# Gheenoe Limits?



## Charlie

Ok guys, I'm really new to all this microskiff stuff, and for a while now I've been looking to buy a first boat. So I've been  researching the various options in microskiffs to find the best fit for my uses. I will generally be fishing flats or shallow water with one other person. I'm on a really time budget (< $6000) so I came to the conclusion that a Gheenoe would probably be my best option. The only thing that keeps bugging me is I really have no idea what the limits of a gheenoe are. So if people would be willing to put some input in on things like:
-Max Persons (Not just the legal amount   )
-Speed with what motor
-Gear Hauling Capability
-Roughest conditions you'd use it in
-And actual draft

For the record I'm looking into 15'4" (or NMZ), Classic, and LT15s and LT25s. Not really interested in 13', and the 16 seems to expensive. Please correct me if it isn't.


----------



## noeettica

Welcome Sir 

I run a Classic It's Great ! It would be the cat's Ass with a 30 Hp Honda !

But if you want to run extra Skinny a 15hp 2 Stroke will get the Job Done Well ...

I Got Slamed in 3 foot seas Once but I was a Complete Idiot !!! So that is NOT Reccomended !!!

I would say That 1.5 Foot Seas are Doable after you get Lots of experiance But Still NOT reccomended !!!

Oswold Mis spelled LOL Has probibly run his gheenoe to the max He has push his boat far beyond any reasonable safety limits !!! 

and his boat can be yours ;-)

anything else You'll find it here 

Dave


----------



## HighSide25

no limits









loads of gear










i would put a 25-50hp two stroke motor if you plan on loading it up a lot.

a classic is good to move 3 grown people from point a-b, but casting with that close proximity can prove difficult.

a LT25 can move up to 6 adults, but dont expect to get on plane with a 25hp motor, and of course with that load, draft will suffer.

a LT25 with a light 15hp 2 stroke will float the shallowest. possibly 5-6 true inches if by yourself and light gear

highsiders fiberglass is much thinner and lackes true stringers. A LT25 has stringers and the glass is THICK, i would have no issue taking my LT25 in true 2 foot chop, and have. i have also had it 10 miles out the Ft pierce inlet with 3-4 foot rollers. you will get wet.

stability: you will fall out before a classic or LT flips.

you are asking a bunch for a small boat to do, but a LT25 is worth taking a serious look at. Motor size depends on what you really plan to do with it.

if you want to load a bunch of gear/people on it and cruise around the channels more, get a 40-50hp 2stroke.

if you want to float shallow and get a 15hp 2 stroke.

if you want to mix it up, get a 25hp motor,

if you want to use less gas but take a bigger draft, get a 30hp four stroke.


----------



## Charlie

Thanks for the imput, the both of you! 

Chasin Tails, nice sail! What boat is that? And is the one in the second pic a classic?

The boat I would like the most is the Lt25. IF I were to get it i'd get a 25hp for low draft and at MOST bring along 4 people. However, at the moment, it looks more likely i'll end up with a 15'4" or a classic (not that that's a bad thing  ) Nice to know about personal space issues with the classic.

In terms of gear hauling I don't think I should have a prob after seeing that photo! I at the moment do a lot of sea kayaking so all my gear s ultralight and made to fit in a 16ft 21" wide sea kayak!


----------



## HighSide25

the sail pic is out of a LT25
the camo boat is a 15'6" classic

classic is a wetter boat than the LT
highsider is even more wet. 

4 people in a highsider is do-able, but will be EXTREMELY tippy and just not a great idea w/ that much "shifting" weight

get the classic, it will be better suited for you, unless you can justify the extra coin for a LT25.


----------



## Guest

Pandion, if you are serious about skinny water fishing and a Gheenoe you are in luck. I have reciently fell in to a situation that is forcing me to, I hate to say it, sell my NMZ. This boat is fully rigged you need nothing but gas and tackle. If this is what you are looking for please PM me and we will talk price.


