# Yellowstone Angler 2018 8wt Shootout



## Pierson

Great news guys! G. Loomis still makes the best fly rods! Look no further! 

Kidding.....take it for what its worth but yes they did post the latest shootout.

https://www.yellowstoneangler.com/g...tout-g-loomis-asquith-best-fly-rod-comparison


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## Steve_Mevers

Pierson said:


> Great news guys! G. Loomis still makes the best fly rods! Look no further!
> 
> Kidding.....take it for what its worth but yes they did post the latest shootout.
> 
> https://www.yellowstoneangler.com/g...tout-g-loomis-asquith-best-fly-rod-comparison


George sure does love his G Loomis rods...they are near the top every year


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## Pierson

Steve_Mevers said:


> George sure does love his G Loomis rods...they are near the top every year


Foreal....and while I wont go too much into how I feel about the Yellowstone shootouts I will say that this silly shootout has a TON of buying power for rod companies. How many Meridians do you think sold last year solely because it won the last shootout? That has to be the rod I see up for sale most frequently in the classifieds...so that tells you something. I know I bought a NRX a few years ago pretty much because it won the shootout. Fished it for a year and sold it because it didn't nearly live up to the picture those guys painted it up to be....for ME at least. I'm not saying that they aren't great rods, people love them, but these guys REALLY love them. I would bet money right now that whatever the next G Loomis high dollar rod is will win the next shootout. No doubt.


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## LowHydrogen

I drank the Meridian Kool-aid....and loved it! lol
I agree though, I don't understand why you see so many for sale. I'm fighting the urge to buy a 2 piece 10wt Meridian for sale in the classifieds right now. I need another rod like a hole in the head.


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## jonrconner

There is no doubt that there is merit to the ratings that the shootouts give out, but, just because these guys (who are all very good casters) like the rods, it doesn’t mean Joe reader (who may not be an expert caster) is going to like them, and that’s a caveat they don’t mention. They also use the SA Bonefish line, Joe might try to use an inappropriate line given the fact that there are about a hundred choices and they’re all different, it takes knowledge and skill to get the right matchup of rod and line, especially if Joe isn’t a great caster.
JC

The silver lining is that a lot of these mistakes end up on eBay at a great discount for the people who know what they want.


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## Pierson

jonrconner said:


> The silver lining is that a lot of these mistakes end up on eBay at a great discount for the people who know what they want.


I survive off these mistakes! haha


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## sjrobin

The only reason I am selling the 2pc 10wt Meridian is the 10wt Asquith rotated to the top of the six place skiff rod rack. I started carrying the 10wt Meridian on the skiff in 2016 for windy day redfish and most people liked it. So now a light 10wt is always on board. Most good casters that I know like the Meridian and NRX a lot. Especially some that had not cast a 1 pc NRX. On the other hand, some of the best fish feeders I know use 6 and 7wt rods from various builders in salt water.


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## LowHydrogen

jonrconner said:


> There is no doubt that there is merit to the ratings that the shootouts give out, but, just because these guys (who are all very good casters) like the rods, it doesn’t mean Joe reader (who may not be an expert caster) is going to like them, and that’s a caveat they don’t mention. They also use the SA Bonefish line, Joe might try to use an inappropriate line given the fact that there are about a hundred choices and they’re all different, it takes knowledge and skill to get the right matchup of rod and line, especially if Joe isn’t a great caster.
> JC
> 
> The silver lining is that a lot of these mistakes end up on eBay at a great discount for the people who know what they want.


Agree 100%, most of the distances those guys rave about are not realistic in a real fishing situation 90% of the time. I promise you, they're not limiting the false casting or trying to make a quick presentation. That may be where some of the let down comes from, "well they said casts perfectly at 90 ft?!?!", not realizing it's much more difficult on a moving boat to fish that are almost always at the wrong angle of approach, with wind that is making everything more difficult.

Why do we do this stuff again....? haha


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## crboggs

When I was a complete newb, I thought I needed a rod that could throw 100'. Now as a moderate newb, I know better. I rarely see a fish at 90'+...unless its tailing...which means I can probably sneak a little closer to make my crappy 70' cast to it. 

These guys are selling a ton of gear to fresh water guys dreaming about bonefish...IMHO...


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## redchaser

I agree with the jpnrconner that there is some merit to the Yellowstone Shootout, but your mileage may vary. I do think it's a better, more objective review/comparison than you will see most places. The truth of the matter imho is that almost nobody in the rod business is building a really bad fly rod. Some lend them selves better to certain casting and fishing styles but there aren't a whole lot of real dogs out there once you get past the el cheapo kits you find in a box store.


