# NEFL Flood Grass Article in Florida Times Union



## prinjm6 (May 13, 2015)

I never see so many poling skiffs until the floods, it's gotten to the point where I dont fish them as the kooks cant help but potlick areas I've narrowed down over the last 16yrs of fishing them. If the fish weren't waving most down they'd never sightfish a red in NE FL. Social media has ruined what is special by making it a fad versus a secret those who know knew about by putting in their time.


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## rummya87 (Jun 24, 2016)

prinjm6 said:


> I never see so many poling skiffs until the floods, it's gotten to the point where I dont fish them as the kooks cant help but potlick areas I've narrowed down over the last 16yrs of fishing them. If the fish weren't waving most down they'd never sightfish a red in NE FL. Social media has ruined what is special by making it a fad versus a secret those who know knew about by putting in their time.


It may seem hypocritical after I just posted the article, but I agree with ya, Capt. I deleted all of my insta, facebook, etc. because I think that social is ruining hunting and fishing by focusing on the result rather than the experience. "How many did you [catch, jump, kill, see, etc]" rather than just enjoying the water flowing under the boat, the feeling of spartina in your fingertips, the way ducks make tiny adjustments in their wings just before lighting the spread. I also agree that most anglers in NEFL haven't learned how fun it is to sightfish redfish in circumstances other than when they are full-on tailing.

That said, we are lucky to have so much marsh under conservation easement, but I don't think we should lull ourselves into the false belief that it can't all be paved over and turned into South Florida if we aren't careful to bring enough people to enjoy it that folks will care enough to preserve it for future generations.


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## privateer (Dec 6, 2013)

I enjoyed Chris' article Capt. I'm glad you were able to show him the flood tide experience. 

Hope to run into you out there one day.


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## Jared D (Mar 17, 2018)

rummya87 said:


> It may seem hypocritical after I just posted the article, but I agree with ya, Capt. I deleted all of my insta, facebook, etc. because I think that social is ruining hunting and fishing by focusing on the result rather than the experience. "How many did you [catch, jump, kill, see, etc]" rather than just enjoying the water flowing under the boat, the feeling of spartina in your fingertips, the way ducks make tiny adjustments in their wings just before lighting the spread. I also agree that most anglers in NEFL haven't learned how fun it is to sightfish redfish in circumstances other than when they are full-on tailing.
> 
> That said, we are lucky to have so much marsh under conservation easement, but I don't think we should lull ourselves into the false belief that it can't all be paved over and turned into South Florida if we aren't careful to bring enough people to enjoy it that folks will care enough to preserve it for future generations.


I agree with you both Rummya87 and prinjm6... I think we need more people to preserve, but it has gotten out of hand. I have now been flood tide fishing for 10 yrs. My little brother got into it almost 20 yrs ago, and finally lured me into trying it vs my offshore fishing.
BUT, there are so many people out there now and very little etiquette. I have tried to introduce people to the sport, but been burned by those same newbies inviting their buddies.... to the point my secret flats were covered with people.

My favorite part of flood tide fishing (other than of course pursing reds) is the life on the marsh. Watching bluecrabs snatch snails from grass... a fiddler or spider crab climbing as high as possible to avoid the flood... a snipe flying around my head trying to lead me away from her nest...
All of those are the joy. The fish coming tight is just the gravy.


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## Redfan (Jul 10, 2019)

I can assure you that there is plenty of marsh if you want to get away from the crowds. I get that it sucks when one of your spots gets blown out, but based on what you’re saying...finding a new spot is the point, not catching the fish.


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## Ice Cream Man (Jul 16, 2017)

How can I find when a flood tide will happen in NC? ...... ICM


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## prinjm6 (May 13, 2015)

Redfan said:


> I can assure you that there is plenty of marsh if you want to get away from the crowds. I get that it sucks when one of your spots gets blown out, but based on what you’re saying...finding a new spot is the point, not catching the fish.


The issue is how these dudes from Jax find new marsh is by finding a guy like me with clients on his boat and just pulling right in speakers blaring, brand new looking howler bros flat cap on.

The new kids getting into the sport want the instant satisfaction and are doing it for Instagram false glory. Do you know how many days of suck it takes to find consistently productive areas? All to have it jacked up by some bro's with no respect as they'll just tell everyone because the information came by them easily.