----------



## FSUfisher

Be careful about getting a Highsider. I'm not knocking it as it has a purpose, and I also own one, but I think it will let you down if you're looking for the versatility of a Classic or LT25. Three people is a stretch in it- I wouldn't even try four. And I wouldn't run it in much of a chop either (almost killed myself in Bob Sikes Cut trying this). Also, the room is not killer, and moving around it with a decent amount of gear inside is teh suck.


----------



## Charlie

So based upon the infromation I have gleened out of you guys is that the Classic, or if I can find used a LT, would be my best choice for the "extemes" of my use. How are these boats priced compared to like a high-sider? Price is still a big issue, and I will be doing most of my fishing with two people, so the High-sider is still a potentiol.

For two people the High-sider sounds nice for the price. How is this in terms of stability with two people? Remeber I'm coming from a 16'6" sea kayak with a beam of 21", so I'm comparing stability to that.

Also, thanks for all the help. ;D
These are things I've been trying to figure out for awhile. So finally I figured the best people to ask were those who use the boat.


----------



## Bissell

i fished out of a ocean kayak scrambler xt for about 2 years befor i got my NMZ and i tell you it feels like a bigger skiff, but thats me, and if you get a highsider or NMZ make sure you have the false floor added (assuming its new) the floor makes a huge differance, half my boat has it and the other half doesnt and ill be sure to add it in the front verry soon


----------



## Charlie

How if that boat on flats? At the moment I use a Kestrel 140 from Current Designs for a fishing kayak, and it works relativly well. There are a couple of problem, however, that make it very ineffective for true flats fishing

-It's a sit-in. I knew i'd have trouble because of this, but went with it anyways so I had camping capabilities. In the end I got a boat that was better at camping than fishing.
-DISTANCE! My destination has to be 10 miles away or it's over a 20 mile day. So this puts most of Flamingo (my favorite place to fish) out of bounds. The 10k are great, especially around Tiger and Indian, and upper Biscayne is also do able.

I'm assuming the NMZ gets ride of both of these issues. How far do you go usually with the NMZ? As I said I would like to fish Flamingo.


----------



## Bissell

well last time i was out with my dad, im 150 and hes around 200, plus about 4 gal. of gas and a 15 hp merc 2 stk we were on reds with their backs out of the water, so that should tell you how shallow we can get, thats also with an anchor 2 full tackle bags and a small cooler with drinks, and im on the space coast, i run from the max brewer bridge all the way to the north river sometimes hitting spots on the way, with a full tank (6 gal.) and do pretty good, im not sure how many miles that is but i think from max b to the rail road bridge is maybe 4 miles? if anyone knows for sure correct me please but last week we fished just north of that so 8 mile round trip and i still have enough gas to last till i get paid again


----------



## Charlie

> we were on reds with their backs out of the water


That sounds good to me! That certainly beat my 140. 

Does any one fish out of Flamingo area and if so what boat do you use/ recomend? I'd assume on a good day a NMZ could easily go into Hells Bay and probably wouldn't have much trouble in Florida bay. However, I'd think a classic or Lt would be more productive for Florida bay? Imput?


----------



## Bissell

if your crossing the bay with a light chop you will be alright with the nmz, its a bit bumpy but its worth the fishing lol but i get god distance with my 15 and decent time too


----------



## Gramps

Pandion - I have my LT for sale and it is in your price range. Where are you located?

http://www.microskiff.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1271429933/2


----------



## goodhands_gheenoer

I'm on a really time budget (< $6000) so I came to the conclusion that a Gheenoe would probably be my best option. 

If you truly have a budget anywhere close to $6,000 then the least boat I would get is a Classic. I have owned a 15'4" highsider and fished it all over. 3 people have fallen out of the boat over the years by shifting weight without warning the other. Never sitting, they were always standing when it happened. I own a Classic now and it is so much more stable it's not even comparable. So ask yourself this.....
Will I put kids in the boat..
If someone takes a dive what is the worst outcome..
If I have to cross some rougher water which will be the better/safer boat..
You can buy a used Classic way under the budget you set for yourself.