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## jonrconner

My feeling about these shootouts is that they’re great places to find out which rods work really well and are cheap to buy, if you look at the performance scores of some of the inexpensive rods, they’re very close to the top end, they just aren’t high on aesthetics and component quality, but for someone getting into the sport they will serve really well till that person wants something nicer. Here’s the score sheet. Look at the Fenwick Aetos!
JC


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## Steve_Mevers

LowHydrogen said:


> I drank the Meridian Kool-aid....and loved it! lol
> I agree though, I don't understand why you see so many for sale. I'm fighting the urge to buy a 2 piece 10wt Meridian for sale in the classifieds right now. I need another rod like a hole in the head.


I drank the Meridian kool aid too and really like the rod!


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## Backwater

I'm totally surprised they didn't have the Helios 3D (way faster than the 3F) and the Hardy Zephyrus SWS (again, faster than the AWS). No Sage Method (faster than the X)?? They loved the Sage X??

This panel of casters are all northern trout guys, so their idea on what a great casting saltwater rod is somewhat suspect, though I know George actually fishes the salt. I'm gonna give him some grief over this one.

Rick, they liked your Exocetts. 

Honestly, I feel the Douglas Sky is a better caster than the Asquith. But that's just me.

Ted


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## jonrconner

Backwater said:


> I'm totally surprised they didn't have the Helios 3D (way faster than the 3F) and the Hardy Zephyrus SWS (again, faster than the AWS). No Sage Method (faster than the X)?? They loved the Sage X??
> 
> This panel of casters are all northern trout guys, so their idea on what a great casting saltwater rod is somewhat suspect, though I know George actually fishes the salt. I'm gonna give him some grief over this one.
> 
> Rick, they liked your Exocetts.
> 
> Honestly, I feel the Douglas Sky is a better caster than the Asquith. But that's just me.
> 
> Ted


I think George’s son is a Florida guide?
JC


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## Pierson

Backwater said:


> This panel of casters are all northern trout guys, so their idea on what a great casting saltwater rod is somewhat suspect,


These are my feelings as well. Also confused on their model choices with the Helios and the Zephyrus. (maybe that just validates your norther trout guy statement)

But to be honest the biggest reason I have a problem with their shootouts because they don't like the rods I like


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## Blue Zone

Hmmm. I see Winston didn't make the cut this time. Or did Winston get tired of consistently being ranked at the bottom?


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## sjrobin

The new Loomis IMX Pro 1 pc did not get in the shoot out either. But maybe because it was not available.


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## redchaser

jonrconner said:


> My feeling about these shootouts is that they’re great places to find out which rods work really well and are cheap to buy, if you look at the performance scores of some of the inexpensive rods, they’re very close to the top end, they just aren’t high on aesthetics and component quality, but for someone getting into the sport they will serve really well till that person wants something nicer. Here’s the score sheet. Look at the Fenwick Aetos!
> JC
> View attachment 21591


Yes, and the BVK still comes in top 10 overall and number 12 on straight performance scoring 19 or above at all distances.


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## el9surf

Would like to see them use a more versatile line in their shootout. Bonefish lines have limited application. I suspect it's the only line they know is unlikely to overload any of the rods. No wonder they can cast 100 ft with some of the rods. Seriously what's the point of that category?
Are they even casting a fly? Or are they casting with a strand of yarn on the end?

One line simply isn't going to fit with some rods. Now that I think about it I bet the meridian with a bonefish line is amazing. I cast it with a wulff btt and it felt like a big wet $800 noodle. That's what I get for straying from the template.


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## crboggs

Casting all those rods with just one bonefish taper negates the shootout IMHO. And reinforces my earlier opinion that they're trying to sell bonefish combos to trout guys...


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## sjrobin

Here are a couple of casting videos of the Asquith 9wt (SA Grand Slam AST) and NRX 8wt 1pc(Rio red fish) in completely different situations and casting technique. The casters had never used these rods on the water before this time. I have not cast the Asquith 8wt.
Anyone can view this shared album at: https://www.icloud.com/sharedalbum/#B0iJrotZ2JtykJu


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## Backwater

jonrconner said:


> I think George’s son is a Florida guide?
> JC


No he's not. He runs currently runs Yellowstone Angler.


