# Setting up skiff to run shallow



## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

I would never do a transom mounted pickup again, too much trash gets sucked up in it and it’s a constant fight to clean it out. Nosecone is the way to go. 
There are several guys on here with plates on keyslot transoms. You need to get a cardboard cutout of one, tape it on the motor and turn full lock both ways and see if it hits.


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

With a flat bottom hull I don't see you obtaining much more engine height than you already have. Looking at the pics it appears the water level coming off the transom is at the top of the prop hub. Any further adjustment is accomplished with the trim control.
I don't see a compression plate being all that useful without a tunnel.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Brett said:


> With a flat bottom hull I don't see you obtaining much more engine height than you already have. Looking at the pics it appears the water level coming off the transom is at the top of the prop hub. Any further adjustment is accomplished with the trim control.
> I don't see a compression plate being all that useful without a tunnel.


Several guys on here added compression plates to their motors and got great results with no tunnel. There’s nothing negative about keeping water around your prop, that’s great for tunnels, non-tunnels, straight and keyslot transoms. I have run and owned both water pickup systems and a couple of different plates as well. Hell, I even put a custom compression plate on my little Merc 15 tiller on my 12’ aluminum flat bottom and gained speed, planing ability at low speeds and was able to raise the motor about 3” higher than it could run before the plate.


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

Smack, does a compression plate have any effect with a surface piercing prop when the water level is 4 inches below the plate?
Yeah, it is a spray shield but trimmed out there is no lift and no water hump to contact on a flat bottom hull.
Tucked in the plate will add lift, but the skeg and prop will be much lower.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Brett said:


> Smack, does a compression plate have any effect with a surface piercing prop when the water level is 4 inches below the plate?
> Yeah, it is a spray shield but trimmed out there is no lift and no water hump to contact on a flat bottom hull.
> Tucked in the plate will add lift, but the skeg and prop will be much lower.


Yes the plate keeps water around the prop as it spins water up instead of just throwing water all over the place. My setup is not considered surface piercing but it does exactly that when I’m running my jackplate all the way up with the skeg even with the bottom of the hull. You have to think about the prop like a water pump. Does a water pump work better inside a housing or just spinning on a shaft without a housing to help compress water? The plate holds water around the blades and as they spin and pick up more water each rotation the “pump stays primed” so to speak. Without a plate the water just goes all over the place and is inefficient where with the plate the prop can use every bit of water it is fed.
I’ve run this prop, plate and motor height on my current boat and my last boat. I do all my fabrication, motor mounting etc my self so I notice how changes effect the performance. Both my boats run 33-34mph fully jacked with the prop above or even with the bottom of the hull. My other boat is still scooting around the Louisiana marsh with the guy that bought it. 90 Merc 2 stroke with the same custom Foreman prop, Tran plate just bigger. It has the transom mount low water pickup I set up and modified to filter water before it enters the lower unit. Works great but I like the nosecone better for running in floating grass like we get down here all over the bay when the wind blows it out of the back lakes.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

I’m not just blowing smoke, this is first hand experience. It’s hard to wrap your head around until you actually do it and watch the gain in performance over the setup before the tweaks. My buddy has my same hull with a 70 and no plate and no triple cupped prop and can’t jump up in a full boat length with us on it when my hull jumps up in about half a boat length from nearly sitting on bottom.


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## jakesterolemiss (Jan 7, 2015)

Brett said:


> Smack, does a compression plate have any effect with a surface piercing prop when the water level is 4 inches below the plate?
> Yeah, it is a spray shield but trimmed out there is no lift and no water hump to contact on a flat bottom hull.
> Tucked in the plate will add lift, but the skeg and prop will be much lower.


@Brett I should have mentioned that in those pictures where the motor is jacked up, I am not able to holeshot or run on plane. I can only idle with the motor that high. With the motor set up as is with the PT prop, I have to run my jack plate all the way down to holeshot, and can raise it 2" while on plane.


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## jakesterolemiss (Jan 7, 2015)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> I would never do a transom mounted pickup again, too much trash gets sucked up in it and it’s a constant fight to clean it out. Nosecone is the way to go.
> There are several guys on here with plates on keyslot transoms. You need to get a cardboard cutout of one, tape it on the motor and turn full lock both ways and see if it hits.


@Smackdaddy53 This is perfect, exactly what I needed to know. Thank you. I mainly fish in LA so I figured mud would clog that thing constantly. On the compression plate, I know for a fact that it would hit the sponson. My question is do they cut notches out or would that compromise the effectiveness of the compression plate? If I went with compression plate would I even need the nose cone? SO MANY QUESTIONS


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## devrep (Feb 22, 2009)

without a tunnel I would be surprised if the nosecone has any benefit.


