# How bad is the Lagoon?



## commtrd (Aug 1, 2015)

How sad. Definitely a sign of a corrupt evil culture and governent which places money ahead of everything else, to the extent that the resource reaches final depletion and then extinction. 

The guide is doing what he can to make others aware of impending loss of the lagoon but unfortunately it will take immediate massive action to reverse course. Not likely to happen.


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## jlindsley (Nov 24, 2015)

I started a thread on the east central section of Florida sportsman. I was one of the individuals that replied on here saying there was still a decent amount of fish. (I had not fished south of George's bar though since last July). I primarily fish the north end but was down south in February and all the grass was gone. No algae bloom from july to now only hurricanes as a variable. One individual said it was the manatees and not saying this is the case but the waters were really high for a long period of time and those areas that had grass bc shallow depths still allowed sunlight would've been deep enough for seacows to munch !

http://forums.floridasportsman.com/discussion/255290/mosquito-lagoon-seagrass#latest


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## 994 (Apr 14, 2008)

*


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

The combo of high water and 0 light penetration has taken it's toll. There has been algae blooms since July, seen it first hand. Slippery creek to George's was pretty gross looking back in December. 

I was North of George's and was both shocked and upset by what I saw this past Saturday. What I saw mirrored what is going on in the South end where it's just bare sand as far as the flat goes. Not every flat, but still enough to make you cringe, especially considering how fast and drastically some of the areas have changed. Yes manatees eat a lot of grass but they can't eath the whole lagoon out of grass. Doesnt really matter at this point, they will be starving soon enough.

The whole place is either dead or on the verge. They either need to figure out a water exchange asap, or just declare it dead and move on. I might need to take up a new hobby, not sure this place will recover in my lifetime.

The day was capped off by the customary short sighted guide cleaning fish at the ramp for his client. Either oblivious or apathetic to the place that let's them fish for a living.


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

mosquitolaGOON said:


> You know, everyone has something to say about it but no one wants to do anything about it. Has anyone called our elected officials to see where the funding for IRL is going? We keep voting people into office that have no intention of protecting our natural resources. Politics is the only way to get anything substantial done. That's why after a decade of Now or Everglades they sent groups to Tallahassee. Thankfully we have people like Bill Nelson in Senate who are fighting for our waterways. Theres another local politician Mel Martin who is running for Florida Senate district 14 who is also dedicated to protecting our resources.
> 
> Dr. Aaron Adams from the Bonefish and Tarpon Trust just gave a talk at the Mid-Coast Fly Fishers meeting in New Smyrna on Monday. He used scientific data to compare our lagoon to the southern end with comparison to the collapse of the Chesapeake Bay. How many of you attended that meeting?
> 
> ...


How did the meeting go? Wasn't able to go, but would like to hear more about it.


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## 994 (Apr 14, 2008)

el9surf said:


> How did the meeting go? Wasn't able to go, but would like to hear more about it.


The meeting was good, Dr Adams is a great person, very smart. He also emphasized that water exchange will not solve our issues. Look at how much water exchange Chesapeake Bay has, and it still collapsed. It's eutrophication, which leads back to poor water regulation. You can't dump raw sewage into an estuary and expect everything to be OK. The whole "dilution is the solution" thing doesn't work, it collapses ecosystems. We need to have better systems set in place to store and treat our waste and storm water. The half cent tax in Brevard is great, but in Volusia theres still no penalty for using fertilizer in the rainy months even if you're waterfront.


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## jlindsley (Nov 24, 2015)

As an FYI commercial fishing is still open to public comment. It was originally supposed to close this year but they are trying to extend another 10 years. Sadly it may not matter in 3-5 years based on current state of lagoon. *It was critical after the blooms and now on life support in past 6 months..* 
*__
Notice of Availability for Public Review and Comment:*

*Draft Compatibility Determination and Draft Environmental Action Statement for the Proposed Extension of Commercial Fishing (Seafood Harvesting) on Merritt Island National Wildlife Refuge to September 30, 2028*



DEADLINE FOR COMMENTS

To ensure consideration of your comments in the development of the final decision and the final compatibility determination, comments need to be received by the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service by *March 30, 2018*. 

https://www.fws.gov/refuge/Merritt_Island/ (https://www.fws.gov/uploadedFiles/DRAFT%20CD-EAS%20-%20MINWRCommercialFishing20180222.pdf).



HOW TO SUBMIT COMMENTS? 

Comments may be delivered in writing by:


Emailing Merritt Island NWR, Commercial Harvesting Proposal at [email protected];
Mailing Merritt Island NWR, Commercial Harvesting Proposal at PO Box 2683, Titusville, FL 32781-2683;
Faxing Merritt Island NWR, Commercial Harvesting Proposal at 321-861-1276; or
Delivering by hand to Merritt Island NWR Headquarters, Commercial Harvesting Proposal, 1963 Refuge HQ Road, Titusville, FL 32780 (5 miles east of Titusville on SR 402).
Please include your name with your comments. Please note that all comments become part of the official public record. Requests for such comments will be handled in accordance with the Freedom of Information Act and Service and Department of the Interior policies and procedures.

*Cheri M. Ehrhardt, AICP*

Natural Resource Planner

US Fish and Wildlife Service


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## ZaneD (Feb 28, 2017)

In regards to the fish population, what would be the way to go about changing regs within the lagoon to C&R only? I would think the majority of anglers would support it.


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## jlindsley (Nov 24, 2015)

ZaneD said:


> In regards to the fish population, what would be the way to go about changing regs within the lagoon to C&R only? I would think the majority of anglers would support it.


