or whatever is pretty exacting. If you don't get it just right you won't like the result. With fiberglass you can hide a multitude of sins.

Patching holes and leaks isn't as easy on an aluminum hull. This means that you'll think long and hard before drilling a hole.

Paint is your enemy and your friend. It can make the interior cooler or hotter, easier to clean or hard to keep presentable.

Overall, I love my tinny and it is well suited to my needs.


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## Woodie (Jun 20, 2008)

I think it depends on where you fish the most. Rocks, oysters, stumps, shallows included, then metal is the way. Nice pretty sand and grass bottoms, FG all the way.

I feel metal for me.


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## Mike_Poczik (Jan 24, 2010)

Well said Redbelly


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## Andrewp (Jul 23, 2010)

Anybody with aluminum hulls ever spray Rhino lining in the inside of the boat to help with noise and heat/slip issues? I figure it would add some (probably significant) weight, but wondered if the results were worth it .....


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## SClay115 (May 18, 2009)

> I think it depends on where you fish the most.  Rocks, oysters, stumps, shallows included, then metal is the way.  Nice pretty sand and grass bottoms, FG all the way.
> 
> I feel metal for me.


Well, it seems like you'd want toughness regardless of where you fish, and what you'll run into. Sort of like insurance, sure, you may never need to cash in when your car gets pummeled by hail, but you are sure glad you have it when you need it. Same with this, yea, you may never run over an oyster bar, or slam into something submerged just under the surface...well, you can see where this is going.

I find all this feedback really fascinating, as I truly assumed metal boats were relegated to the "Jon boat" category and were in general not really considered to be a choice for most saltwater anglers. Maybe it's the olive drab paint on the hulls so commonly seen at Bass pro? 

But on the issue of weight, well, why not add some? After some looking into these metal hulls, not many are really, in my opinion, properly equipped to deal with my needs. So let's get some different materials co-existing here! What's to say you can't add a false floor on top of the metal stringers, not only giving you something to attach a nonskid surface to, but also giving you an airspace to run some chase tubes in. I mean, I won't deny the ease of modifying a fiberglass hull, but to have that extra durability underneath your feet might be nice when you are running in unknown waters, or whatever the case may be, like whenever you run over the submerged Volkswagen that you never knew was there. 

So you can end up with a floor that you can 'glass to, modify as you wish(without a welder), and a hull that can take a lickin'. 

I'd like to also add, despite my limited fiberglass knowledge(built some motorcycle seat pans in the past), I honestly believe metal is easier to work with than fiberglass. While fiberglass is nice in the regard that it can be formed into all sorts of fun shapes without much effort. It is, in a word, expensive. The chemicals, the hard materials, the sometimes impossible cleanup. It's great, and it does a fantastic job for what it is. But metal stock is quite cheap. And buy a decent welder once, and you are good to go for more than likely forever...and honestly, for building/modifying/tinkering with anything, things are 10000% easier when you have the skills, and tools, to be able to do your own welding. With that said, you would find many, many other reasons to use it, and it would more than likely pay for itself in a short time. 

Just my two cents. 

Steve


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## hunter4626 (Aug 7, 2016)

SClay115 said:


> Well, it seems like you'd want toughness regardless of where you fish, and what you'll run into. Sort of like insurance, sure, you may never need to cash in when your car gets pummeled by hail, but you are sure glad you have it when you need it. Same with this, yea, you may never run over an oyster bar, or slam into something submerged just under the surface...well, you can see where this is going.
> 
> I find all this feedback really fascinating, as I truly assumed metal boats were relegated to the "Jon boat" category and were in general not really considered to be a choice for most saltwater anglers. Maybe it's the olive drab paint on the hulls so commonly seen at Bass pro?
> 
> ...


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## hunter4626 (Aug 7, 2016)

A friend of mine did use the rhino liner on his jon- it was a "knock-off"product,but it was sprayed on,had a sandy type feel,and was an ice blue type of color.Its still on there,seems to keep the rivets from leaking, is comfortable to walk on in the Florida sun and is not slippery,even if you drop a snotty hardhead on the deck.


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## Indoman (Jul 25, 2013)

To fix a hot deck - I used white Rustolem Professional Enamel from Home Depot on my last jon boat with excellent results. Taped off the deck, scuffed with a Scotchbright pad, cleaned with alcohol and rolled it on. For non skid I sprinkled playground sand on after each coat. 3 coats out of a pint (16' boat). Had maybe $25 in it and it looked like a factory job. Held up very well.