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## devrep (Feb 22, 2009)

nice looking hull and a great outboard btw.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

With the right prop you will be able to jump on plane shallower, faster and keep hooked up and not blow out in turns. 
I could mail you a paper cutout of my compression plate and you could cut cardboard that size and tape it on your lower unit and see where it hits and what you need to do to get the plate where it needs to be. 
A nosecone pickup would work fine on a non tunnel but would most likely not be necessary because you would not be able to run the motor high enough to lose water pressure with your stock lower unit water pickups anyway. Nosecones and transom pickups are for motors that can be run so high the lower unit pickups start ingesting water causing overheating. You would be surprised how high you can run a triple cupped three blade prop and not blow out and lose water to the prop.


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## jakesterolemiss (Jan 7, 2015)

devrep said:


> without a tunnel I would be surprised if the nosecone has any benefit.


@devrep That's what I was thinking. The nosecone was already on the boat when I bought it, and I have enjoyed the benefits of being able to idle around ponds and lakes in LA with the motor jacked all the way up and trimmed down staying out of the mud.


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## jakesterolemiss (Jan 7, 2015)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> With the right prop you will be able to jump on plane shallower, faster and keep hooked up and not blow out in turns.
> I could mail you a paper cutout of my compression plate and you could cut cardboard that size and tape it on your lower unit and see where it hits and what you need to do to get the plate where it needs to be.
> A nosecone pickup would work fine on a non tunnel but would most likely not be necessary because you would not be able to run the motor high enough to lose water pressure with your stock lower unit water pickups anyway. Nosecones and transom pickups are for motors that can be run so high the lower unit pickups start ingesting water causing overheating. You would be surprised how high you can run a triple cupped three blade prop and not blow out and lose water to the prop.


@Smackdaddy53 Yes, that would be great I will PM you about that. I think the logical progression of finding out what I need is to strap on a new stock lower unit (already in the works) with the Foreman prop and go run it. Go through all the different scenarios and see what the next issue is to address...water pressure, engine height, cavitation, etc.....


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## Capnredfish (Feb 1, 2012)

Glass in a tiny hump at trailing edge of transom. Will cause a hump of water to rise at prop. I mean a small hump so you don't cause much lift or drag like a trim tab.


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## jakesterolemiss (Jan 7, 2015)

Capnredfish said:


> Glass in a tiny hump at trailing edge of transom. Will cause a hump of water to rise at prop. I mean a small hump so you don't cause much lift or drag like a trim tab.


@Capnredfish Would this be on the bottom of the hull right at the very back? I feel like that would create a lot of drag if dragging bottom. I have never heard of this before, but I always like to learn new things. Do you have any pictures?


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

jakesterolemiss said:


> @Capnredfish Would this be on the bottom of the hull right at the very back? I feel like that would create a lot of drag if dragging bottom. I have never heard of this before, but I always like to learn new things. Do you have any pictures?


I’d cut out and glass in a tunnel before I added a hump.


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## devrep (Feb 22, 2009)

or leave it alone. Deal with it or get another skiff. Jmho.


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## devrep (Feb 22, 2009)

here's what I would do. The prop you have is a cleaver with cup added. If you want to run shallower sell it or keep it as an emergency spare. Get a PowerTech SWW3. I have this prop on my 16 ft silverking. I can holeshot, run on plane and turn sharp with my














jackplate all the way up. This skiff is not a tunnel but it does have a pocket. I can't run as shallow as in my tunnel skiff but it keeps my prop away from the hard bottom we have here. The SWW3 or SWW4 has a lot of cup and the blade shape is much more effective for what you want to do.


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## Capnredfish (Feb 1, 2012)

jakesterolemiss said:


> @Capnredfish Would this be on the bottom of the hull right at the very back? I feel like that would create a lot of drag if dragging bottom. I have never heard of this before, but I always like to learn new things. Do you have any pictures?


Yes right at back. Might be 3/16 of an inch. My B2 has it.


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## Capnredfish (Feb 1, 2012)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> I’d cut out and glass in a tunnel before I added a hump.


I would try it before cutting in a tunnel. Don't like it then cut it out when doing a tunnel.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Capnredfish said:


> I would try it before cutting in a tunnel. Don't like it then cut it out when doing a tunnel.


I see where you are going with the hump. In theory it would cause the water to rise more as long as the curve follows up to the transom so there’s a smooth transition. Kind of like running water over a spoon.


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## Capnredfish (Feb 1, 2012)

I'm not even sure it needs to be very large. At least on my skiff it's almost like a small ridge only in front of lower end at bottom of transom. 1inch x3/16. Could be for water flow or an intentional hook to raise stern underway.


