# Get 60hp our of you 40Hp Suzuki?



## Rollbar (Oct 20, 2016)

I was asking a question about Suzuki's water Jackets and during the replies, this was sent to me.
1. What are your thoughts?
2. Would this void warranty of a new motor?
3. Really?
P.S. Not sure if this goes here or ?
Thanks,
*___

Get 60hp out of 40hp Suzuki* 

In the air intake manifold, there is a round disc like part with the strange name of a “silencer holder”.

What it really is, is a air restrictor plate.
In the 40 it has a couple of 1/2” holes in it.
The 60 is just one large hole that is the full diameter of the plate.

So just remove the 40hp Silemcer Holder, and put the one from the 60hp in.

In mine, which is a DF40A, the part number for the 60hp silencer holder is 13813-88L00.

Suzuki 13813-88L00 - HOLDER, SILENCER | Boats.net


And to repeat what JC said:



> And to repeat what JC Designs said:
> 
> 
> > I am not responsible or liable for any warranty related issues, non warranty related issues, accident or loss, death and or dismemberment, epa fines, or any other issues that may arise from this “illegal” modification.


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## texasag07 (Nov 11, 2014)

It’s possible but you would have to check part numbers to ensure the injectors and computer are the same as on the 60 as well.

I would bet it will negate your warranty.


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## Rollbar (Oct 20, 2016)

texasag07 said:


> It’s possible but you would have to check part numbers to ensure the injectors and computer are the same as on the 60 as well.
> 
> I would bet it will negate your warranty.


Ya my thinking as well on all points but I have never owned a 4Stroke-Yet.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

Suzuki Outboard Parts by Model DF 40A DF 40ATL Beginning VIN# 04003F-110001 Intake Manifold / Silencer / Exhaust Cover
Suzuki Outboard Parts by Model DF 50A DF 50ATL Beginning VIN# 05003F-210001 Intake Manifold / Silencer / Exhaust Cover
Suzuki Outboard Parts by Model DF 60A DF 60ATLX Beginning VIN# 06002F-010001 Intake Manifold / Silencer / Exhaust Cover
Suzuki Outboard Parts by Year 2011 DF 60ATL Beginning VIN# 06002F-110001 Intake Manifold / Silencer / Exhaust Cover
Suzuki Outboard Parts by Year 2011 DF 40ATL Beginning VIN# 04003F-110001 Intake Manifold / Silencer / Exhaust Cover

It looks like this same piece was used on the 40, 50, and 60's in different models.

So how would it be that the same $6 piece that comes off the 40 and fits the 60 increase the hp by 50%?

Are you sure there is no other different parts as I have never seen anyone giving away something for free (except in this case it is $6)

Here is a pic of the two fuel injectors - looks to be different parts










Seems to be more to this story.

Maybe if you change the sticker on the cowling that will make it faster.


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## Rollbar (Oct 20, 2016)

I don't know but here is another reply when I mentioned the warranty etc, to the person who sent me the info.
*____*
Been running it on my 40 for 3.5 years no dramas. Know others who have also without any issues.

The engines have a map sensor and I understand the computer adjusts mixture to account for the additional airflow. It made a huge difference, we picked up nearly 700rpm and had to fit a prop with more pitch.

We actually got the info on how to do it from a Suzuki dealer!

Its a 15 minute job to put the old one back in. Your call whether you want to try it or not.


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## EdK13 (Oct 3, 2013)

Do it.


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## Rollbar (Oct 20, 2016)

EdK13 said:


> Do it.


I don't have a 4Stroke.
Was talking about it and someone sent me this information so I though I would share and find some other answers etc.
Personally, I would not do this on a warranty engine.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

Rollbar said:


> I don't know but here is another reply when I mentioned the warranty etc, to the person who sent me the info.
> *____*
> Been running it on my 40 for 3.5 years no dramas. Know others who have also without any issues.
> 
> ...


Where is this other thread - I would like to read it.


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## Rollbar (Oct 20, 2016)

DuckNut said:


> Where is this other thread - I would like to read it.


On a different forum.
Mainly just a reply as I posted above, nothing else.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

Rollbar said:


> On a different forum.
> Mainly just a reply as I posted above, nothing else.