Take some pictures when the manatees keel over..but seriously I feel that manatees and dolphins seem to trigger public outrage in comparison to a fish kill or algae bloom. I'd rather see full focus on habitat and prevention of algae blooms (septic remediation, public officials held accountable, wastewater treatment plant plans instead of dumping millions of gallons of sewage). If you ban deer hunting in an area that is cleared for development it is irrelevant as deer can't live in that habitat. If no habitat in lagoon the fish will leave or die.


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## FlyBy (Jul 12, 2013)

Bad. I fished there beginning of Feb. There are still fish there but I didn't see any grass. I don't know how the fish are living.


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## fishicaltherapist (Mar 9, 2013)

If it does NOT put $$$$ in most politician's pockets, they become totally deaf & blind, IMMEDIATELY !!!! Bill Nelson is ONE that has actually tried to help. The Lagoon area reminds me of the commercial where the Indian Chief looks out with a tear running down his face. It's a sad time for our environment.


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

I'm all for catch and release till they can address the water issues. At this point we don't need to be taking anything out of there. I'm not trying to be negative but it might not matter, it looks like it's past it's tipping point. Guess I'm failing to comprehend how a water exchange of some sort would be worse than what we are dealing with. There was a study posted here recently showing a complete water exchange every month or two. Anyone have the link to it?


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

I fished today in the banana river (or rather tried to). I hadn't fished the banana river in a while and forgot about the raw sewage dump here a few weeks ago. Couldn't see the bottom in 2' of water. Only saw one fish in 3 hours. 

I don't know what the answer is but we ain't doing enough! I'm voting against all the county commissioners that refuse to try and make it better! First up on my hit list is Tobia!


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## commtrd (Aug 1, 2015)

Sounds like it is already too late. Short of a pure miracle what could possibly remediate this situation quickly enough to reverse it?


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## Capnredfish (Feb 1, 2012)

Truly sad. I still don’t believe we know the real reason for the sudden decline. Luckily my daughter had some good years on the goon and some piccuters to remember. Question. Anyone do any clamming? Those numbers down?


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## 994 (Apr 14, 2008)

el9surf said:


> I'm all for catch and release till they can address the water issues. At this point we don't need to be taking anything out of there. I'm not trying to be negative but it might not matter, it looks like it's past it's tipping point. Guess I'm failing to comprehend how a water exchange of some sort would be worse than what we are dealing with. There was a study posted here recently showing a complete water exchange every month or two. Anyone have the link to it?


Catch and release will never happen. There’s no way you will get the public on board and the CNS will certainly look at it from a monetary position. I’m having a hell of a time fighting for a few acres of seagrass beds for pole and troll zones. You will need to fund some organization to do a comprehensive stock assessment and present it to FWC or CNS. 100% catch and release will be virtually impossible, having a closed season is relatively obtainable. However as stated above, habitat trumps organisms. You can have a closed season all year but if theres no habitat there’s no fish.

The water exchange study was submitted by the army corps of engineers. I’d rather not go there. 

Don’t forget that Tampa Bay and Chesapeake Bay were in a complete collapse much worse than Mosquito Lagoon. The root of the issue was eutrophication from runoff and water management systems. It took a while but they have rebounded.


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## Capnredfish (Feb 1, 2012)

Eat what’s left, maybe then something will happen.
2006 B2 for sale.


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## sjrobin (Jul 13, 2015)

If you live on the waterfront you are part of the problem. This country should protect from development the remainder of our coastline and buy back coastal zone when available. The impact of non-point runoff, sewer discharges, and warmer water temperatures is exponential. Florida growth has exceeded the ability of the resource to recover. This makes it seem like no one is doing any thing differently but mysteriously nature is failing. But things can change and improve with *long term solutions. *There will be stiff resistance $$$ but do not give up.


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## commtrd (Aug 1, 2015)

Yes basically there is only so much human population and infrastructure (or lack thereof in regards to sewage treatment) that an ecosystem can sustain. Between industry [farming, cattle, and big sugar] and population influx it seems FL is just not able to handle any more. So how to fix all that?


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## EdK13 (Oct 3, 2013)

commtrd said:


> Yes basically there is only so much human population and infrastructure (or lack thereof in regards to sewage treatment) that an ecosystem can sustain. Between industry [farming, cattle, and big sugar] and population influx it seems FL is just not able to handle any more. So how to fix all that?


The carrying capacity of the land and water is exceeded and bad outcomes ensue. Farming techniques have been modified over these past 70 years to the point of farmers relying exclusively on fertilizers derived from petro-chemical by product rather than time proven rotation practices that ensured beneficial soil microbes were the growth, production, and overall catalyst for maintaining homeostatic balance. Farming and ranching used to be synergistic now both are largely industrial in nature. I read that ag soil microbe counts are about 5 percent of what they were in the early 80's. This means more fertilizer must be used to realize production goals and keep them purdy lawns green. So of course run off is going to contain more pollutants. Misting ag zones, peoples yards and cattle yards with agricultural molasses would revitalize the soil bio mass and might help with some degree of remediation. Its cheap and it works. I do my yard with ag molasses/ground neem meal tea in a garden sprayer a couple times a year and use micro amounts of horse manure and chicken poo pellets for greening. Less weeds and fewer pests and, dare I say, my runoff is not toxic.

I think nearly everyone in Florida knows Big Sugar was a subsidized swindle from day one. Period. Yet here we are... It's as if Americans really need all that processed cane sugar... HA!

Finally, those that sold out and allowed nearly unfettered coastal development of environmentally sensitive/important areas without any meaningful setbacks should bear an even greater degree of scrutiny and responsibility. In the late 80's through the early 90's many, many people warned that the future would be exactly what it is now. Reckon Money won- Improving the current disaster is not impossible but- it will be difficult and will require some really creative planning and engineering.
Bottom Line: Very Sad for the lagoon-


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## Str8-Six (Jul 6, 2015)

Very sad. Never fished ML but heard stories on how great it was. Makes you really appreciate your fishery knowing that it can change in a matter of years. Do you think planting oyster mounds in place of grass is an option? Not sure if it’s right environment or if someone has tried this before. Also is it possible that the Redfish will survive without the grass?


