# Old school sage guys



## flysalt060 (Aug 5, 2012)

Sa redfish. Or Rio redfish. Mostly I throw a 9 wt Rio outbound short intermediate on mine cause I am striper fishing.


----------



## TheAdamsProject (Oct 29, 2007)

Seems like with the ultra fast rods people tend to up line or throw a line that is heavier in grain weight because they "cant feel the rod load". In my opinion that really defeats the purpose of that type of rod. Not to offend anyone but if you need to throw some overweighted or extreme taper line to get it to behave like you want it, why not just use a different rod better suited to your casting stroke? Now if I would have stumbled into one, then yes, I would make it work, I am really referring to either buying new or used. 

Anytime I use the TCR,TCX,Method or now the Igniter, I use a line like Cortland flats taper that is a more "standard spec" fly line. With the ultra-fast action that tip is actually softer than a standard fast or moderate fast rod because it is designed to throw with shorter strokes and hold more line in the air. In my opinion when throwing heavier lines on those ultra-fast rods feel like the tip collapses after it becomes overloaded. Now granted, if all you need is 40ft shots at redfish then you can pretty much throw anything on that rod, or any rod really, and make it work. But if you are trying to dial it in for what it was designed for, then a heavier head is not what it was designed to cast. Right now on my Method 9wt is the Flats clear from Cortland and is incredible for windy miami/keys bonefish. That line is 240 grains which is almost the same as the rio redfish at 243 but different taper design. 

So, long story short, if you want a general purpose redfish rod you are probably good with whatever line you borrowed, but if you are going to throw long casts at spooky fish with small flies, stay away from short heavy heads on that rod.


----------



## jmrodandgun (Sep 20, 2013)

I don't have a TCR but I have the TCX. The TCX 8wt isn't awesome with the SA Redfish line. Or the Whorevis Igniter. Or Bermuda Shorts. I bet the TCR is pretty close to the TCX. Right now I'm using Bermuda Triangle taper. There may be a better line but I couldn't tell where it would be better. Good rear platform rod for when the bow man blows a shot.


----------



## Caleb.Esparza (Jan 31, 2016)

@nativejax I totally agree with what you're saying. Going off grain weight alone I was considering the 8wt BTT because the 9 was a bit heavier than I wanted. I threw a 7wt BTT on my previous 8wt and the rod was a Lazer so I'm probably going to try something similar. 

I have personally hated every Rio line that I've thrown, particularly the heavy head redfish and tarpon quickshooter lines so I'm trying to stay away from that style. With that said, this is a marsh rod so 90% of its life will be tossing heavily weighted crabs/sliders at large fish 30-60' from the skiff. 75' would be a stretch so I'm not sure the clear cortland line is necessary.


----------



## TheAdamsProject (Oct 29, 2007)

@Caleb.Esparza I feel ya. The cortland guide might be a nice in between. It falls in between the flats taper and a rio redfish. The Cortland flats comes in a sky blue as I only mention the clear as that is what I have. Two options for the flats taper.


----------



## brokeoff (Sep 2, 2016)

@nativejax but doesn't head length need to be factored in to the "way overlined" discussion? If you have a 9 wt Method that likes a true to weight flats taper, I'm thinking Cortland Flats or Rio Bonefish, then we have to look at how it feels with 30' of line out and 50' of line out. I think it probably does best with those longer shots. That 50' head that's out is a lot more than 240 gr. It could be 350 gr. If I head out and I know I'll be taking closer shots, aren't I just taking the full 50' Cortland head and condensing it into a 30' heavy head to get a similar feel? I'm not sure it's always a matter of dumbing down a rod.

For the record, my favorite setup is a 9 wt Method with a 9 wt RIO Bonefish (half heavy).


----------



## sjrobin (Jul 13, 2015)

Bonefish fly lines do not work as well for sight casting red drum or other close/mid range targets unless the lines are matched with glass or early generation slow action graphite fly rods. Handicapping if you use them on fast action fly rods.


----------



## ifsteve (Jul 1, 2010)

Well I talked to my buddy at the shop who has more experience with Sage rods than any soul I know. He had two recommendations.

1. RIO Redfish. But then I told him you hate RIO.
so then 
2. SA Redfish.


----------



## Backwater (Dec 14, 2014)

NativeJax, good stuff there and you took a lot of words outta my mouth. 