Did a quick search and found this
Upgrade DF50 up to DF60 power? - Suzuki Outboard Forum

Seems the 40 to 50 is doable but you would need to somehow add a cylinder to make a 40 a 60.


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## Rollbar (Oct 20, 2016)

DuckNut said:


> Did a quick search and found this
> Upgrade DF50 up to DF60 power? - Suzuki Outboard Forum
> 
> Seems the 40 to 50 is doable but you would need to somehow add a cylinder to make a 40 a 60.


Yes seems that way.
Cool, wasn't on that forum but thanks.
Guess it's just easier to get the higher HP motor unless it's out of warranty and then who knows.
Thanks,


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## jmrodandgun (Sep 20, 2013)

No such thing as free lunch. If someone thinks they are getting a 50% increase in HP by removing a thirty cent piece of metal, I got bridge to sell them... Come on people. You're smarter than this!


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## Rollbar (Oct 20, 2016)

Thanks all. That is why I posted it because I know nothing about 4Strokes/these new engines etc and wanted to ask.
Thanks again!


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## State fish rob (Jan 25, 2017)

Same w/ yami f50, remove restrictor plate & you’ll gain 10hp or 20% more. Pulled this move on a 2013


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## jmrodandgun (Sep 20, 2013)

State fish rob said:


> Same w/ yami f50, remove restrictor plate & you’ll gain 10hp or 20% more. Pulled this move on a 2013


Post your dyno numbers....


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## jmrodandgun (Sep 20, 2013)

Rollbar said:


> The engines have a map sensor and I understand the computer adjusts mixture to account for the additional airflow.


Nope. Thats not how a speed density system works. If it used a mass air flow system then maybe.


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## Rollbar (Oct 20, 2016)

jmrodandgun said:


> Nope. Thats not how a speed density system works. If it used a mass air flow system then maybe.


Please remember everyone, I'm quoting a person from a discussion.
I have never said it would work or.
Just wanted to be clear.
Thanks for the replies etc. and the Yamaha comment.


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## devrep (Feb 22, 2009)

It used to be simple with carbureted 2 strokes. a manufacturer would build say a 50 hp model and then detune it for the 40hp class. usually was a matter of jetting and/or air intake and/or ecu. some could be fairly easily altered to get back to 50hp by swapping parts. with computerized and fuel injected 4 strokes I suspect its not that easy any more.


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## Rollbar (Oct 20, 2016)

devrep said:


> It used to be simple with carbureted 2 strokes. a manufacturer would build say a 50 hp model and then detune it for the 40hp class. usually was a matter of jetting and/or air intake and/or ecu. some could be fairly easily altered to get back to 50hp by swapping parts. with computerized and fuel injected 4 strokes I suspect its not that easy any more.


Ya but we see these race cars with FI and they are adjusting their timing, air intake etc with a computer.
Not sure how this works w/Outboards, the thought just popped into my head.
P.S. Real racing=old school in my book, but wow, the HP those engine put out now is amazing.


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## Caddis (Feb 2, 2020)

From looking around it seems there are a few similar conversions. Suzuki 9.9 to roughly 20. Yamaha 50hp to 60hp. Tohatsu 50hp to 60hp all four strokes. It did sound like you need to also replace the ECU (or whatever its called) to get the full HP. Some noted lots more low to mid power with just the different restrictor. Someone mentioned about $300 for parts, I can't remember which one it was for.


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## JC Designs (Apr 5, 2020)

Caddis said:


> From looking around it seems there are a few similar conversions. Suzuki 9.9 to roughly 20. Yamaha 50hp to 60hp. Tohatsu 50hp to 60hp all four strokes. It did sound like you need to also replace the ECU (or whatever its called) to get the full HP. Some noted lots more low to mid power with just the different restrictor. Someone mentioned about $300 for parts, I can't remember which one it was for.


Some do some don’t require anything more than the restrictor. Many change the ecm because they think they have to when they most likely didn’t.


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## JC Designs (Apr 5, 2020)

So since there are so many experts on the forum, I will not be responding to this thread anymore. Ya’ll take care, God bless!🙏


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## jmrodandgun (Sep 20, 2013)

Caddis said:


> From looking around it seems there are a few similar conversions. Suzuki 9.9 to roughly 20. Yamaha 50hp to 60hp. Tohatsu 50hp to 60hp all four strokes. It did sound like you need to also replace the ECU (or whatever its called) to get the full HP. Some noted lots more low to mid power with just the different restrictor. Someone mentioned about $300 for parts, I can't remember which one it was for.