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## EdK13 (Oct 3, 2013)

Str8-Six said:


> Very sad. Never fished ML but heard stories on how great it was. Makes you really appreciate your fishery knowing that it can change in a matter of years. Do you think planting oyster mounds in place of grass is an option? Not sure if it’s right environment or if someone has tried this before. Also is it possible that the Redfish will survive without the grass?


The symbiotic relationship between Oysters and certain sea grasses in areas where both exist is apparent to me just through simple observation. The lighthouse lakes in AP is a good example of this beneficial inter species relationship. Filter feeders clean the water and sun light reaches the grass, grass and oysters both thrive. Salinity has to be in a range and that probably means that an area that now goes from hypo to hyper saline for extended periods is not going to allow for either species to thrive. My understanding as it relates to the Lagoon- both used to thrive there. 

Reds are pretty tough, some will always survive. They just won't thrive.


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## 321nole (Jan 11, 2016)

there are oyster planting projects up and down the IRL and I believe ML as well. scaling it up to make any noticeable, widespread impact is part of the problem imo, and still doesn't resolve the underlying cause


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## EdK13 (Oct 3, 2013)

321nole said:


> there are oyster planting projects up and down the IRL and I believe ML as well. scaling it up to make any noticeable, widespread impact is part of the problem imo, and still doesn't resolve the underlying cause


Yep. Unfortunately - More of the same only leads to more of the same.


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## Net 30 (Mar 24, 2012)

I have a summer home on Martha's Vineyard on the Edgartown Great Pond. The pond is primarily brackish, around 900 acres and it's separated from the ocean by a narrow stretch of sand. The pond is full of Stripers, Clams, Oysters, Blue Crab and healthy grass beds. Since the 1600's, the Wampanoag Indians have breached the barrier beach allowing the pond to flush and the ocean to bring in clean saltwater. This has continued for hundreds of years and it keeps the pond healthy and the marine life flourishing.

We continue to open the cut 3-4 times each year by using an excavator. The cut usually stays open for 1-3 weeks and always closes by itself....nature has it's own way of healing the beach. I know it's a much smaller body of water than the Lagoon, but the results speak for itself. Weekly water monitoring is done year round and when 02 levels drop too far, the cut is opened.

Maybe the Corp should pay a visit up here and talk with the locals and see if it's scalable. Probably not, because it only costs a days rental on a CAT C9. The Fed Government would have to spend millions $ for it to be considered and take years of studies, hearings and debates.


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## 321nole (Jan 11, 2016)

Net 30 said:


> I'm blessed to have a home on Martha's Vineyard on the Edgartown Great Pond. The pond is primarily brackish, around 900 acres and it's separated from the ocean by a narrow stretch of sand. The pond is full of Stripers, Clams, Oysters, Blue Crab and healthy grass beds. Since the 1600's, the Wampanoag Indians have breached the barrier beach allowing the pond to flush and the ocean to bring in clean saltwater. This has continued for hundreds of years and it keeps the pond healthy and the marine life flourishing.
> 
> We continue to open the cut 3-4 times each year by using an excavator. The cut usually stays open for 1-3 weeks and always closes by itself....nature has it's own way of healing the beach. I know it's a much smaller body of water than the Lagoon, but the results speak for itself. Weekly water monitoring is done year round and when 02 levels drop too far, the cut is opened.
> 
> ...


What I didn’t mention in my comment about the scalability issues with planting oysters is the primary issue is money. The example you’ve provided is already a scaled example of changing water in a fish tank. Culverts and pump stations could be installed along the lagoon and IRL system to serve a very similar function. Water flow can be controlled and nutrients, salinity, and O2 levels monitored, but it comes with a hefty price tag.

Again, doesn’t fix the cause of the issues but I’d venture to guess if we could get sewer, septic, and storm water infrastructure into the correct century and pair it with culverts and pumping stations, we would be on our way back to the waterways many of you knew long before I was even born. Hell, even growing up here in the 90s the water was exponentially better.


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## bonehead (Dec 9, 2016)

Man this is sad to see. Must be similar to how Snake Bight has deteriorated with its water quality over the years. I have heard the stories from PIB about him catching over 40 reds an hour on fly.

Jeez, we really messed this pretty badass planet up.


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## Fishshoot (Oct 26, 2017)

In 1983 I was in 7th at lakeview middle school in Sanford, some folks came in to our class to talk about water quality. They spoke about agricultural runoff, septic issues and saltwater encroachment into the freshwater aquifer. To prove the point the took a glass of tap water and added a few drops of something that made all the particulate matter precipitate out, it was quite shocking to us 7th graders. When I moved out of Florida in 1991 there were over 900 people a day moving in! All that has happened in the following 27 yrs is more people, more development. Florida, like most states, is run by money particularly developers and industrial agriculture. They have not lost any power only gained it. People see a nice beach or bay and they think it’s beautiful, they don’t even stop to think if it is even alive. Money and ignorance are a deadly combination.


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## Capnredfish (Feb 1, 2012)

I want to know one thing. Why is every pond, drainage ditch, mud pit, shell pit, swamp and most every body of fresh water even remotely close to the lagoon full of life of some type and typically pretty clear. Why is it only the salt water environment is failing? I still believe we don’t know a dam thing about the reason behind it or we don’t want to because it keeps the funding for studies rolling in.


