# would like to get the #$%^@#$*&% feathers right



## iFly (Mar 9, 2010)

> ...two hackle feathers off the back.  *I just can't seem to get the feathers to lie right* and the wind pressure rolls them into the wrong plane.  Any hints on how to put them in the right position and keep them there while they get anchored, or do you just have to fuss with them until the come out right?
> 
> thnx in advance.


I feel you pain. The answer is... um... well....... :-/

The book says that two wraps will keep the feathers straight and three will make them spin. I just glue them in place if I can't get them to work with me. Then... I put two or three or eight or twenty wraps on them. It's like "rock paper scissors". Glue beats thread.


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## troutbuster (Dec 27, 2010)

make the first wraps loose, meaning not too tight, build up pressure when wrapping towards the hookeye


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## kylepyro (Oct 27, 2010)

> make the first wraps loose, meaning not too tight, build up pressure  when wrapping towards the hookeye


yep - tried that.  This fly has the feathers running off the back.  I'm creating a thread-bump at the hook-bend so they splay correctly, anchoring them mid-shank with light pressure and then winding to the bump with gradually increasing pressure.  I've tried setting them individually and together.  As I wind backwards the wind pressure always rolls the feathers out of plane.  

I suppose I could try winding loose the whole way.  I can see iFly's idea working, but I'd like to avoid slowing the process down so much.

Of course, I'd like to get it right too.

thnx for the suggestions.


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## kylepyro (Oct 27, 2010)

Here's the fly.  You can see the feathers off the back have rolled about 60 degrees on this one.  I'm trying to get them straight up and down.


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## Michael (Jul 22, 2009)

Have you tried it without the big thread bump? Sounds like the feathers are not seating properly. I try not to build up too much thread on the hook bend when I tie in the marabou or calf tail (which I tie in first). I also tie in one feather at a time then match it on the other side. Good luck I hope this helps.


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## aaronshore (Aug 24, 2007)

Also try cutting the side feathers back instead of stripping them off. Gives more meat and a flatter area. The round spine doesn't sit well on a round hook.


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## iFly (Mar 9, 2010)

> ...I can see iFly's idea working, but I'd like to avoid slowing the process down so much.
> 
> Of course, *I'd like to get it right too.*
> 
> thnx for the suggestions.


I get around the slow down by tying more than one fly. Glue the first, set it aside, glue the next, etc... and back to the first to start adding material. The glue really doesn't have to be hard. It just helps it from spinning. Whatever it takes to keep the feathers from ending up sideways.  

I usually first try to take one tight wrap to get it lined up and then follow up with a few light wraps. That usually get it done. But, if not... back to the glue. Fish hate crooked feathers.  

Good looking fly, by the way.


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## kylepyro (Oct 27, 2010)

> Also try cutting the side feathers back instead of stripping them off. Gives more meat and a flatter area. The round spine doesn't sit well on a round hook.


That's a great idea. The hook I'm using has a big flat on it.


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## lemaymiami (Feb 9, 2007)

for starters... bone - don't get frustrated with feathers not staying where you want them, everyone goes down this road...... Now for some solutions.

The hardest part is explaining this, I could show you in a moment... You beat this problem by using several small tricks in combination. First don't do anything to a tail feather except cut it to length (and if you match them all up with every tip even, etc. then cut them all at once you'll never have length problems). Since you're not going to strip off any fibers or trim them at the tie in point you'll have a much better base for the thread to catch on.... Next, rather than create any kind of bump made of thread before tying tail feathers in place, just tie in a short sparse spreader that you'll roll all around the hook shank before adding the tail feathers ( pick any material you want for the spreader as long as it's natural, not synthetic hair (although I've used everything under the sun my preference is calf tail (old timers call it kip hair). After the spreader is in place take one side of the tail (whether it's a single or multiple splayed feathers) and secure it with two or three wraps (it will help if you hold the spreader and feather from turning as you wrap. Repeat with the other side, once in place touch the thread with a tiny (very tiny) amount of super glue before the next step. The glue will penetrate all way down to the hook shank and that tail will be exactly where you placed it after a fish or two.

Once you tied a few flies with this technique (in my case 1,000s and 1,000s) it will become something you don't worry about. For speed it will help to pre-cut every material to the exact length wanted - no trimming once tied in place. For additional info find a copy of A.K. Best's Production Tying book. I use many of his techniques every day when I'm banging out an order.


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## kylepyro (Oct 27, 2010)

OK - that all sounds straigtforward enough except for the "spreader" part. If I'm understanding this right, the spreader is just a "soft gusset" like structure to flair the tail feathers rather than the hard bump bending the shaft of the feather.

and thanks for the pointer on the book. I'll track one down. ;D


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## lemaymiami (Feb 9, 2007)

I'll have to do a few pics when I get the chance... Here is one pic on a tarpon fly, the Sand Devil, that shows a bit of the spreader (for tarpon flies I want a full, short spreader, either in a color that matches the tail feathers or in this case, contrasting (orange calf tail spreader for this pattern). You'll note that it's kept very short and provides a good base for the ginger variant neck hackles that are mounted on the sides of it.


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## kylepyro (Oct 27, 2010)

The Kip Tail spreader seemed to work pretty well. I used that and then mated two feathers together on each side and that seemed to control the roll pretty well. Thanks for the tip Captain. I'll post a picture soon.

Now I just need to go somewhere to try and fish these flies. See if the fish like them.


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