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## Backwater

sjrobin said:


> Here are a couple of casting videos of the Asquith 9wt (SA Grand Slam AST) and NRX 8wt 1pc(Rio red fish) in completely different situations and casting technique. The casters had never used these rods on the water before this time. I have not cast the Asquith 8wt.
> Anyone can view this shared album at: https://www.icloud.com/sharedalbum/#B0iJrotZ2JtykJu


To be honest Steve, that's not really showing much, as far as rod performances goes.


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## Rick hambric

Well I did my own shootout starting at the blackfly rendezvous and finished it the first week of October when I ordered two T&T Exocetts. Best feel rod out there. Easy to load and very fast snap. The 10wt and up are pure feelgood cannons.


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## crboggs

Backwater said:


> To be honest Steve, that's not really showing much, as far as rod performances goes.


He didn't get much bend in the rod on that water haul...but that could be on him rather than the rod...


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## sjrobin

Backwater said:


> To be honest Steve, that's not really showing much, as far as rod performances goes.


That's right Ted. Just showing fly casters in action casting at moving red fish in benign conditions. Up to that point, I had never seen any one back hand cast at that distance accurately from the front of a skiff and I doubt I will see it again.


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## Backwater

sjrobin said:


> That's right Ted. Just showing fly casters in action casting at moving red fish in benign conditions. Up to that point, I had never seen any one back hand cast at that distance accurately from the front of a skiff and I doubt I will see it again.


We haven't fished yet Steve.  When are you coming down?


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## sjrobin

Backwater said:


> We haven't fished yet Steve.  When are you coming down?


Ted you can probably work that backhand cast with a fiberglass rod. And I did invite you to fish in the Glades in 2016. Hopefully next time.


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## mightyrime

I like these reviews. I have casted maybe 20% of these rods by either owning them, friends rods or guide rods. From that knowledge and looking at the deflection charts I feel like I can make an educated guess on how the rod will perform with the lines i like to use. With that I bought an 8wt orvis recon based on the 8wt shootouts. And it is about what i expected and I like it very much. And I found it used for cheap


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## Backwater

sjrobin said:


> Ted you can probably work that backhand cast with a fiberglass rod. And I did invite you to fish in the Glades in 2016. Hopefully next time.


Opps, yea I guess you did.  We can probably meet up this year down there since I'll be hitting it hard this year.


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## crc01

crboggs said:


> Casting all those rods with just one bonefish taper negates the shootout IMHO. And reinforces my earlier opinion that *they're trying to sell bonefish combos to trout guys*...



Bingo.


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## jsnipes

Also, what's wrong w selling bonefish combos to trout guys? Bonefish are fun and trout guys deserve to catch something that fights every now and then!


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## LowHydrogen

mightyrime said:


> I like these reviews. I have casted maybe 20% of these rods by either owning them, friends rods or guide rods. From that knowledge and looking at the deflection charts I feel like I can make an educated guess on how the rod will perform with the lines i like to use. With that I bought an 8wt orvis recon based on the 8wt shootouts. And it is about what i expected and I like it very much. And I found it used for cheap


I'm not a huge Orvis fan, but....the Recon is a great rod! I used a 6wt roll casting a full sinking line all day, for two days. Didn't get the big brown I was looking for but landed two decent Steelies, and smaller browns. Roll casting a full sink line all day sucks, but that rod made it suck way less (super light) and the 6wt really stood up to some serious punishment the Steelies were 8wt class fish IMO. I was impressed.


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## crc01

jsnipes said:


> Also, what's wrong w selling bonefish combos to trout guys? Bonefish are fun and trout guys deserve to catch something that fights every now and then!



Nothing wrong with it at all. Just a way to look at how the rods are being ranked.


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## sjrobin

The best fly rods will handle multiple head weight lines. They are actually more versatile.


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## crboggs

jsnipes said:


> Also, what's wrong w selling bonefish combos to trout guys? Bonefish are fun and trout guys deserve to catch something that fights every now and then!


Nothing wrong with it...just recognizing the marketing ploy.


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## Rick hambric

sjrobin said:


> The best fly rods will handle multiple head weight lines. They are actually more versatile.


I know for a fact the Exocett will handle beautifully these bonefish and Cortland flats 8wt (115g) up to the 9wt in same lines and 8wt flatspro (140g) All depends on how much flex you want and how heavy of fly your using.