Jmrodandgun, the TCX is slightly faster than the TCR. Both rods are old time favs for me too and both bomb line. To me, those 2 rods, along with the next gens past them (Method and Igniter) are more bonefish and distance rods rather than close up redfish rods. Sure, like Nativejax mention, you can put a short head / heavier line to load it, but it does turn it into something that it was never intended to be and you lose the "goodie" out of the rod. jmrodandgun is also almost doing the same with his 8wt TCX (in my opinion, another Sage unicorn rod) with the BTT cause the BTT is almost a 1/2 line weight heavier than the weight rating. So the line is more of a 8.5wt line vs a truer to weight 8wt. But here's what you can do. Change the line. I'd either look at a Wulff "Saltwater TT" (more true to weight than the BTT) instead of a BTT, or a SA Mastery or Amp Bonefish, Cortland Liquid Crystal Flats Taper all of which will wake that rod up and punch some amazing razor tight loops over long distances with smaller flies with that rod. For a little closer shooting with bigger flies, an SA Mastery Warm Water Redfish or Saltwater, Amp Grand Slam, your BTT or a Rio Bruce Chard and then, you need to throttle back and not try to punch the rod or you'll start to collapse the rod and the loops. 

Caleb, now taking all that everyone here said, including what sjrobin mentioned where you are sight fishing reds in MS, that may be what you have to do to effectively do to fish reds in your back yard is to use those slightly heavier lines. Then get a different distance line for Florida, big bones and perm fishing. One thing to note, they do stiffen that rod a bit in the 9wt, so it feels just as fast as the TCX 8wt, only a little heavier on the swing because it's a 9wt. So you can drive it a little harder than you could with the 8wt or below TCR. Just sayin....

The Pro.... If you have your casting down pat one day, that particular rod (9wt TCR/TCX), has no problems launching an entire fly line with 1-2 false cast. The Con... On the TRC's, you have to be mindful to keep all your brightware clean and treated with a good corrosion protection treatment to keep it looking great for years to come. In other words, it's not bulletproof when it comes to saltwater corrosion. So treat it well and it will treat you well. 

Ted Haas


----------



## SC on the FLY (Sep 16, 2015)

I am partial to the regular triangle taper as well, it throws great I’m not a fan of the heavier headlines for long distance casting


----------



## lsunoe (Dec 5, 2016)

jmrodandgun said:


> I don't have a TCR but I have the TCX. The TCX 8wt isn't awesome with the SA Redfish line. Or the Whorevis Igniter. Or Bermuda Shorts. I bet the TCR is pretty close to the TCX. Right now I'm using Bermuda Triangle taper. There may be a better line but I couldn't tell where it would be better. Good rear platform rod for when the bow man blows a shot.


I too have an 8wt TCX with BTT. I feel like that line pairs extremely well with the rod.


----------



## Caleb.Esparza (Jan 31, 2016)

Lots of good advice in here. The rod was a custom build so it has what I'm guessing are snake brand dual stripping guides. Not sure that I would have purchased it personally but it was part of a package deal with a freestone I was after (strange combo I know) so now I have it and liked it enough the one time I fished it that I'll probably keep it.


----------



## LowHydrogen (Dec 31, 2015)

I have a 6wt TCR, lined with 6wt BTT, it's magic.

I got the 2 tone, it looks cooler so it casts further, it's science.


----------



## Scrather (Mar 12, 2018)

It would be fun to have a spreadsheet on the forum, fly lines in columns, fly rods in rows and members votes counted in the cells. Just have to figure out how to get species in there, or maybe location. Here in NY my tropical lines all start getting too stiff this time of year as temps drop. Ten years ago I fished a Wulff TT or its predecessor a lot and it stands out in my mind as having been an excellent line on a broomstick 10 wt that sits in the basement these days.


----------



## Backwater (Dec 14, 2014)

Scrather said:


> It would be fun to have a spreadsheet on the forum, fly lines in columns, fly rods in rows and members votes counted in the cells. Just have to figure out how to get species in there, or maybe location.


It would look something like this!


----------



## Backwater (Dec 14, 2014)

Or this!!!


----------



## Scrather (Mar 12, 2018)

Yeah...too many variables. I made an offer on a Sage Method which with my Sage Xi3 so the info on old school Sage is appreciated.


----------



## SC on the FLY (Sep 16, 2015)

There is certainly nothing wrong with some of the old school rods, in fact some of the newer ones don’t seem to work out as well, I think the computer has taken over a lot of the design nowadays to where a back in the day people were actually casting the crap out of these things , And I’m certain some of the old mandrels are probably just getting re-labeled with new rod names for a cheaper price and maybe some advanced material, as far as the TCR in my experience with some of the lower weight rod’s they are nice casting rods but sometimes not the best fishing rods when it comes to trout size fish and small hooks due to the tips being fairly stiff you tend to pop off a lot of fish at the boat , I don’t necessarily think this applies when you start getting into eight weight and above ,at that point I think the rod needs to fit somebody’s casting style and have a little ass behind it to put pressure on bigger fish


----------



## Scrather (Mar 12, 2018)

In early November I’ll be driving right by the Sage factory...anyone ever been to the factory? I’ll have to contact them and see if they do tours or have a casting range/pool where you can try their latest greatest.


----------