Jared D said:


> I agree with you both Rummya87 and prinjm6... I think we need more people to preserve, but it has gotten out of hand. I have now been flood tide fishing for 10 yrs. My little brother got into it almost 20 yrs ago, and finally lured me into trying it vs my offshore fishing.
> BUT, there are so many people out there now and very little etiquette. I have tried to introduce people to the sport, but been burned by those same newbies inviting their buddies.... to the point my secret flats were covered with people.
> 
> My favorite part of flood tide fishing (other than of course pursing reds) is the life on the marsh. Watching bluecrabs snatch snails from grass... a fiddler or spider crab climbing as high as possible to avoid the flood... a snipe flying around my head trying to lead me away from her nest...
> All of those are the joy. The fish coming tight is just the gravy.


People want shit the easy way with instant gratification, to them working for it is finding where others fish. There isnt a single guide or angler in Nassau County that can call me a potlicker.


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## Redfan (Jul 10, 2019)

prinjm6 said:


> The issue is how these dudes from Jax find new marsh is by finding a guy like me with clients on his boat and just pulling right in speakers blaring, brand new looking howler bros flat cap on.
> 
> The new kids getting into the sport want the instant satisfaction and are doing it for Instagram false glory. Do you know how many days of suck it takes to find consistently productive areas? All to have it jacked up by some bro's with no respect as they'll just tell everyone because the information came by them easily.
> 
> ...


I definitely understand it’s not easy (it’s taken me years to build my run and it still changes from time to time). I’m sure it sucks even more when you’re lively hood depends on it. What can we do about it though?


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## Jared D (Mar 17, 2018)

I get that no one owns the ocean/ marshes. I also get that the more people fishing, the greater a voice we have to protect these resources....
But I wonder what the tipping point is from more people = good to more people = bad.
I think it happened several years ago in this case. 

I am not a guide/ prof fisherman. The question I am going to pose will be asked of guides who are going to have biases since this is their livelihood and everyone will have their own perspective...

But, as guides, has the increase in fly fishing been a net positive (more potential clients) or a net negative (the fisheries are being whacked by too many and/or etiquette has gone out the window)?


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## TieOneOnJax (May 24, 2018)

prinjm6 said:


> Social media has ruined what is special by making it a fad versus a secret those who know knew about by putting in their time.


I’m certainly not trying to stir the pot here, but maybe we all share in some of the blame? I looked at your Instagram page (linked from your profile page to your website to both your IG and FB) and found flood tide posts from as far back 2015. And to be clear, there’s nothing wrong with that; I’m just pointing out that you certainly haven’t been keeping the floods secret like they’re a scarce resource reserved for members of “the club,” nor have you been shy to use the very social media you blame to share your grassy grip-and-grins. 

I read a ton of posts on this site and there’s a contingent of members that’s quick to bash people for posting their scaley successes on social media. The gripe is often that the poster is doing it for “insta-fame” or something along those lines. And while that may be true, it’s equally possible that this person is just excited to share their stoke for something that makes them happy. Unfortunately, unbeknownst to them, that need to share is accompanied by the collateral damage of enticing ever more people onto the water. 

While I’m not really into the whole social media thing, I do have an Insta and I do occasionally share pics of fish. I post because I enjoy taking pictures and I enjoy sharing those pictures. So, as I alluded to earlier, I am also a little blame for the crowds. But complaining about the crowds is like complaining about traffic while you’re driving to work; while all those other cars are YOUR traffic, you are equally THEIRS. Everyone one of us is part of “the crowd” every time we shove off from the ramp. 

I’m not sure what the solution is or whether social media is good or bad, but I get the feeling it’s not going anywhere so maybe we all just need to accept that we’re part of the crowd and just enjoy every day we get to spend in this beautiful and unique part of the world (even if there is some bro in a flat-bill cap across the creek slamming his yeti lid after retrieving his PBR while blasting his radio and fist-bumping with his homies).


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## prinjm6 (May 13, 2015)

TieOneOnJax said:


> I’m certainly not trying to stir the pot here, but maybe we all share in some of the blame? I looked at your Instagram page (linked from your profile page to your website to both your IG and FB) and found flood tide posts from as far back 2015. And to be clear, there’s nothing wrong with that; I’m just pointing out that you certainly haven’t been keeping the floods secret like they’re a scarce resource reserved for members of “the club,” nor have you been shy to use the very social media you blame to share your grassy grip-and-grins.
> 
> I read a ton of posts on this site and there’s a contingent of members that’s quick to bash people for posting their scaley successes on social media. The gripe is often that the poster is doing it for “insta-fame” or something along those lines. And while that may be true, it’s equally possible that this person is just excited to share their stoke for something that makes them happy. Unfortunately, unbeknownst to them, that need to share is accompanied by the collateral damage of enticing ever more people onto the water.
> 
> ...