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## jakesterolemiss (Jan 7, 2015)

Here is the Crossroads prop that will be used as soon as the new lower unit is installed. My buddy got one for his tran cat, and after I saw what that prop did, I wore Jack's phone out for about two months asking him about what I needed. Almost every piece of advice and response from him was followed up with, "Jake, it all just depends on how mad you are at shallow water." A week later this piece of artwork showed up on my doorstep...






































I am going to run this, and see what issues I need to address with all of your suggestions in mind. I suspect it will be more than sufficient for what I need in Louisiana.


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## CurtisWright (May 9, 2012)

Cut in a Tunnel! Everyones doing it.


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## Jason (Feb 9, 2016)

That prop will blow your mind how much grip you have. People don't understand what cup is until you run one of Jack's props

Mac, you have better results with the Tran compression plates over others you've tried?


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Jason said:


> That prop will blow your mind how much grip you have. People don't understand what cup is until you run one of Jack's props
> 
> Mac, you have better results with the Tran compression plates over others you've tried?


Yes, the sides curve down more than others to hold water better, they are thicker, better looking and they will gelcoat them to match your motor if you really wanted to. I bought mine blank and cut it out to fit the way I wanted. Shaw Wings are not bad, just look crazy with all those bolts and the two piece design. They do pick up more water from the front but my hull shoots water out and the Tran catches it all without a bunch of spray like some boats I have run and the last one I “built”.


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## Jason (Feb 9, 2016)

The Shaw Wing the plates that curves up at the transom? Looked pretty slick but like you said may not be needed. Most my spray now is coming off the blades chopping at water surface


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## jimsmicro (Oct 29, 2013)

My anti ventillation plate runs 2 inches above the waterline when I'm on plane. It is literally of no benefit whatsoever except when it comes to holeshot and the ability to stay on plane at lower speeds. Once I'm up on plane it doesn't run any shallower because of the plate, that's all jackplate height and prop setup. Looking at your setup I doubt you're doing to get a whole lot more out of it, it looks super skinny to me for a non-tunnel boat.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

jimsmicro said:


> My anti ventillation plate runs 2 inches above the waterline when I'm on plane. It is literally of no benefit whatsoever except when it comes to holeshot and the ability to stay on plane at lower speeds. Once I'm up on plane it doesn't run any shallower because of the plate, that's all jackplate height and prop setup. Looking at your setup I doubt you're doing to get a whole lot more out of it, it looks super skinny to me for a non-tunnel boat.


Then what are the cons of a plate? Sounds like it does a lot and takes nothing away. Slower planing speed, better hole shot etc. are all what people want in a skiff or flats boat.
Maybe it’s because of my tunnel and backspacing but my plate catches a lot of the water the prop would throw without it. Several guys on here run plates on non tunnels (VERY similar to the OP’s) and noticed nothing but improvement.


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## jimsmicro (Oct 29, 2013)

I'm not saying there are drawbacks, there really aren't any. But it's not going to help you run any skinnier once you're up on plane, which is what the OP wants to do.


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## Blackdog317 (Jun 20, 2015)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> Then what are the cons of a plate? Sounds like it does a lot and takes nothing away. Slower planing speed, better hole shot etc. are all what people want in a skiff or flats boat.
> Maybe it’s because of my tunnel and backspacing but my plate catches a lot of the water the prop would throw without it. Several guys on here run plates on non tunnels (VERY similar to the OP’s) and noticed nothing but improvement.



I added cavitation plates on my last 2 skiffs in an attempt to improve shallow water performance. Both flat bottom, non tunnel hulls (Shaw-Wing/Banshee Extreme & Tran/BT Mosquito). With the combination of a cupped prop and cavitation plate I was able to run 2"-4" higher on plane. Without the plate I would lose water pressure and throw an overheat alarm..forcing me to shut down and let the motor cool. That can be a life-saver in certain situations where I fish. 

The plates must catch alot of water while on plane...even when they appear to be above the planing surface. Hard to say how much water without sticking your head down there to see for yourself. But, the difference in water pressure is enough to prove something good is happening. 

Faster, shallower hole-shot and the ability to run skinny on plane are critical for me. Slower planing speeds, better water pressure, added control in turns are positives. Possible loss in top end, small drop in RPM, weight, cost, time, effort, "is it really necessary for the area you fish" are all potential negatives.

The good significantly outweighs the bad in my real-world experience. Fine-tuning a skiff to make it a high performance, shallow-water fishing machine is necessary for my home waters...and I enjoy the process. The skiff is so much more capable after a few minor tweaks....