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

I disagree that local ponds, drainage ditches, etc. are 'full of life and mostly clear,' but also most water is directed towards the IRL around here. My street has drains that have a sticker on them saying they drain directly into the lagoon system; it's meant to tell people not to throw chemicals down them, but most people aren't reading stickers on drains...


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## Capnredfish (Feb 1, 2012)

My drains lead to retention ponds. Both have fish, turtles and birds. Drainage canal goes right past the neighborhood along with 3 very old ponds likely man made. We can disagree all we want on the fresh water. But nobody has pin pointed the cause. We want to believe runoff is. It may be in some places. I don’t buy run off is the reason entirely in the lagoon. A chain of events leading up to now make me think different.


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## 994 (Apr 14, 2008)

Capnredfish said:


> My drains lead to retention ponds. Both have fish, turtles and birds. Drainage canal goes right past the neighborhood along with 3 very old ponds likely man made. We can disagree all we want on the fresh water. But nobody has pin pointed the cause. We want to believe runoff is. It may be in some places. I don’t buy run off is the reason entirely in the lagoon. A chain of events leading up to now make me think different.


It’s a death of a thousand cuts. You can’t pinpoint an ecological collapse on a single factor, but when you look at the main issues it all simplifies down to eutrophication. Saltwater systems are much more ecologically complex than freshwater systems and sensitive to influxes in nitrogen and phosphorous. The retention ponds that are holding a couple soft shell turtles, cormorants, and panfish are hardly comparable to the biodiversity of an estuary like the IRL.


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## sjrobin (Jul 13, 2015)

Net 30 said:


> I have a summer home on Martha's Vineyard on the Edgartown Great Pond. The pond is primarily brackish, around 900 acres and it's separated from the ocean by a narrow stretch of sand. The pond is full of Stripers, Clams, Oysters, Blue Crab and healthy grass beds. Since the 1600's, the Wampanoag Indians have breached the barrier beach allowing the pond to flush and the ocean to bring in clean saltwater. This has continued for hundreds of years and it keeps the pond healthy and the marine life flourishing.
> 
> We continue to open the cut 3-4 times each year by using an excavator. The cut usually stays open for 1-3 weeks and always closes by itself....nature has it's own way of healing the beach. I know it's a much smaller body of water than the Lagoon, but the results speak for itself. Weekly water monitoring is done year round and when 02 levels drop too far, the cut is opened.
> 
> ...


Another major difference is the tidal movement is much larger in the Vineyard so that the flush is very effective.


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

I think it's a combo of things, but the freezes in 2010, the ongoing Lake O discharges and the constant sewage dumping in Brevard are to blame in my book. I think the runoff and septic issues are just fueling a fire that is already out of control. The issues seemed to start in the IRL south around Port St. Lucie and gradually work North long ago when they started discharging Lake O, probably around 2012. It started showing up on Sebastian and just kept moving. I have heard people say it's not connected because of the lack of flow, but I have no doubt it's related to the billions of gallons they pumped out of that lake. Wind will push contaminated water thousands of miles if given enough time.

Once it finally worked it's way North it seemed to stop around Scottsmore. A couple of really bad blooms up there and it finally made its way through Haulover. The interesting thing is the goon remained pretty clear for a couple of years while the river only a couple miles away was a mess.

For all those that say water exchange won't work I have a question. How are you so certain? Isn't it worth a try? I understan the sources of this have to be addressed, but that may take another 20 years.


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## Str8-Six (Jul 6, 2015)

All the boat traffic can’t help either. I see a lot of prop marks from google earth. More people fishing also means more fish being harvested. Just the way it is.


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## 994 (Apr 14, 2008)

Str8-Six said:


> All the boat traffic can’t help either. I see a lot of prop marks from google earth. More people fishing also means more fish being harvested. Just the way it is.


No it doesn’t help at all. Prop scars are a huge problem here in the lagoon. Here’s a petition I started for pole and troll zones over once prolific seagrass beds that are now mudflats. It’s being adopted into CNS’s fisheries management program and will hopefully see a public forum in the foreseeable future. https://www.change.org/p/u-s-fish-a...on-of-pole-and-troll-zones-in-mosquito-lagoon


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## Net 30 (Mar 24, 2012)

sjrobin said:


> Another major difference is the tidal movement is much larger in the Vineyard so that the flush is very effective.


I'm not sure. I've fished Sebastian Inlet a lot and the tidal flow thru there is downright scary. I can't imagine the volume of water that flows with each tide change.

I can't see how it would hurt to bury a few culverts along A1A and see what happens on a test basis.


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

Net 30 said:


> I'm not sure. I've fished Sebastian Inlet a lot and the tidal flow thru there is downright scary. I can't imagine the volume of water that flows with each tide change.
> 
> I can't see how it would hurt to bury a few culverts along A1A and see what happens on a test basis.


Agree 100%


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## jlindsley (Nov 24, 2015)

mosquitolaGOON said:


> No it doesn’t help at all. Prop scars are a huge problem here in the lagoon. Here’s a petition I started for pole and troll zones over once prolific seagrass beds that are now mudflats. It’s being adopted into CNS’s fisheries management program and will hopefully see a public forum in the foreseeable future. https://www.change.org/p/u-s-fish-a...on-of-pole-and-troll-zones-in-mosquito-lagoon


Need seagrass in order to have a prop scar of impact 
On a more serious note unless there is enforcement in the lagoon, the large buoys will do nothing unfortunately


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## IRLyRiser (Feb 14, 2007)

Scientists at FIT ran computer models on trying to flush ocean water through and couldn’t get a way to have enough water circulate to help. They also can’t leave the locks open without silting in the mouth of the port, the tracks the locks run on and the barge canal. The lagoon tax is starting to fund a number of projects long overdue. Unfortunately I think it’s just a waiting game now.