----------



## gheenoe

IMO if you fish with someone more than 50% of the time get a classic or LT25. I have a NMZ and its great when I am by myself (90% of the time) but with two people it can get a little hectic forget three.


----------



## gnuraider

> I'm on a really time budget (< $6000) so I came to the conclusion that a Gheenoe would probably be my best option.
> 
> If you truly have a budget anywhere close to $6,000 then the least boat I would get is a Classic.  I have owned a 15'4" highsider and fished it all over.  3 people have fallen out of the boat over the years by shifting weight without warning the other.  Never sitting, they were always standing when it happened.  I own a Classic now and it is so much more stable it's not even comparable.  So ask yourself this.....
> Will I put kids in the boat..
> If someone takes a dive what is the worst outcome..
> If I have to cross some rougher water which will be the better/safer boat..
> You can buy a used Classic way under the budget you set for yourself.


I agree - Classic is the minimum boat I would recommend. Lt25 is the boat to get if you can. Gramps has a nice one for sale in your range.

I own a Classic - like CT said earlier, you CAN fit 3 adults in it, but it is not ideal unless you are really trying to get to know the others in the boat REALLY WELL.

In my opinion the NMZ/Highsider is more of a 1 person boat or for someone who is going to be doing more paddling. They are nice boats, but if I was going to be fishing 2 adults most of the time and heading into more open/choppy water conditions it would not be my first choice.

Get the LT25 if you can, you won't regret it. It has space, stability and with the right setup will get just as skinny as the NMZ. The LT25 also has the best ability to handle the occassional chop that you might run into.

Hope this helps.

Dave


----------



## JimCameron

> I'm on a really time budget (< $6000) so I came to the conclusion that a Gheenoe would probably be my best option.


I'm not knocking a Gheenoe, I loved my Classic Noe/15hp2stroke, but for $6K it is not your only option. Have you spent any time at the ramps, looking at what other people are using in your area? Ask a Noe owner to go for a ride. I've never met one that wouldn't take you for a ride. Take a look at some Carolina Skiff type boats, some G3 aluminum boats, etc. It's a lot easier to buy the right boat than to sell the wrong one. Good luck.


----------



## Charlie

Thanks everyone for all the great advice! 

From what you guys have said the NMZ seems to be out of the picture. I should go with the LT25 or LT15.

I have considered a few other boat, but most of the ones that interested me are just out of my range. If I found a good used deal on something like an IPB i'd snap it up in an instant. As for boats in my area, I'm close to lighthouse point, and believe me those boats are WAY out of my price range.

However, I don't think i'll be buying just at the moment. Summer approching, and I'm out of town for the majority of it (doing some trout and hiking in Montana area) so I don't want to buy a boat that will sit in my garage looking sad and unused for a couple of months  . I'll come back in winter in full force and hopefull then be able to make my post on the bragging page


----------



## MrSnook

I bought an LT-15 about 2 years ago I really wanted the LT-25 but couldn't quite swing the extra $$$$ at the time. I moved down from a 20' bay boat and so far I've been extremely happy with this little boat. This boat has allowed me to go and fish places I never knew existed before. I have pulled it across less than ankle deep water while wading with my daughter.

As much as I do love this boat it does have it's limitations I can fish myself, my wife and my oldest daughter (she's 5) fairly easily but I would not want to try and fish with 4 people on board or even 3 adults.


----------



## Charlie

Really good to hear that someone has and enjoys a 15. So far I've only seen review on 25s so I was wondering if there was some fatal flaw to the 15.

I wouldn't be fishing 4 people ever really. I probably wouldn't fish more than 2 people the majority of the the time. It's just if the whole family randomly decieded to get on the boat could we all fit. It's more of a "what if" than a common event. 

Mr. Snook, what motor do you have on the 15 and how fast does it go? Not a major concer of mine, since I'm usually going about 3.5 with a paddle, but just out of curiousity.

-Charlie


----------



## paint it black

Fished the Julian A. Guas tournament today, and I was surprised to see the squad of Gheenoes that manned out the conditions.
Some were even brave enough to cross Biscayne Bay over to Caesar Creek. 
It was REALLY sporty out.