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## Vertigo (Jun 3, 2012)

Boat choice should not be a question of aluminum vs. fiberglass. A choice should be made on the basis of where and how the boat will be used and budget. If you operate mostly in shallow flat water with rocks and oyster bars an aluminum hull will be more durable and probably less expensive than fiberglass. If you operate mostly in deeper water with big waves, then you'll find that most of the boats that fit that bill are fiberglass and that larger, aluminum deep-v hulls are very expensive. If you want a true technical poling skiff fiberglass is typically the choice because of the difficulty shaping aluminum to avoid hull-slap and noise. Different horses for different courses.


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## Backwater (Dec 14, 2014)

My 2 cents worth on the OP's original question....

Noise and electrolysis!


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## CurtisWright (May 9, 2012)

Literally everything. There is not a single property that it excels in.


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## Vertigo (Jun 3, 2012)

CurtisWright said:


> Literally everything. There is not a single property that it excels in.


Run your new glass boat onto a limestone rock and then tell me it's better than aluminum. 

There are optimum materials and construction methods for every application. Aluminum is good for some, glass for some, wood for some. As I said above, horses for courses.


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## Backwater (Dec 14, 2014)

Vertigo said:


>


Vertigo, how do you pole that thing??


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## CurtisWright (May 9, 2012)

Vertigo said:


> Run your new glass boat onto a limestone rock and then tell me it's better than aluminum.
> 
> There are optimum materials and construction methods for every application. Aluminum is good for some, glass for some, wood for some. As I said above, horses for courses.


That boat isn't crashing into limestone. 

But I did run my boat into a piece of 2x2 angle iron the other day. It went straight through the outer skin and into the foam then stopped before it got to the inner skin. Thank goodness I wasn't in an aluminum boat because I would have put a hole straight through it. 

I took it home, let it dry, ground out the hole, glassed it, gelcoat, then faired it out in a day. 

Next time your out west check out all the drift boats going down the river and smashing into limestone rocks. Let me know when you see an aluminum one.


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## LowHydrogen (Dec 31, 2015)

If I still lived and fished Yankeetown North to Wacasassa or an equally rocky area, I wouldn't have anything else. There's really no point in a rounded bow chine dead silent boat if you're going to be crunching it along a bar every half hour (oysters are louder on aluminum but they're still plenty loud on glass). 

If you go alum, there are a few techniques you can use to quiet a alum boat when poling, not much you can do about the noise when running esp in a chop. It's not going to run all the fish off if you're conscious of it's limitations, but it'll still never be as quiet as a purpose built poling skiff.

If possible, set up and drift your intended path with the boat sitting "beam to" or in the trough of the chop. Just using the pole to control your speed.
Pole stern first, the loudest attitude of an alum jon boat is with the chop compressing or slapping "bow to" under the rake of the bow, this also transmits the most vibration to the water and then the fish.
Cut solid board foam insulation and fit it tightly between the ribs of the boat, then install alum or wood decking over the top, you'll be surprised how much quieter it gets.
When poling stern first get the motor completely free of the water, it creates a little pocket on each side that creates that slapping/sloshing sound. That is why I am not a fan of sponsons unless they are 90% below the waterline or engines mounted in a pocket/recessed transom. 
Good Luck


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## Vertigo (Jun 3, 2012)

Aluminum drift boats:


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## jimsmicro (Oct 29, 2013)

No matter what boat you have it won't do everything great. Furthermore the people in here comparing riveted jons to thicker higher quality welded ones aren't making a fair comparison. Would you compare a 10 foot Tracker jon boat to a Hell Bay? No. My Sea Ark is bomb proof and doesn't leak a drop. I have hit rocks so hard I nearly flew off the front deck. Stuff that would have crushed fiberglass hulls without a doubt. I've ran into oyster bars at 20 miles an hour with nothing other than some paint scraped off. Smashed into docks when the shift cable broke and I was stuck in gear... all without so much as a dent. I like glass boats, and for MOST people they make sense, but aluminum is tough, light, and unless you're negligent corrosion really isn't an issue. I've seen more rot on glass boats than aluminum. The sun wrecks all fiberglass eventually. If you don't run rocky areas filled with oysters then by all means consider glass boats, but don't pretend like aluminum doesn't have its place on the flats. When the tide gets low in my area, most of the glass boats leave. We stay and fish about as long as we want. Aluminum is the rig of choice for most Big Bend inshore guys. Plus, if you bash it up I guarantee that paying a welder for half an hour of work is cheaper than paying a glass guy.


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## LowHydrogen (Dec 31, 2015)

jimsmicro said:


> Furthermore the people in here comparing riveted jons to thicker higher quality welded ones aren't making a fair comparison. Would you compare a 10 foot Tracker jon boat to a Hell Bay? No.


