# DIY saltwater leader proportions.



## FlyBy (Jul 12, 2013)

I tie mine 40" 40#, 30" 30#, 20" 20# for up to 9 wt. Add a 2' or so tippet of up to 15#. 12 wt. leader is 40" 50#, 30" 40#, 20" 30#, plus 2' 16-20# tippet. Works for me.


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## Maliberti (Apr 25, 2021)

Have you tried Leader Calc?
LeaderCalc | Custom knotted fly fishing leader formula calculator | Global FlyFisher


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## Clamfoot (Jun 21, 2021)

FlyBy said:


> I tie mine 40" 40#, 30" 30#, 20" 20# for up to 9 wt. Add a 2' or so tippet of up to 15#. 12 wt. leader is 40" 50#, 30" 40#, 20" 30#, plus 2' 16-20# tippet. Works for me.


Thanks FlyBy


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## CAPTAlexMoran (May 2, 2020)

What kind of fish are you looking to target, and where are you fishing?


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## BM_Barrelcooker (May 4, 2011)

So…..a long time ago when I roamed around 10k islands with a cheap 8 wt and a click reel …….spider wire braid was brand new. I made leaders out of 30# 30# and a mono tippet. It would cast great and was really strong. But the braid would catch every mangrove limb or oyster shell. 
It was revolutionary.


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## Steve_Mevers (Feb 8, 2013)

At the end of your cast, right before the leader hits the water, pull back a little on the fly line. It will help roll your fly out and also have you tight to the fly when it hits the water.


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## Miles813 (Jul 1, 2021)

I have used similar leader proportions with good effect. What type of knots are you using to connect the sections of line? So you are using mono-mono-mono, no flouro? Are you using hard or soft mono?


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## Jason M (Aug 13, 2017)

Bruce Chard has a nice video series but his is mainly for floating lines. I don't think you need so much taper with a shooting head.


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## Clamfoot (Jun 21, 2021)

First, thanks for the help everyone.

@Maliberti - nice link.......thx
@CaptAlex - I'm typically fishing in central Florida mostly East Coast Lagoon system. Reds, Specs, dirty water.
@Steve_Mevers. thanks - been trying to focus on that, feathering the line to the target. That's what really called my attention to the hinging. 
@Miles813 - I'm using regular mono (soft?) and all connections are blood knots. I have tried some Flouro as the final section but didn't notice a real difference. I've been focusing on using lighter or unweighted flies lately and being more patient on the fall (sink rate). I planned on making up some new leaders and going back to Flouro to help get down a little quicker. That's what prompted my discussion. 
I have also tried some furled leaders in situations when I'm fishing in a particularly abrasive situation (dock pilings and oyster bars). But in the end that didn't really have much effect on the hinging.

I've been switching leader lengths often, searching for the right combo but the trial and effort method is wearing thin. I have to think that there has to be some math and logic to this. 
I'm catching fish, it's just not efficient or pretty.


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## RJTaylor (Oct 4, 2017)

I've been getting good results with RIO saltwater leader material, and this "recipe".

4' 40# 3' 30# 2' 20#. I'm direct tying to the 20#, since I fish for reds.


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## Miles813 (Jul 1, 2021)

Clamfoot said:


> @Miles813 - I'm using regular mono (soft?) and all connections are blood knots. I have tried some Flouro as the final section but didn't notice a real difference. I've been focusing on using lighter or unweighted flies lately and being more patient on the fall (sink rate). I planned on making up some new leaders and going back to Flouro to help get down a little quicker. That's what prompted my discussion.
> I have also tried some furled leaders in situations when I'm fishing in a particularly abrasive situation (dock pilings and oyster bars). But in the end that didn't really have much effect on the hinging.


You might try bumping up your butt section and taper on the 9 wt leader, but I would think 30-20-12/10 would be able to throw any size fly your 6 wt could as I've used that same recipe on my 7 and 8 wts. I would check your leader material manufacturer's website for their line diameters and make sure there isn't a big jump between their 30 and 20 that is causing the hinging and also that you are not using a soft material. Most people use hard mono and I have had success using Ande which is a medium. I guess it all depends on your definition of medium weighted flies, I throw med dumbbell eyes no problem.


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## Clamfoot (Jun 21, 2021)

Miles813 said:


> You might try bumping up your butt section and taper on the 9 wt leader, but I would think 30-20-12/10 would be able to throw any size fly your 6 wt could as I've used that same recipe on my 7 and 8 wts. I would check your leader material manufacturer's website for their line diameters and make sure there isn't a big jump between their 30 and 20 that is causing the hinging and also that you are not using a soft material. Most people use hard mono and I have had success using Ande which is a medium. I guess it all depends on your definition of medium weighted flies, I throw med dumbbell eyes no problem.