I use Instagram for free advertising, it's also linked to my business website. As far as the "flood tides" go I started fishing them back in 2006 at 16yrs old in my 1520 Keywest. 

My beef isnt that people fish floods (God knows they couldn't spot a redfish any other way), do what you want to do but dont go looking for others and find your own way. I worked to learn my area and expect others to do the same and have etiquette, especially when guides have clients on the boat.


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## TieOneOnJax (May 24, 2018)

prinjm6 said:


> I use Instagram for free advertising, it's also linked to my business website. As far as the "flood tides" go I started fishing them back in 2006 at 16yrs old in my 1520 Keywest.
> 
> My beef isnt that people fish floods (God knows they couldn't spot a redfish any other way), do what you want to do but dont go looking for others and find your own way. I worked to learn my area and expect others to do the same and have etiquette, especially when guides have clients on the boat.



That makes perfect sense, and IG is probably a great way to drum up business. And I’m certainly not doubting that you did things the right way and actually learned the fishery. My point was really directed at blaming social media for ruining something and making something previously reserved for those who put in the sweat-equity a fad that’s widely advertised and known to all. Whether a post is posted for legitimate business purposes or just for “the likes,” the fact is that it’s out there for the world to see, giving exposure to the resource we all jockey for. 

As for flats etiquette, and earning the shots, I’m with you. I fished every flood I could for two entire years before I finally got a fish to hand (half because I was learning by trial and error and half because I’m generally a shitty fisherman). While he certainly wasn’t a “trophy fish,” I’ve never caught a more meaningful one and that’s a direct result of earning it the hard way. Even to this day, after fishing the greater area for nearly a decade, I’m still poking around in new areas, always hoping to discover something new. 

As for the “potlickers,” well sometimes it just feels like flats etiquette is a dying notion. While Redfan is right, there’s lots of marsh, it sometimes feels like a small group learning it all while a large group follows behind in the prop-wash, doing lots of “second-hand scouting.” Whether it’s a guide with a client, a guy who waded from shore, or a couple of flat-bill wearing, IG posting howler bros, respect should be given to all if they’ve earned it. 

And while we’re on the subject of respect for others on the flood, damn that guy in his airboat who’s burned the flat I was on multiple times in the same day. If you’re reading this, you know who you are and let it be known, no one likes you. I hope you get a snail in your shoe every time you hop overboard to chase a fish. I hope the wind is always towards you and over your right shoulder. I hope your fly line is perpetually wrapped around spartina when you go to make a cast. I hope you’re distracted by every blue crab that breaches the surface. And most of all, I hope your glasses are always dirty and you don’t have anything to clean them with.


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## Monty (Jan 10, 2018)

Florida's population doubled over the past 30 years, something like that. Its expected to double again over the next 30 years. The good old days are now. Florida wants jobs and courts big companies. When they come here, they bring new people into the state more than just offering jobs to locals. In the Gulf a friend of mine used to fish offshore exclusively. He guarded his numbers and we'd pull anchor and go if we saw another boat on the horizon. He told me on one trip anchored over a man made reef, a boat pulled up close, kept getting closer, closer, closer. He yelled something a little profane like "Hey WTF?" The guy reached down in his center console and pulled up an AK 47. My friend cranked up and left which was what the other guy wanted. Later when he told the story, he was bewildered like, an AK 47 when fishing? Really?


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## Redfan (Jul 10, 2019)

I yelled at some guy duck hunting once...he setup 150 yds downwind of me on a GA WMA. Fortunately they moved, but they ended up corking themselves by setting up 400 yds upwind of another guy. We ended up pulling over the **** at the same time, and I found out they were a couple of kids. I instantly knew they had know clue what they were doing, but understood how cool it was for them to be out there (they saved up and bought the boat together). I then explained to them how they should have done it and what etiquette while hunting is. They seemed to take it to heart, and I wish I could do the same from time to time while fishing. I learned etiquette from my daddy, not everyone getting into the sport has that. So outside of qualified captain, how do we teach em?


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