Agree 100%, comparing .050 riveted alum box store boat to glass sandwiched foam core lamination, is hardly an apples to apples comparison.

OP,
Also, there has been some confusion about mechanical properties, of different materials. Abrasion resistance and shear strength are completely different.
You mentioned modifying the alum rig to suit your needs. Look here... http://forum.tinboats.net/ (not sure if linking other forums is allowed here, if not let me know and I''ll edit)


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## GullsGoneWild (Dec 16, 2014)

Brian Little is making aluminum poling skiffs. I believe it was under the name of ultralight skiffs but now goes by Sabine Skiffs. You may want to do a quick google image search.


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## Canoeman (Jul 23, 2008)

I've looked at this one at a boat show. It's built like a tank.
http://www.castandblastboats.com/#!cast-and-blast-17/c20nd


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## camp (Jul 31, 2011)

LowHydrogen said:


> Agree 100%, comparing .050 riveted alum box store boat to glass sandwiched foam core lamination, is hardly an apples to apples comparison.
> 
> OP,
> Also, there has been some confusion about mechanical properties, of different materials. Abrasion resistance and shear strength are completely different.
> You mentioned modifying the alum rig to suit your needs. Look here... http://forum.tinboats.net/ (not sure if linking other forums is allowed here, if not let me know and I''ll edit)





jimsmicro said:


> No matter what boat you have it won't do everything great. Furthermore the people in here comparing riveted jons to thicker higher quality welded ones aren't making a fair comparison. Would you compare a 10 foot Tracker jon boat to a Hell Bay? No. My Sea Ark is bomb proof and doesn't leak a drop. I have hit rocks so hard I nearly flew off the front deck. Stuff that would have crushed fiberglass hulls without a doubt. I've ran into oyster bars at 20 miles an hour with nothing other than some paint scraped off. Smashed into docks when the shift cable broke and I was stuck in gear... all without so much as a dent. I like glass boats, and for MOST people they make sense, but aluminum is tough, light, and unless you're negligent corrosion really isn't an issue. I've seen more rot on glass boats than aluminum. The sun wrecks all fiberglass eventually. If you don't run rocky areas filled with oysters then by all means consider glass boats, but don't pretend like aluminum doesn't have its place on the flats. When the tide gets low in my area, most of the glass boats leave. We stay and fish about as long as we want. Aluminum is the rig of choice for most Big Bend inshore guys. Plus, if you bash it up I guarantee that paying a welder for half an hour of work is cheaper than paying a glass guy.



good thoughts here. As someone who has lived most of his life in Aluminum boat land (northern Minnesota) I would point out the difference between light aluminum boats and welded plate boats of 3/16' -1/4' material. for inshore plate boats check out Hanko's. From long experience I would stay away from welded hulls of lesser thickness...most are simply inferior to riveted hulls built by quality builders such as Lund. Boats flex and 1/8 or less will crack at the welds. A great shallow water hull to check out is a 1997 and older lund Alaskan. They are flat aft and bullet proof. Anything newer is a v. and required much more hp..


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## WhiteDog70810 (May 6, 2008)

Y'all do realize this is an fossilized thread that was resurrected from the dead?

...but since I can't resist a pointless argument... ...Texas has the best BBQ!... ...damn, wrong pointless argument.

In the end, if cost is your primary motivator, get aluminum. If you like purpose-built shallow draft poling skiffs, get a FG.

Nate


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## mtoddsolomon (Mar 25, 2015)

WhiteDog70810 said:


> Y'all do realize this is an fossilized thread that was resurrected from the dead?
> 
> ...but since I can't resist a pointless argument... ...Texas has the best BBQ!... ...damn, wrong pointless argument.
> 
> ...


Whoa Whoa Whoa, NC has the best BBQ.


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## WhiteDog70810 (May 6, 2008)

mtoddsolomon said:


> Whoa Whoa Whoa, NC has the best BBQ.


Have you hit the Pickin' Pig in Carthage, NC? It is worth the trip, but beware; they are cash only.

However, I stand by my Texas vote. Lockhart, TX is my Mecca.

Nate


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## LowHydrogen (Dec 31, 2015)

WhiteDog70810 said:


> Y'all do realize this is an fossilized thread that was resurrected from the dead?
> 
> Nate


HAHA how'd I miss that....


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

The best bbq I have ever had = Hutchins BBQ in Mckenney TX!!! That fatty cap on the brisket, oh my god, I wanted to rub it all over my body


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## Bryson Turner (May 3, 2017)

Stay away from carpeted bunks if possible


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