Thanks Miles


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## IRLyRiser (Feb 14, 2007)

I’ve had good luck with 60%-20%-20% (butt, mid, tippet) on almost all my leaders of any length. A heavier fly may need a more open loop on your cast to turn over well. Increasing the lb test on the butt section can help too.


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## Clamfoot (Jun 21, 2021)

@Miles813 
I know of Masons "hard mono" but is all mono that is specified as "leader material" considered hard mono? 
Are you making all sections from hard mono or just the butt?


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## Miles813 (Jul 1, 2021)

Clamfoot said:


> @Miles813
> I know of Masons "hard mono" but is all mono that is specified as "leader material" considered hard mono?
> Are you making all sections from hard mono or just the butt?


I do not believe all mono marked as leader material is "hard" as Ande leader material is described as a medium soft mono on their website. I use mono for everything except the tippet for which I use flouro.


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## WC53 (Dec 2, 2015)

_6-40, 18”-25, 2’ 15

for cortland 40, 30, 16_


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## mwolaver (Feb 6, 2014)

4'-3'-2'-1'...40#, 30#, 20#, bite. Or make the 20# section whatever class tippet you want. Starting with 40 may help your casting. I use mostly Ande mono, hard mono can be a pain to tie and is not necessary. Never make your whole leader with flouro unless you are really trying to sink your fly.


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## Hank (Jan 14, 2019)

Tell more about the “shooting head line”. 

Is that a weighted sinking line attached to running line or is it one of the more typical modern floater all in one with more weight up front?

If its a sinking shooting head you don’t need much leader - six feet straight including a lighter tippet would be way plenty. 

If its a modern line with a floating head thats heavy for nominal size, then a 50-30-20% should get you there. I’d pick different material for the 6 and the 9 - stiffer and heavier on the 9. For the 6 I’d probably use a tapered knotless leader with a heavy butt and go with that.

At some point, casting becomes chucking where the fly is just too heavy for the line. Not knowing what you’re fishing its hard to say but you might be there already. In that territory, stepping up a line size or two can fix your problem.


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## Clamfoot (Jun 21, 2021)

Hank said:


> Tell more about the “shooting head line”.
> 
> Is that a weighted sinking line attached to running line or is it one of the more typical modern floater all in one with more weight up front?
> 
> ...


Hi Hank,
Yes, a modern floating line with a weight forward profile. It sounds like you and most everyone else are on the scent with using a stiffer/heaver leader material.


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## permitchaser (Aug 26, 2013)

My leaders are 50 butt, 40,30, tippet. I use mono tippet (Ande) for leaders if I want it to float. If I want the fly to sink I use floro


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## kjnengr (Jan 16, 2018)

Hank said:


> Tell more about the “shooting head line”.


A shooting head line has a shorter but heavier head than a typical weight forward head. Both are floating lines. The advantage is that for the same weight of line outside the rod tip, less line needs to be aired out outside the rod tip. Disadvantages to shooting head fly lines are that they aren't quite as stealthy and you can't carry as much line in the air if you needed to.


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## Poon.Patrol (Jan 28, 2021)

RJTaylor said:


> I've been getting good results with RIO saltwater leader material, and this "recipe".
> 
> 4' 40# 3' 30# 2' 20#. I'm direct tying to the 20#, since I fish for reds.


 I do the same recipe and it works great as well.


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## Clamfoot (Jun 21, 2021)

Poon.Patrol said:


> I do the same recipe and it works great as well.


@RJTaylor 
@Poon.Patrol 

What weight rod are you using for that setup?
Loop to loop or direct tied?
Do either of those (Rod wt and connection) matter to you?

I'll likely pick up some 40 hard this weekend.


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## Poon.Patrol (Jan 28, 2021)

Clamfoot said:


> @RJTaylor
> @Poon.Patrol
> 
> What weight rod are you using for that setup?
> ...


I use it mainly on my inshore set ups 7wt/8wt. I don't really have any issues with the loop to loop connection. I try to keep the same brand leader material and focus more so on the diameter of the lines rather than the lb strength for the taper. I used to always blame my leader for not unraveling straight but honestly it was my casting. No tailing loops and generate enough line speed and send it out there. Hope this helps!