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## IRLyRiser (Feb 14, 2007)

And some of the worst water is around Sebastian inlet pretty often.


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

IRLyRiser said:


> Scientists at FIT ran computer models on trying to flush ocean water through and couldn’t get a way to have enough water circulate to help. They also can’t leave the locks open without silting in the mouth of the port, the tracks the locks run on and the barge canal. The lagoon tax is starting to fund a number of projects long overdue. Unfortunately I think it’s just a waiting game now.


Are you referring to this FIT study? https://www.scribd.com/document/275513792/Indian-River-Lagoon-Flushing-Model

If so, that study found that a pumping station or tidal inlet/weir system would flush the lagoon within 70 days or less!


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## albrighty_then (Jan 11, 2017)

Im asking this bc I have no idea how the system works, but would flushing the lagoon cause algea issues further down the river?


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

I think the flushing idea is based on the water being flushed with (and out to) the ocean water. Hopefully the nutrients would end up in the ocean where the effect is minimized by the volume of water.


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## albrighty_then (Jan 11, 2017)

Oh ok I was thinking it meant pumping water in and it draining back out through the inlets


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

yobata said:


> Are you referring to this FIT study? https://www.scribd.com/document/275513792/Indian-River-Lagoon-Flushing-Model
> 
> If so, that study found that a pumping station or tidal inlet/weir system would flush the lagoon within 70 days or less!



That's the study I was asking about earlier. Thanks for posting.


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

So the term eutrophication was mentioned earlier in context of why water exchange won't work, I listed the definition below. Maybe we have different views of the how to address this issue. In my eyes the idea of water exchange is a form of life support till the sources feeding this beast can be identified and addressed.

I agree that as a long term solution the water exchange won't address the root source of the problem. Based on how eutrophication works wouldn't a constant water exchange buy us some time by reducing and replacing the nutrien laden water? Can the algae blooms sustain itself if we are constantly introducing clean oxygenated water free of the nutrients it needs, while simultaneously removing the rich water that it's feeding on?

*Eutrophication* (from Greek _eutrophos_, "well-nourished"),[1] or *hypertrophication*, is when a body of water becomes overly enriched with minerals and nutrients that induce excessive growth of plants and algae.[2] This process may result in oxygen depletion of the water body.[3] One example is the "bloom" or great increase of phytoplankton in a water body as a response to increased levels of nutrients. Eutrophication is almost always induced by the discharge of nitrate or phosphate-containing detergents, fertilizers, or sewageinto an aquatic system.


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

Does anyone here have a spare fish tank or two as well as access to clean ocean water daily? Maybe we could find a way to mimic the FIT study on a smaller scale, 10 gallons and see what happens.


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## IRLyRiser (Feb 14, 2007)

I never saw that. I was just repeating what I had heard. I’m no scientist. I’m all for anything that fixes it. I think I remember the lady in charge of the clean up program for Brevard county saying that they were trying to prioritize what needed to be done so they could get the most benefit for the money at first. That mainly involves muck removal. She explained that the muck stored great amounts of nutrients and removing it was a top priority. I think if we are able to restore the lagoon’s health, we went about as close as possible to destroying it as possible before turning back somewhat.


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## dgt2012 (Apr 14, 2012)




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## dgt2012 (Apr 14, 2012)

Slap a moratorium on building permits until they have adequate sewer treatment facilities to support the growth demand. What is being done at the county level is unacceptable and irresponsible. No city can be built without the right infrastructure. So now that this has proven track of failure force all development to halt until the upgrades to the sewer treatment plants and infrastructure are completed. Whats a few years to them, the property values will always go up if the water is cleaned up. As is it a septic tank sits bath. 

To sum it up if you have to tie into the system it has to have the capacity to treat your sewage; if it does not have a working capacity that does not overflow and break regulations about sewer spills; place a moratorium on all development until the issue is resolved. 
My 2 sense


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## jlindsley (Nov 24, 2015)

Wouldn't adding a new inlet/water exchange change the salinities in the lagoon and possibly further increase the problem? Maybe not from an algae bloom perspective but habitat.?


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## dgt2012 (Apr 14, 2012)

That is part of the permitting proscess. All that information is brought forward with the proposed research and solution. Then it is all Subject to scientific analysis by FDEP & ACOE (Army corps of engineers). 

That can’t happen fast enough. We need the building moratorium to bring the political pressure to expedite it. 

My best guess is 1 year to find solution and 1 year in permitting with another year in contract acquisition and another for construction. Add one more year for noticeable improvement and five for a manageable reversal. 
10 years from now it might be improved. Doubt it and I doubt I’ll see it in my lifetime. 

Thanks to all those public administrators for the foolish administration and lack of responsible management of our resources. 
They must be held responsible.


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## Limp Shrimp (Aug 23, 2015)

el9surf said:


> Does anyone here have a spare fish tank or two as well as access to clean ocean water daily? Maybe we could find a way to mimic the FIT study on a smaller scale, 10 gallons and see what happens.


It works and it's already being done... It's how almost everyone that has a reef tank deals with nutrient build up... Some people make there own water... I used to have access to clean ocean water and just did water changes.. An inlet would def help, but it would not fix the problem and it would change a lot of types of grasses that "used" to grow in the lagoon to more salt tolerant kinds which would completely change the ecosystem... I for one would love to have access to the ocean from the Titusville area, would probably help the real estate values around there as well..


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## HelthInsXpert (Jan 24, 2018)

I just moved to the area in August and have been looking forward to getting a skiff and get on the water. Reading through this thread is pretty depressing. Looks like the deck is stacked against me before I even get started.


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## commtrd (Aug 1, 2015)

HelthInsXpert said:


> I just moved to the area in August and have been looking forward to getting a skiff and get on the water. Reading through this thread is pretty depressing. Looks like the deck is stacked against me before I even get started.