It's important to discuss the purpose of the restrictor plate and why the manufactures use them across a wide range of motors. You have to ask yourself what's more likely...It's being used to reduce HP output or it's being used to reduce intake noise. To me the answer is obvious but logic is often overruled by seat-of-the-pants dyno runs.

Without being able to verify the computers ability to compensate for the added air into the system I would be concerned about creating a lean condition. 

I tend to believe the ECU does not posses the correct tables to take advantage of any extra air flow based on how speed density works. These things leave the factory tuned to a specific output at a specific RPM. Adding extra air without the ability to add extra fuel doesn't do you any good.


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## JC Designs (Apr 5, 2020)

jmrodandgun said:


> It's important to discuss the purpose of the restrictor plate and why the manufactures use them across a wide range of motors. You have to ask yourself what's more likely...It's being used to reduce HP output or it's being used to reduce intake noise. To me the answer is obvious but logic is often overruled by seat-of-the-pants dyno runs.
> 
> Without being able to verify the computers ability to compensate for the added air into the system I would be concerned about creating a lean condition.
> 
> I tend to believe the ECU does not posses the correct tables to take advantage of any extra air flow based on how speed density works. These things leave the factory tuned to a specific output at a specific RPM. Adding extra air without the ability to add extra fuel doesn't do you any good.


What exactly do you think is happening as the butterfly in the throttle body is opening? More air is being introduced to the system! The ECM/ECU then adds timing and duration to the injector pulse. It is a very simple system, I am sorry you can not comprehend it. When every single component on the 3 engines are the same minus 1 part, what magic do you think is happening? The ecm/ecu part numbers are different because the software displays the hp and epa says it has too. There is one other very small difference... the rev limit is higher on the 50/60 than the 40. All 3 have different part numbers for 1 part! Interestingly enough, you cannot take a ecm/ecu from a 60 and make 60hp with the 40. Won’t work, there is a big ass air restriction blocking the volume of air. Again, get off the google my friend. All you now, I’m done trying to teach a fool! God bless!🙏


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## Rollbar (Oct 20, 2016)

When you need more!


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## Caddis (Feb 2, 2020)

I'd try it on a used engine if I had one. Hopefully we'll hear from others who have tried it. Sounds like 3.5 years max report without issues so far. I guess could also depend on how they are run.
Someone go buy a used skiff with a 40 on it STAT!


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## JC Designs (Apr 5, 2020)

I’ll buy a brand new one next year hopefully for my X-2.0 build. I have access to a marine dyno and will post the numbers if I go through with it. Still leaning towards my old two cyl 50 johnson though! 

What allows the system to compensate is the same thing that allows it to compensate for high altitude operation without programming. The same thing that allows our vehicles that run a maf sensor to compensate at high altitudes. The map sensor may not be as accurate as a maf, but is more reliable and the reason it was chosen over the maf. The fuel required to make 20hp between 3 cylinders is a minuscule amount and this system has the ability to compensate for the added air the same as it does for lower density air at altitude. 

BTW, I have personally swapped an ecu for a 140 to a 115 with a bad ecu with absolutely no performance difference.


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## Rollbar (Oct 20, 2016)

Here he does a 50 to a 60.


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## JC Designs (Apr 5, 2020)

Rollbar said:


> Here he does a 50 to a 60.


Yeah, but the ecu DOES not need changed!
Think about this just a sec if ya’ll will...

You can take that motor from sea level and drive to 10,000 ft altitude and drop in a mountain lake. Start her up and she runs perfect. Why do ya suppose this is? The simple answer is the map sensor “although crude and less accurate” although “more durable tham a maf sensor... sends a return from to the ecu via a 5 volt reference and the ecu utilizes info from tps, cps, ckp, eng temp, rpm, iat, and yes... the map sensor to make the necessary fuel adjustments for high altitude vs sea level operation.

Honestly, it’s efi 101 folks. If we were talking turbo charging and 40-50 hp then yes a re map of ecu would be needed. But not for a few hp gain!


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## State fish rob (Jan 25, 2017)

I did this w small boat couple years ago. Super simple, no mods/ add ons necessary


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