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## CAPTAlexMoran (May 2, 2020)

For your 6wt- 7FT of 40lb to 3 1/2 feet of 20
For the 9wt- 7FT of 50lb and 3 1/2 feet of 30

I use ANDE mono 99% of the time just because its readily available and affordable. If you're fishing spooky fish with the 6 and 20 seems like too much, just splice on another couple of feet of something smaller. Don't think too hard. They're just fish after all.


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## Clamfoot (Jun 21, 2021)

CAPTAlexMoran said:


> For your 6wt- 7FT of 40lb to 3 1/2 feet of 20
> For the 9wt- 7FT of 50lb and 3 1/2 feet of 30
> 
> I use ANDE mono 99% of the time just because its readily available and affordable. If you're fishing spooky fish with the 6 and 20 seems like too much, just splice on another couple of feet of something smaller. Don't think too hard. They're just fish after all.


@CAPTAlexMoran 
Thanks Capt.
Regular Ande fishing line or Ande leader material?


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## Steve_Mevers (Feb 8, 2013)

Clamfoot said:


> @Miles813
> I know of Masons "hard mono" but is all mono that is specified as "leader material" considered hard mono?
> Are you making all sections from hard mono or just the butt?


I tried using the hard mono and just did not like. I use the same type leader material (Ande) in the Butt, Mid, and Tippet section, bite is often Fluorocarbon. Different manufactures have different diameter lines for the same pound test line so I don't mix them when building a leader.


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## Miles813 (Jul 1, 2021)

Steve_Mevers said:


> I tried using the hard mono and just did not like. I use the same type leader material (Ande) in the Butt, Mid, and Tippet section, bite is often Fluorocarbon. Different manufactures have different diameter lines for the same pound test line so I don't mix them when building a leader.


I like Ande as well for my all my leader material except I use SA flouro for my tippet.


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## RJTaylor (Oct 4, 2017)

Clamfoot said:


> @RJTaylor
> @Poon.Patrol
> 
> What weight rod are you using for that setup?
> ...


5wt through 9wt, looped end. Not hard mono though. Use this Saltwater Mono - RIO Products
Sorry for the late reply


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## CAPTAlexMoran (May 2, 2020)

Clamfoot said:


> @CAPTAlexMoran
> Thanks Capt.
> Regular Ande fishing line or Ande leader material?


I use the leader material. It's going to help transfer that energy over much better, and I find it easier to tie with. That's just my two cents though.


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## Clamfoot (Jun 21, 2021)

CAPTAlexMoran said:


> I use the leader material. It's going to help transfer that energy over much better, and I find it easier to tie with. That's just my two cents though.


Thanks for all the help Capt Alex. 
I picked up a roll of Ande 40 leader and Masons 25 (both around .023).
I'll give the new leader set up a try this weekend.


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## Hank (Jan 14, 2019)

kjnengr said:


> A shooting head line has a shorter but heavier head than a typical weight forward head. Both are floating lines. The advantage is that for the same weight of line outside the rod tip, less line needs to be aired out outside the rod tip. Disadvantages to shooting head fly lines are that they aren't quite as stealthy and you can't carry as much line in the air if you needed to.


Yes, I was asking for clarification from the OP. In the old days, and still for some of us, a shooting head was usually a section of sinking line attached to a shooting line of mono or braided mono. Of course there were floating shooting heads too, but not as common.


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## sjrobin (Jul 13, 2015)

The leader attached to the fly line is an extension of the fly line. So the butt section should match the density of the fly line. The fly can be tied to the butt section(mono or flouro) (floating or sinking) Any extension of the butt should be designed for the fly, water clarity, stealth, or species. I like all flouro to help lighter flies sink faster no matter the species or conditions. Lighter flies are also less complicated to cast. The only exception to flouro is small floating flies, then use small mono.


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## CAPTAlexMoran (May 2, 2020)

Clamfoot said:


> Thanks for all the help Capt Alex.
> I picked up a roll of Ande 40 leader and Masons 25 (both around .023).
> I'll give the new leader set up a try this weekend.


Go get em man!


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## JustSomeDude (Apr 11, 2020)

Making a Redfish Leader | MidCurrent







midcurrent.com





Cliff notes: 

Butt = 5 feet of 40-pound
Mid = 3 feet (about 2 feet of 30-pound and 1 foot of
20-pound)
Tippet = 2 feet of 16-pound

I've been using this leader formula on my 6 and 8wts and it's worked well. I tie a perfection loop at the end of the 20lb so I can have a loop to loop for the tippet. 

I saw a leader that was straight 50 tied to 20 though that worked surprisingly well though.


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