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## Blackdog317 (Jun 20, 2015)

She will run on plane at this J/P and trim setting without losing water pressure. J/P is maxed-out and motor is slightly trimmed. Sharp turns are not recommended...it will swap-ends in a hurry. There is about 6" of skeg/prop below the hull as it sits in this picture. This was not possible without the Tran plate and Foreman prop.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Blackdog317 said:


> She will run on plane at this J/P and trim setting without losing water pressure. J/P is maxed-out and motor is slightly trimmed. Sharp turns are not recommended...it will swap-ends in a hurry. There is about 6" of skeg/prop below the hull as it sits in this picture. This was not possible without the Tran plate and Foreman prop.
> View attachment 24985


And you can outrun me by a little even with an extra guy on deck!


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## Blackdog317 (Jun 20, 2015)

Had a little more throttle left too...


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Blackdog317 said:


> Had a little more throttle left too...


Now you’re just showing off


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## jakesterolemiss (Jan 7, 2015)

Blackdog317 said:


> I added cavitation plates on my last 2 skiffs in an attempt to improve shallow water performance. Both flat bottom, non tunnel hulls (Shaw-Wing/Banshee Extreme & Tran/BT Mosquito). With the combination of a cupped prop and cavitation plate I was able to run 2"-4" higher on plane. Without the plate I would lose water pressure and throw an overheat alarm..forcing me to shut down and let the motor cool. That can be a life-saver in certain situations where I fish.
> 
> The plates must catch alot of water while on plane...even when they appear to be above the planing surface. Hard to say how much water without sticking your head down there to see for yourself. But, the difference in water pressure is enough to prove something good is happening.
> 
> ...


@Blackdog317 thanks very much for your input. Especially helpful since your skiffs have been non-tunnels. I get my boat back today with a new stock lower unit and the Foreman prop installed. While fishing this week in Louisiana, I will be able to collect some data to provide to either Tran or Kevin for a cavitation plate.


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## FSUDrew99 (Feb 3, 2015)

Im running a foreman prop now on my BT Osprey. Ive always been curious how a plate would do, but wondered what would be the best application considering my sponsons....

Don't want to high jack the thread, but anyone with my same hull running a plate they find to work well and clear?


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## jakesterolemiss (Jan 7, 2015)

Update: ran the boat this weekend with the Foreman prop. I was very impressed with how it performed. Jumped up and ran with my motor jacked all the way up on 6". Of course I didn't have water pressure until I dropped it back down to about 4", but the prop did perform as Jack (and all of you) said it would. 

The only issue I have with it, is that the motor would only turn 4700 rpms at max throttle, with the motor jacked all the way up. Ran about 31-32 mph. I am sending the prop back to have it reworked, or whatever Jack recommends, because if/when I add a cavitation plate that will drop the rpms further.

On the other hand, I also ran the prop that Acadiana Propeller added cupping to. The powertech SCD4 15 pitch with added cupping was very impressive. It is much more efficient, and I picked up 2-3 mph, although this may be due to running with less motor in the water. This prop jumps up on a 3, and will run on a 5 but it starts to lose grip a little. I used to run about 31-32 at 5100 rpms, and now run that speed at 4700 rpms (test conditions very similar). The motor will turn 5600 rpms at max throttle, while running ~38 mph on the GPS.

I can't wait to see what this thing will do with a cavitation plate. Anyone know where I could get it gel coated in Yamaha grey around Lafayette? I would rather shin myself on my truck hitch than put a black or white cavitation plate on that motor.


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## snookman (Oct 21, 2009)

HEY ! THAT IS MY OLD BOAT. IT MADE IT ALL THE WAY TO TEXAS!!! I GUESS THAT IS WHERE IT BELONGS! THERE ISN'T A BETTER MADE BOAT OUT THERE!





jakesterolemiss said:


> Guys, I have been researching *read: scouring Microskiff* for quite a while now on how to set up your skiff to run as shallow as possible. I want to do this for a few reasons:
> 1. Why not?
> 2. I will be fishing TX in my skiff more often in the future.
> 3. I want to run with motor jacked up when running in new water.​I recently learned that my lower unit needed to be replaced, so now is as good a time as any to do all of this.
> ...


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## State fish rob (Jan 25, 2017)

I have an inboard well ( sponsons ) boat i use for shrimping. I cut down a cheap plastic plate to keep prop out of sponsons when trimmed up. The sponsons on this boat are close to 4’ long tho


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## jakesterolemiss (Jan 7, 2015)

snookman said:


> HEY ! THAT IS MY OLD BOAT. IT MADE IT ALL THE WAY TO TEXAS!!! I GUESS THAT IS WHERE IT BELONGS! THERE ISN'T A BETTER MADE BOAT OUT THERE!


Hey Al, yes it sure is your old boat. Technically, it hasn't made it to TX yet, but has lived a great life in LA since taking it off your hands. Still dealing with the move and unfortunately the skiff has taken a back seat. It will be on the water soon, converting some of my high HP TX cat boat buddies.


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