2.5' chop with swells mixed in across the bay with a strong 20mph SSE wind.


----------



## backwaterbandits

The LT 15 is a tweener...It is a modified Classic.
The LT 25 is a new boat design that came into
being when the new Coast Guard method of 
calclulating HP ratings resulted in the LT 15 having
only a 15HP rating. There aren't many 15s around
and thats why much more info available on the LT 
25...Most consider it to be a superior boat.


----------



## WhiteDog70810

Stability:  I will guarantee any of the 15'+ Gheenoes will be as stable as a concrete parking lot compared to your kayak.  I am not a member of the Gheenoe Mafia, but I have played in the 15' 4" and 15' 6" versions extensively after learning to pushpole in a 14' pirogue.  They are barges in comparison!  I don't think I've ever been in a 13' so I can't vouch for them.   The 15' 4" will be less stable relative to the 15' 6", but from your perspective, you won't mind.  That being said, I've seen one guy roll a Gheenoe while pushpoling (a Classic, if I remember properly), but he probably weighed over 300# at the time, had a full load and he was never graceful.  All of the others that I've personally seen take on water involved mud motors in some way.  I have some serious reservations regarding Go-Devils and Gheenoes due to that, but they are nice set ups with regular outboards.

Load:  Gheenoes handle sane loads well.  Even with heavy loads, they will do fine.  What is the breakover point between "heavy" and "stoopid"?  I don't know, but you can feel it when they are overloaded.  The hull feels unstable and sluggish.  I guess you could fish 3 people out of a Classic if they paid close attention to each other.  I think of it as a 2 person boat that can handle some extra weight.

Seaworthiness:  I've seen Gheenoes plow through 8-10' crewboat wakes and I've seen them roll over in 6" of water in the dead calm.  Obviously, they aren't made for rough water, but they can handle a lot if you pay attention and know what you are doing. I personally wouldn't  want to run them in chop over 2', but I know the hull could handle more if I could.

Speed:  I don't know specific numbers.  I know I wouldn't overpower these hulls.

Bottom line: they are dang good hunting/fishing boats so long as you play by their rules.

Why don't I own one?  I don't like how they pushpole in the mud, which is a serious issue when you duck hunt in Louisiana.  If you keep water under the keel, they are pretty nice.

Nate


----------



## CatchBravo

WE HAD 4 PEOPLE ON A GHEENOE TRYING TO FLIP IT AND ITS A STURDY SUCKER! ofcourse without an engine! theyre great but dont lean while your buddy is standing up or hes going in! 


> Ok guys, I'm really new to all this microskiff stuff, and for a while now I've been looking to buy a first boat. So I've been  researching the various options in microskiffs to find the best fit for my uses. I will generally be fishing flats or shallow water with one other person. I'm on a really time budget (< $6000) so I came to the conclusion that a Gheenoe would probably be my best option. The only thing that keeps bugging me is I really have no idea what the limits of a gheenoe are. So if people would be willing to put some input in on things like:
> -Max Persons (Not just the legal amount   )
> -Speed with what motor
> -Gear Hauling Capability
> -Roughest conditions you'd use it in
> -And actual draft
> 
> For the record I'm looking into 15'4" (or NMZ), Classic, and LT15s and LT25s. Not really interested in 13', and the 16 seems to expensive. Please correct me if it isn't.


----------



## skinnywater3

All these gheenoe stories are crazy. Be careful guys


----------



## HotRod35

Guest said:


> Pandion, if you are serious about skinny water fishing and a Gheenoe you are in luck. I have reciently fell in to a situation that is forcing me to, I hate to say it, sell my NMZ. This boat is fully rigged you need nothing but gas and tackle. If this is what you are looking for please PM me and we will talk price.


Did you ever get rid of the boat?


----------



## jonterr

HotRod35 said:


> Did you ever get rid of the boat?


I doubt it
That was only 12 years ago


----------



## Smackdaddy53

jonterr said:


> I doubt it
> That was only 12 years ago


Shhh, he’s getting those 20 posts the hard way


----------