At one time it was my dream to move to FL for the fishing but after researching and discovering the situation as it is now I just don't see any point in moving there. Plus people moving to FL has been one of the contributing factors to the problem anyway. Hopefully the political will (and funding) can be found to reverse all the damage before it is too late. Unfortunately that does not look very promising right now.


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

I


commtrd said:


> At one time it was my dream to move to FL for the fishing but after researching and discovering the situation as it is now I just don't see any point in moving there. Plus people moving to FL has been one of the contributing factors to the problem anyway. Hopefully the political will (and funding) can be found to reverse all the damage before it is too late. Unfortunately that does not look very promising right now.


I wouldn't bother trying to take a vacation here if the primary goal was to fish inshore. Maybe other parts of FL, but not East CFL. They used to write magazine articles about the Lagoon and IRL, people were jealous of the fishery we had. There will be more articles written, they won't reflect a world class fishery. Probably will be titled how to avoid fuck!ng up your estuary. 

The political will isn't something I'm holding my breath on. There are so many new transplants they don't know any better. Many come from up North where they are accustomed to polluted water and more densly populated areas. The brown water is still a paradise in their eyes.


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## Ethan_W (Oct 19, 2015)

HelthInsXpert said:


> I just moved to the area in August and have been looking forward to getting a skiff and get on the water. Reading through this thread is pretty depressing. Looks like the deck is stacked against me before I even get started.



I fished the north end of the mosquito lagoon (George’s bar and north of there) last Saturday. There’s still fish. The water is clear. Was there endless fields of sea grass? Nope, patchy in spots, almost desert like in other spots. Was there a lot of boat traffic? You bet, it was a Saturday after all. 

Point I’m trying to make is, go out there and see it for yourself. After a few trips out here you’ll understand why so many people on here are so passionate about protecting and preserving the place. There’s fish to be caught. Just do everyone a favor and put that red back where you found it.


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## Rookiemistake (Jan 30, 2013)

Open the lock in canaveral is the only hope... stagnent water is the problem and the doo doo of course


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## 994 (Apr 14, 2008)

Whoa. Some of you guys are acting like this place is a barren wasteland of sewage and devoid of life. This is still an absolutely beautiful part of the country with an explosive amount of biodiversity. I walked my dog down to the river this morning and saw dolphins, manatees, and a green sea turtle. Egrets grazed and ospreys circled. The water was clear and wildlife was abundant. 

Yes, we have our issues, most waterways do unfortunately. And trust me, I will pour my heart and soul into protecting this estuary, but let’s not act like this place is dead. 

Eric, did we not pole through mostly clear water, past a bald eagle, spook trout over 10# and get you an over slot red to the boat last Saturday? Sure the numbers might not be as prolific as 10 years ago, but we saw LIFE in the small area we poled. 

If people want to give up without doing anything, then fine. I’ll buy your fly gear for dirt cheap on your way out. For others, take the time to learn about what politicians have interests in natural resources. Join the Volusia Indian River Lagoon Coalotion, project h2o, mid coast Fly fishers, etc. Volunteer with Marine Discovery Center. Donate money for research. Pick up trash. Email FWC or Canaveral National Seashore and let them know your concerns. Or just talk about it on a message board.


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

Rookiemistake said:


> Open the lock in canaveral is the only hope... stagnent water is the problem and the doo doo of course


Nice thought, but that won't happen. The port is too important of a revenue source to jeapordize.

Ethan_W don't get me wrong, we found fish, we found little bits of grass here and there and gin clear water. Just commenting on how drastic of a change I have observed in such a short time. Grass is missing by the acre everywhere you look.


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

I was in the south end of the banana river last week... I saw a Dead Sea turtle with its leg caught in a crab trap... and there are reports that people have seen poops floating in the grand canal...


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## Rookiemistake (Jan 30, 2013)

el9surf said:


> Nice thought, but that won't happen. The port is too important of a revenue source to jeapordize.
> 
> Ethan_W don't get me wrong, we found fish, we found little bits of grass here and there and gin clwater. Just commenting on how drastic of a change I have observed in such a short time. Grass is missing by the acre everywhere you look.


Lets just say they opened the cape for 24hrs every 2 weeks. Wouldnt that have a drastic affect on dirty water ? Relying on sebastian inlet for fresh water obviously isnt working.. theres some mixing for sure but just like my st augustine grass the more you water it the more it grows.... in health care we refer to it as dead space. You can add all the crap from one end but the opposite end is staying the same.basically no change. Until theres a "flush" from both ends that grass will never be back


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## Limp Shrimp (Aug 23, 2015)

Rookiemistake said:


> Open the lock in canaveral is the only hope... stagnent water is the problem and the doo doo of course


It fills the locks with sand and they end up not being able to close them.. It would be awesome if they would cut a canal out on the space center somewhere and flow some water to the S. end of the lagoon by Eddie Creek and then flush some south trough the North end of the Banana river. It probable wouldn't save the grass, but it might head of a big fish kill.


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## dgt2012 (Apr 14, 2012)

yobata said:


> I was in the south end of the banana river last week... I saw a Dead Sea turtle with its leg caught in a crab trap... and there are reports that people have seen poops floating in the grand canal...


Yup, I live on grand canal, tomato seeds and corn float on by from the discharge point. Enough to make you gag. 

I regularly take my wife on boat rides and we usually drag a lure. We always have caught fish or the 36 years I lived here, so far since the discharge nothing around here to report. I used to wade the Tortoise island flats, tarpon, snook, gator trout, now nothing. They cant live in the algae. 

We have to drive to Sebastian and Wabasso to find clean water. So I drive.