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## sjrobin

Rick hambric said:


> I know for a fact the Exocett will handle beautifully these bonefish and Cortland flats 8wt (115g) up to the 9wt in same lines and 8wt flatspro (140g) All depends on how much flex you want and how heavy of fly your using.


Thanks, good to know.


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## MSG

I have a 10 wt asquith - I think it's the best thing I've ever thrown. It's amazing with a BTT 9wt line as well as the 10 wt line. Actually, better than my 9 wt with the 9 wt line and a super light nautilus xlmax - amazing combo. However, this is all personal, but to me - it lives up to the hype.


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## redchaser

I guess I'm just not very "conspiratorial" but I think the reason they do the test with a bonefish line is because a bonefish line is fairly "neutral" in that it's a moderate taper, not overly front loaded like most redfish lines and they generally have a long enough belly or rear taper to allow for carrying a good bit of line in the air so they can do the test for longer cast. I think they "ONLY" do a bonefish line because adding multiple lines would just put too many variable into the whole thing. I mean they've got a group of volunteers testing the rods, you can't expect them to spend a week doing it. For each variable you add you essentially double the work you have to do in both testing and compiling the data. I think this test gives a starting point or frame of reference, but you should still cast and test every rod you consider purchasing, keeping in mind the type of fishing you do and the kind of cast you need to make.


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## RunningOnEmpty

I would enjoy a working mans 8wt shootout from guys that fish every weekend in the salt a lot more. Those Yellowstone guys come off as very pampered. They talk about a rod that's 1/16 of an ounce more as if it's gonna cause premature arthritis and ED SMH


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## K3anderson

RunningOnEmpty said:


> I would enjoy a working mans 8wt shootout from guys that fish every weekend in the salt a lot more. Those Yellowstone guys come off as very pampered. They talk about a rod that's 1/16 of an ounce more as if it's gonna cause premature arthritis and ED SMH


YES! Any list having a BVK in the top 10 of anything is insanity btw. Just stop.


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## Blue Zone

jsnipes said:


> Also, what's wrong w selling bonefish combos to trout guys? Bonefish are fun and trout guys deserve to catch something that fights every now and then!


Whoa, everything's relative, a 2 pounder on a 3wt or a 6 pounder on an 8wt. I'd be hard pressed to tell you which I prefer; i guess it's whichever one I'm fishing for at the moment.

God did teach trout how to jump, though...


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## kjnengr

Like some have said, if/when I read through one of the shootouts, I focus on the deflection charts and scores at the distances/situations I fish. It can provide a little feedback which can narrow decisions on which rods to try. Two criteria that I feel are totally made up and allow them to adjust the scores are the "Fun to fish "gotta have it"" and the "Perfect 8 wt" categories. The "perfect 8 wt" should be the one that scores the best overall and doesn't need a separate score for that. 

I would also like to see them do some kind of blind test. It's easy to make up scores when you know what you are casting. Just wondering.


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## cougmantx

K3anderson said:


> YES! Any list having a BVK in the top 10 of anything is insanity btw. Just stop.


Absolutely agree.


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## mtoddsolomon

I'd like to see where Clutch Archipelago would fall on this list.


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## pete_paschall

mtoddsolomon said:


> I'd like to see where Clutch Archipelago would fall on this list.


It's at the top of MY list. But no one has heard of my list...


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## el9surf

mtoddsolomon said:


> I'd like to see where Clutch Archipelago would fall on this list.


It didn't even make their list, which must mean it's performance is below their bottom tier rods. Or Maybe they didn't get paid by clutch to do a review....


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## mtoddsolomon

el9surf said:


> It didn't even make their list, which must mean it's performance is below their bottom tier rods. Or Maybe they didn't get paid by clutch to do a review....


I'm going to say it's definitely the latter.


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## el9surf

mtoddsolomon said:


> I'm going to say it's definitely the latter.


I would agree, the first part was sarcasm.


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## mtoddsolomon

@el9surf i assumed, but assuming has bit me in the ass a few times before.


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## Outearly

You know, when I was just getting rolling in fly fishing, the shootout was a great source of information, gave me the confidence to pick a rod and get after it. I had to laugh at the BVK comments earlier ... that's what I ended up with. I recommend them all the time because of TFO's super fast warranty turnaround.

I heard Lefty Kreh say, on a podcast, that any $200 rod likely casts better than the guy holding it. Certainly true in my case. All the tiny differences in rods are just that... tiny differences.

So, if the shootouts provide a good list to start with on a rod search, it has done its job.


