# The journey to my ultimate goal...



## Gatorgrizz27 (Apr 4, 2015)

Now, the things I need a bit of help with:

Tying a fly. My fly tying has been limited to ghetto foam poppers, I’m assuming I’ll want to tie something like a bead chain clouser on a #2 stainless hook. I’ve got a bench I slapped together and some cheap tools, I probably need to hit YouTube and start practicing. Notice the bench is covered in junk since it hasn’t been used in awhile.










My casting. I’m not great, but have figured out the double haul. I was fly fishing exclusively for awhile but have been going out with buddies more lately in very small boats, which necessitates spinning gear instead. I plan on getting a touch up lesson from a casting coach here.

The biggest issue is that I may need to find a different fishery. The area I fish regularly holds a lot of reds, but the water is super stained and dingy. So much so that it’s impossible to see sand bottom or an oyster bar in over 12” of water. Because of this, the reds seem to hunt mostly by smell. I’m not sure if I’d be better off using scent on my fly (I know) in an area I’m familiar with, or moving over a bit towards clearer water. Sight fishing opportunities here are limited to seeing them tailing on oyster bars or their V-wakes in shallow water, otherwise it’s blind casting.


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

Dye some of that bucktail black for the stained water.


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## Backcountry 16 (Mar 15, 2016)

el9surf said:


> Dye some of that bucktail black for the stained water.


X2 murky water dark bait add a rattle for noise for your fly.


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## LowHydrogen (Dec 31, 2015)

Smash up fresh shrimp into a goo, goo gets rubbed into a darkish bottom bouncing weedless fly, and Bob's your uncle.

Normally I wouldn't suggest this approach but it seems like a cool goal with a lot of adversity already....So, let's just skin this cat now, get traditional after the monkey is off your back!

Good luck!


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## EdK13 (Oct 3, 2013)

People that fish R - NUTS. And I love it.


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## Gatorgrizz27 (Apr 4, 2015)

Thanks for the tips so far. Come to think of it, I’ve never fished a black fly up here. 99% of the baitfish in the area are finger mullet, so I’ve been trying white flashy patterns. I’ve got some black wooly buggers already that I need to try and will work on dying the bucktail. 

These look simple enough to tie...

http://www.spottedtail.com/blog/mosquito-lagoon-florida-fly-fishing-tip-little-black-flies/

Shrimp juice is a good idea too. I’m not a big fan of “cheating” but it might be either that or learn a new fishery, and the one I’ve been going to has such low pressure.

I’m excited about this rod. I’m not a big fan of my 8 wt (lower end Orvis). It just feels really dull and makes you work hard to keep a tight loop, I feel like I’m racing it all the time. I built a 7’ fiberglass 3 wt that is super sweet but obviously not salt capable. I’d been wanting to try a faster 6 wt fiberglass rod like an Epic 686, but the blanks are ungodly expensive. The blank I got was much cheaper and looks to have similar specs, so we will see how it does.


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## mcraft173 (Apr 21, 2014)

Where do you live, and how big is the tide swing?

Where I live, our water is dirty most of the year, but we still manage to sight fish reds on the fly rod. Slicked out/low wind days on low or dropping tide are best. The low wind allows you to see wakes and tail tips of moving and floating fish easier. Low dropping tide makes the fish move around, it flushes the bait and if you get into shallow water, you are fishing "two dimensions" rather than 3. The shallow water fish are easier to find moving.

I've also had some luck with blind casting areas I'm familiar with. Once I know where all the oyster bars are and the "usual" hang outs, I'll blind cast to structure where I have seen or caught fish before sight fishing. The slot and reds in my area tend to get cozy consistently return to the same spots. If I accidentally pole over and push fish, I'll keep going, give the fish a rest for 30 mins or so and go back and the fish is usually back.

Hope this helps


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## crboggs (Mar 30, 2015)

Epic. Love the plan. Tight lines!


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## bryson (Jun 22, 2015)

I know someone already asked, but where do you fish? Our water is pretty dirty here on the SC coast, but we still catch reds pretty well. I don't often throw clousers, though -- I like something with some more flash, or that moves some water.

What rules have you set for yourself with regards to the fly? If I were limited to only/mostly bucktail as a tying material, I think that I would tie up a baitfish or a slider with a bucktail tail, and I would try to spin some of the hair from the base of the tail up to make a head. If you shoot another deer, save some belly hair.

Should be a fun journey -- catching fish on flies that you tied yourself is pretty dang rewarding; I'm sure adding all the other factors will make it even more so. Good luck!


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## bonehead (Dec 9, 2016)

This is awesome! Definitely following along


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## Gatorgrizz27 (Apr 4, 2015)

Thanks guys. I fish Panacea in the big bend of Florida. It’s a combination of tidal creeks and oyster bars over shallow mud flats. Full/new moon tides are in the range of 3 ft, so the water does move noticeably.

The reds do feed on the oyster bars but they seem to do it at high tide. As soon as the bars are partially exposed, they aren’t around anymore.