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

dgt2012 said:


> Yup, I live on grand canal, tomato seeds and corn float on by from the discharge point. Enough to make you gag.
> 
> I regularly take my wife on boat rides and we usually drag a lure. We always have caught fish or the 36 years I lived here, so far since the discharge nothing around here to report. I used to wade the Tortoise island flats, tarpon, snook, gator trout, now nothing. They cant live in the algae.
> 
> We have to drive to Sebastian and Wabasso to find clean water. So I drive.


That's pretty freaking gross and sad. I have wade fished both the Indian and Banana extensively over the years and have written them off. There was a point I would avoid the lagoon in favor of the Indian River to avoid the crowds, the fishing was epic at times. They both appear to be much worse, but it's only a matter of time for the lagoon. 

Lunch today in Rockledge. Water visibility approx 4 inches


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## crboggs (Mar 30, 2015)

mosquitolaGOON said:


> Maybe more people should quit fishing the lagoon. These fish are born here, breed here, and never leave. There's over 70 guides taking their bag limit daily. What did you expect would happen?


A big area of improvement all around the state would be breaking this mentality of "taking a limit". Unfortunately it seems like a bulk of that comes from tourists or visitors from "up North" who bring a mentality of keeping every legal fish they keep. 

Alot of the locals I know here will keep a few fish every now and then but rarely keep more than what would result in a single meal.

But how many charter outfits send tourists back to their hotels with bags of fish that will ultimately go in the trash?


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## LowHydrogen (Dec 31, 2015)

crboggs said:


> A big area of improvement all around the state would be breaking this mentality of "taking a limit". Unfortunately it seems like a bulk of that comes from tourists or visitors from "up North" who bring a mentality of keeping every legal fish they keep.
> 
> Alot of the locals I know here will keep a few fish every now and then but rarely keep more than what would result in a single meal.
> 
> But how many charter outfits send tourists back to their hotels with bags of fish that will ultimately go in the trash?


Agree 100% Head boats are a big part of that practice, while not a big threat to inshore fisheries, that mentality spreads when those people go on other trips.


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## crboggs (Mar 30, 2015)

LowHydrogen said:


> Agree 100% Head boats are a big part of that practice, while not a big threat to inshore fisheries, that mentality spreads when those people go on other trips.


Honestly...I think its a largely Yankee and/or fresh water fishing mentality. Every neighbor, friend, or family member who originates from outside of Florida always asks "Is it legal? Does it taste good? Can I keep it?" as soon as they catch a fish.

I'm raising my daughters to think before they harvest. When they catch something inshore I ask them..."Will we eat it tonight or tomorrow?" If the answer is anything but a definitive and confident "Yes" then we release the fish.

The ONLY time we harvest for the freezer is if we're meat fishing for snapper or grouper out deep.


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## K3anderson (Jan 23, 2013)

crboggs said:


> Honestly...I think its a largely Yankee and/or fresh water fishing mentality. Every neighbor, friend, or family member


EVERY?


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

mosquitolaGOON said:


> Whoa. Some of you guys are acting like this place is a barren wasteland of sewage and devoid of life. This is still an absolutely beautiful part of the country with an explosive amount of biodiversity. I walked my dog down to the river this morning and saw dolphins, manatees, and a green sea turtle. Egrets grazed and ospreys circled. The water was clear and wildlife was abundant.
> 
> Yes, we have our issues, most waterways do unfortunately. And trust me, I will pour my heart and soul into protecting this estuary, but let’s not act like this place is dead.
> 
> ...



To be fair 75% + of my fishing growing up was in the IRL / Banana. I stayed out of the lagoon intentionally so I could pole a flat all day and not compete with other boats. I knew the IRL from Scottsmore down to Sebastian very well. I act like most of my spots are a barren wasteland of sewage, devoid of life because they are. I'm sure there are a lot of folks on here that have chimed in that also grew up fishing the same areas. I fish the lagoon at this point because my other places are not worth going to. The lagoon seems to be a couple years behind the IRL / Banana, but make no mistake, the transformation in those spots started out much like the lagoon looks now.

Yes we saw some fish, an eagle, landed a nice red and saw some big trout. We also saw a lot of bare sand in places that were full of grass less than a year ago. The water is clear for now, which I think lulls people into a sense of relief that things have finally turned a corner. I realize I titled the thread with Lagoon, but in a broader scope the Lagoon is the bright spot in comparison. It's certainly nothing to brag about at the moment. I'll check out some of the groups you listed. Feel free to list any and all that you know of, maybe in a separate thread so they are easier to find.


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## LowHydrogen (Dec 31, 2015)

crboggs said:


> Honestly...I think its a largely Yankee and/or fresh water fishing mentality. Every neighbor, friend, or family member who originates from outside of Florida always asks "Is it legal? Does it taste good? Can I keep it?" as soon as they catch a fish.
> 
> I'm raising my daughters to think before they harvest. When they catch something inshore I ask them..."Will we eat it tonight or tomorrow?" If the answer is anything but a definitive and confident "Yes" then we release the fish.
> 
> The ONLY time we harvest for the freezer is if we're meat fishing for snapper or grouper out deep.


I have noticed the same thing and don't think it's malicious, I chalk it up to people that are used to fishing Bass and Panfish. They breed like rabbits, and the people fishing them may assume it's the same across the board. If you think about it, you don't get the same outlook from a fisherman that fishes Browns or Rainbows and might come from the same areas.


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## crboggs (Mar 30, 2015)

K3anderson said:


> EVERY?


*lol* You're not all "Bucket People", true.


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## crboggs (Mar 30, 2015)

LowHydrogen said:


> I have noticed the same thing and don't think it's malicious


Nah...its not malicious. Its mostly ignorant.