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## crboggs

Outearly said:


> I recommend them all the time because of TFO's super fast warranty turnaround.


I laugh every time someone brings up TFO's warranty to offset the well socialized tendency of BVKs to break. A warranty is worth ZERO when you are standing on the bow of a skiff with a broken rod...


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## texasag07

crboggs said:


> I laugh every time someone brings up TFO's warranty to offset the well socialized tendency of BVKs to break. A warranty is worth ZERO when you are standing on the bow of a skiff with a broken rod...


I think alot of the BVK breakage stuff is way past its prime. A couple years ago I talked with one of the TFO reps and he said they had made some small changes to the rod to increase strength because they did have some issues with the early models. I have a 6wt BVK that I use almost weekly for the last 5-6 years and the only time I broke the rod was when I did something stupid and it broke. I also had a 8wt that got used a bunch until I changed out my rods. I haven't heard many complaints from people that fish them these days except from people that had issues a long time ago. That 6wt is prolly my favorite rod that I own. Just my opinion.


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## Outearly

crboggs said:


> I laugh every time someone brings up TFO's warranty to offset the well socialized tendency of BVKs to break. A warranty is worth ZERO when you are standing on the bow of a skiff with a broken rod...


I've had a 5, 7, and 8 BVK for several years and have fished them hard with no issues . My "warranty" claims were squashing the guides and shoving the tip into the roof of my garage. Both drooling stupid owner issues.

Sent the rods to TFO with $35 with notes explaining what happened and they sent rods with new sections back in 3 days. 

I'd buy another tomorrow.


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## K3anderson

Wouldnt take one for free.


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## EvanHammer

crboggs said:


> I laugh every time someone brings up TFO's warranty to offset the well socialized tendency of BVKs to break. A warranty is worth ZERO when you are standing on the bow of a skiff with a broken rod...


I haz confuse. Are the rods themselves socialized to break?


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## Ruddy Duck LA

You could buy two of them and still have money left over to stick in your jeans compared to "premium" rods these days.

If you break two on one trip, they you should probably just go home and look in the mirror.


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## RunningOnEmpty

Ruddy Duck LA said:


> You could buy two of them and still have money left over to stick in your jeans compared to "premium" rods these days.
> 
> If you break two on one trip, they you should probably just go home and look in the mirror.


Almost 3 of them now. Unfortunately premium fly rods keep going up. I just saw that the Sage Motive is now $500. Wasn't it $400 last year?


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## el9surf

That's how you position your premium lineup to break the 1k barrier.


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## K3anderson

crboggs said:


> A warranty is worth ZERO when you are standing on the bow of a skiff with a broken rod...


You forgot....during Tarpon season


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## crboggs

K3anderson said:


> You forgot....during Tarpon season


Yeah...those vacation days you burn during tarpon season on the good tides?

This year we'll have my new glass rod as backup if we break both of the Pro 1s.


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## MSG

crboggs said:


> Yeah...those vacation days you burn during tarpon season on the good tides?
> 
> This year we'll have my new glass rod as backup if we break both of the Pro 1s.


pro 1's don't break....


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## K3anderson

crboggs said:


> This year we'll have my new glass rod as backup if we break both of the Pro 1s.


I have a sage motive 12w as a backup. I've seen nothing to indicate the Pro1 would ever break though so.....


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## Backwater

MSG said:


> pro 1's don't break....


Lol....

I've seen the best of them break the best of them!


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## crboggs

MSG said:


> pro 1's don't break....


*lol*

But it makes good rationalization for adding another rod to the pile.


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## MSG

ok - everything can break - let's just say - pro 1's are VERY tough


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## csolf

My favorite is when George says of one rod at 80 feet “fabulous at this distance, one of the best in the shootout” and gives it an 18.5/20. Then a rod further down the list he says “not very good at this distance, didn’t have the power” then gives it an 18.0/20 only .5 lower. Hahahaha

These shootouts are pretty much entirely subjective though they try to make you think it’s quantitative it’s really just George looking at a rod and yelling out a number out of 20


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## kjnengr

csolf said:


> My favorite is when George says of one rod at 80 feet “fabulous at this distance, one of the best in the shootout” and gives it an 18.5/20. Then a rod further down the list he says “not very good at this distance, didn’t have the power” then gives it an 18.0/20 only .5 lower. Hahahaha
> 
> These shootouts are pretty much entirely subjective though they try to make you think it’s quantitative it’s really just George looking at a rod and yelling out a number out of 20


I agree completely.


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