The bay is super shallow, at low tide the mud flats are less than 1’ and some of the creeks get cut off completely. I’ve had luck casting in some deeper holes where they seem to hang out on the bottom, but I rarely see fish in the shallow water.

The place is also chock full of mullet, so 90% of the ripples in the water are them. It is possible to tell when it’s a red from their V-shaped wake if you see them moving for long enough.

I generally try to fish on days where high tide is at first light and fish the falling tide early before the wind picks up. I’ve fished the incoming a decent amount too, but it seems to be more sporadic. 

I don’t have any hard rules for the fly other than bucktail being the main material. I’m fine adding flash, eyes, marabou, etc. I just don’t want to tie something and then slap 4 hairs on it.

Unfortunately, I had a whole hide and tail go bad from the deer I shot 2 years ago, I left it out of the freezer. This bucktail is from 3 years ago, and the deer I killed last season I didn’t even think about keeping the hide or tail since we quartered him in the field.


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## Bonecracker (Mar 29, 2007)

Reminds me of one of my bucket list items. Kill a respectable whitetail buck with a longbow I made, with a cedar arrow I made, and a broadhead I made out of a saw blade! Took more than two years but I was having a blast along the way. I should have been happy with the 3 does I killed with the bow but wanted a decent buck that finally fell to one well placed arrow late in my second season hunting with a tradition weapon!


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## Bonecracker (Mar 29, 2007)

el9surf said:


> Dye some of that bucktail black for the stained water.


Purple/Black is my favorite Panacea fly color!!


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## jhreels (Apr 20, 2017)

Awesome plan. You ever considered building the reel? I machined mine on a lathe/mill, but theres kits online to build a reel without special tools.
http://www.eclecticangler.com/round-frame-kits/


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## Gatorgrizz27 (Apr 4, 2015)

Bonecracker said:


> Reminds me of one of my bucket list items. Kill a respectable whitetail buck with a longbow I made, with a cedar arrow I made, and a broadhead I made out of a saw blade! Took more than two years but I was having a blast along the way. I should have been happy with the 3 does I killed with the bow but wanted a decent buck that finally fell to one well placed arrow late in my second season hunting with a tradition weapon!


I briefly considered that for a minute, but then this whole thing would turn into real madness!

The only other thing I’d like to do is build a boat exclusively with hand tools, but it would be a pirogue instead of a real skiff. I’ve built two pirgoues so far but my wife said she wouldn’t want to be around me while I built one from hand tools. 

In all honestly, most of this stuff is just up front work and preparation, it doesn’t actually make the task of catching the fish any harder, just more rewarding.


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## BM_Barrelcooker (May 4, 2011)

I did something like that once. 

I caught a bluegill from an inner tube that I blew up myself on a cane pole I cut my self snd a worm I dug by myself. 
The satisfaction was rather short lived.


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## Bonecracker (Mar 29, 2007)

BM_Barrelcooker said:


> I did something like that once.
> 
> I caught a bluegill from an inner tube that I blew up myself on a cane pole I cut my self snd a worm I dug by myself.
> The satisfaction was rather short lived.


 LOL! BM I thought u were going to say that you jumped out of ur duck boat on a cold November morning, ran on the water & single handily caught a Mallard duck that you later had for dinner! You got skills brother‼


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## BM_Barrelcooker (May 4, 2011)

Bonecracker said:


> LOL! BM I thought u were going to say that you jumped out of ur duck boat on cold November morning, ran on the water & single handily caught a Mallard duck that you later had for dinner! You got skills brother‼


No but I broke my cane pole and ended up tying the string to my big toe and catching three more bluegill a channel cat and a snapping turtle.


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## Gatorgrizz27 (Apr 4, 2015)

After some reading, it appears dying the bucktail black will be quite the challenge also. People recommend using Jacquard Acid dye, so I went ahead and ordered some. It also requires holding the water temperature between 180-190 degrees for 30 minutes, a perfect job for the Sous vide cooker I got for Christmas last year.


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## permitchaser (Aug 26, 2013)

First your tieing bench looks great. Mine just an old table
Why not try some gurglers in mullet colors.
When I first started tying there was not internet. Then Al Gore....never mind
Now you can go on and find out how to tie any fly


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## jay.bush1434 (Dec 27, 2014)

Lofty and very cool goals indeed. 

I want to catch every species of fish I have caught on conventional tackle on fly.


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## BM_Barrelcooker (May 4, 2011)

In all seriousness it’s a great goal and will be a real accomplishment. 

I have a friend that’s a big bow hunter and he did the same kind of thing. 
Bow, arrows , bowstring even the knife that he cleaned the deer with. 


I’m glad there are folks like y’all in the world.


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## Gatorgrizz27 (Apr 4, 2015)

permitchaser said:


> First your tieing bench looks great. Mine just an old table
> Why not try some gurglers in mullet colors.
> When I first started tying there was not internet. Then Al Gore....never mind
> Now you can go on and find out how to tie any fly


It’s just some plywood scraps, I can take better pictures and give rough plans if anyone’s interested. Easily built with a drill and table saw. It’s nice to have something portable so I can take it inside and use it on the coffee table with the family instead of being a hermit. Most of the time it’s used on my reloading bench in the garage, but stored under.

I’ve actually never fished a gurgler, but they look like they’re worth a try and are tied with bucktail. I remembered having a black/purple clouser in one of my boxes, it has come apart though. I know I didn’t catch a red on it but it probably hasn’t been tested much.


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## Gatorgrizz27 (Apr 4, 2015)

Tied my first actual non-popper fly this morning. It turned out ok except forgetting that I was working upside down halfway through. 

I used the hook, eyes, and bucktail hairs from a fly that was coming apart. I’m saving my bucktail until I refine my skills a bit so I tied some marabou on top, thinking I was making a “bunny” type fly until I realized it’s actually on the belly. I’ll take it apart and do it again since I didn’t cement anything. 

Good news is I learned to whip finish by hand since I’ve never been able to figure out the tool consistently.


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## Forgottencoast (Aug 25, 2017)

We fish purple and black mostly in panacea as well. Redfish on low tide back in the creeks is our go to and then oyster bars when the tide gets up. Good luck! I’m in a grey Hewes bonefisher with a 90hp etec, if you see me stop and say hello and we can talk more.


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## BM_Barrelcooker (May 4, 2011)

Forgottencoast said:


> We fish purple and black mostly in panacea as well. Redfish on low tide back in the creeks is our go to and then oyster bars when the tide gets up. Good luck! I’m in a grey Hewes bonefisher with a 90hp etec, if you see me stop and say hello and we can talk more.


B.M. Barrelcooker likes this.


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## BM_Barrelcooker (May 4, 2011)

Gatorgrizz27 said:


> Tied my first actual non-popper fly this morning. It turned out ok except forgetting that I was working upside down halfway through.
> 
> I used the hook, eyes, and bucktail hairs from a fly that was coming apart. I’m saving my bucktail until I refine my skills a bit so I tied some marabou on top, thinking I was making a “bunny” type fly until I realized it’s actually on the belly. I’ll take it apart and do it again since I didn’t cement anything.
> 
> ...


The whip finish tool works better if lubed with rum. 
Lots of rum.


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## permitchaser (Aug 26, 2013)

Gatorgrizz27 said:


> Tied my first actual non-popper fly this morning. It turned out ok except forgetting that I was working upside down halfway through.
> 
> I used the hook, eyes, and bucktail hairs from a fly that was coming apart. I’m saving my bucktail until I refine my skills a bit so I tied some marabou on top, thinking I was making a “bunny” type fly until I realized it’s actually on the belly. I’ll take it apart and do it again since I didn’t cement anything.
> 
> ...


shoot that should catch something. Just chunck it


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## Gatorgrizz27 (Apr 4, 2015)

BM_Barrelcooker said:


> The whip finish tool works better if lubed with rum.
> Lots of rum.


I have some El Dorado 12 year I’ll try, but I enjoy doing it by hand. Thanks for the tip though.


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## BM_Barrelcooker (May 4, 2011)

Gatorgrizz27 said:


> I have some El Dorado 12 year I’ll try, but I enjoy doing it by hand. Thanks for the tip though.


That works good with rum too. 

I buy flies and drink rum and look at them sometimes. That’s my favorite .


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## FlyrodC (Apr 29, 2018)

Interesting thread. I live in Montana and have a cottage at Shell Point. Had property in Oyster Bay prior and have been fishing the area out of a kayak or a friend's boat for the last 4 years. Have maybe 30-40 days on the water and contrary to my buddy's advice, I'm only throwing flies.

90% of the fish I've caught have been Trout though I did catch a decent Red on a crab pattern a few weeks ago. Have had good success with chartreuse/white flashabou Clousers with red lead eyes that I tie. Am going to tie some purple/black ones for my next visit at the end of May. Haven't picked up anything on a surface fly yet but have a bunch of patterns to try. The surface fly I want to get a fish on is the Pole Dancer. You can walk the dog with it and while I've fished it a little bit, haven't picked anything up on it yet. Mostly been a timing thing IMO as I haven't been out early on a cloudy day with it yet.

My goal = 30" Red on a fly, preferably tied by me but if it's on a quasi fly tied by Jim Dupree, I'll sure take it.

First post on here. Glad to see such a robust board posting about Saltwater Fly Fishing.


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## Gatorgrizz27 (Apr 4, 2015)

Thought I’d update this, boat build is progressing slowly and I haven’t tied any more flies, but I’ve been out fishing 3 times. In those 3 trips I haven’t caught a single red, which is baffling. 19 out of 20 trips I catch one. I talked to a guy who owns a big tackle store and he said he’s caught one or 2 on a top water plug but no one has been catching them lately. The last 2 trips I’ve at least seen a couple tailing but couldn’t get an eat.

The good news is my fly casting has somehow greatly improved even though it had been 6 months since I’d picked up a fly rod. I suppose I’ve forgotten all my bad habits! I’ve got the double haul figured out pretty well and was able to shoot line into a 10-15 mph wind, which I wasn’t able to before.

Maybe the lack of reds eating is just encouragement to finish my boat build rather than spending time on the water.


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