I was walking the beach down on Sanibel back around Thanksgiving. When I got to the light house area you could tell who the tourists were. And of course, a few had caught a pretty nice sized pompano. They were struggling to get the hook out so I knelt down with my pliers and quickly unbuttoned the fish...

Their response? "Thanks. Is it a keeper? Is it good to eat?"

My response? "Its a pompano. Do you know how to clean and cook it? Do you have a place to do it?"

Their response was a blank stare at me, like I was speaking a foreign language.

All I could do was shake my head and say, "If you're gonna kill it, please don't throw it away..." before walking on down the beach the way I'd been heading.

It was one of the biggest pompano I've ever seen...trophy sized for sure...and it likely wound up in a hotel trash can after being multilated or cooked incorrectly...


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## Str8-Six (Jul 6, 2015)

Are you talking about those same people that think Bluefish is a delicacy? I see those people at the pier all the time.


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

Str8-Six said:


> Are you talking about those same people that think Bluefish is a delicacy? I see those people at the pier all the time.


Same ones that will try to cook a tarpon or a puffer. If only they would eat the puffer lol.


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

crboggs said:


> Nah...its not malicious. Its mostly ignorant.
> 
> I was walking the beach down on Sanibel back around Thanksgiving. When I got to the light house area you could tell who the tourists were. And of course, a few had caught a pretty nice sized pompano. They were struggling to get the hook out so I knelt down with my pliers and quickly unbuttoned the fish...
> 
> ...


I would have told them it had poisionous barbs and offered to let it go for them.


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## Fritz (Jan 17, 2017)

I'm old enough to remember the first year snook season was closed, I had Jupiter inlet all to myself, both tides. These were mostly locals back then, but nobody could imagine releasing a snook. 

It was heaven!


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## MariettaMike (Jun 14, 2012)

It could use an IV


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## fishbone (Feb 17, 2015)

crboggs said:


> A big area of improvement all around the state would be breaking this mentality of "taking a limit". Unfortunately it seems like a bulk of that comes from tourists or visitors from "up North" who bring a mentality of keeping every legal fish they keep.
> 
> Alot of the locals I know here will keep a few fish every now and then but rarely keep more than what would result in a single meal.
> 
> But how many charter outfits send tourists back to their hotels with bags of fish that will ultimately go in the trash?


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## fishbone (Feb 17, 2015)

snow birds have lots of time they fish just about everyday weather permitting it is like a job for them they should take a vacation


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## ADicus (Feb 15, 2013)

I remember a few years back when the “chocolate milk” was hit and miss it would come and go but now it has seemed to really set in. There are some places still holding on with grass but for the most part it’s all too cloudy for new growth. There are still fish just like someone else had said not near the numbers we were used to seeing! I remember schools of 3-500 reds catch and release for hours until the bite died and you got tired of hitting them in the head with bait. Now it seems those schools of 3-500 have dropped to at most 30. As for the tournament fishing I was big into that just because it was fun some of you will have something to say about that and that’s ok. My point for bringing up tournaments is they have ceased the only real tournaments now are fishstock which is usually blown out from weather and has since been reduced to a 1 day fish and whenever the IFA redfish comes around. The boss man has stopped as far as I can tell which is certainly helping by not releasing 60 boats worth of weighed fish 40 miles north of where they were caught!


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## 994 (Apr 14, 2008)

Merritt Island NWR is asking for public comments about extending commercial harvesting in Refuge waters for another 10 years. They claim they didn't notify permit holders of the phase out in adequate time, so CCA is proposing a 3 year phase out of commercial fishing in the Refuge as opposed to the 10 year phase out plan. I understand the ramifications of closing down commercial fishing, as it puts families-families that I know-out of work. Maybe limit the amount of permits from 80 to 50? 30? Whatever your take, send an email and let them know what you think. 

FWS Proposal: https://www.fws.gov/uploadedFiles/DRAFT CD-EAS - MINWRCommercialFishing20180222.pdf

Email your concerns here before March 30th: [email protected]

Here is a Copy and Paste of the CCA Email:

_"In 2008, the Merritt Island National Wildlife Refuge (NWR) passed the Comprehensive Conservation Plan, including a Compatibility Determination for the phase-out of commercial fishing in the NWR, to be completed over a ten-year period. While the phase-out plan was finalized in 2008, the NWR now states it did not notify the permit holders of the plan to end commercial fishing in the area by 2018 in adequate time.

As a result, the NWR is proposing to extend the phase-out program an additional 10 years, pushing the completion of the phase-out to 2028 – a full 20 years after the original plan was first approved. It is discouraging that the NWR, which was tasked with enforcing the original plan, failed to take the necessary steps to ensure that the plan was binding.

CCA Florida believes another decade of commercial harvest is excessive and violates the spirit of the original Comprehensive Conservation Plan. However, we are willing to work in good faith with the Merritt Island NWR and the State of Florida to allow for a three-year extension for commercial harvest within the NWR. CCA Florida believes that the extension provides adequate notification for permitted individuals to move their operations to other areas outside of the Refuge.

The Merritt Island NWR will take comments until March 30th. To voice your opinion for phasing out commercial harvest in the Refuge, please email comments or mail to the Merritt Island NWR, PO Box 2683, Titusville, FL 32781.

Please include your name with comments, and thank you for taking the time to speak up on this important issue."_


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

mosquitolaGOON said:


> Merritt Island NWR is asking for public comments about extending commercial harvesting in Refuge waters for another 10 years. They claim they didn't notify permit holders of the phase out in adequate time, so CCA is proposing a 3 year phase out of commercial fishing in the Refuge as opposed to the 10 year phase out plan. I understand the ramifications of closing down commercial fishing, as it puts families-families that I know-out of work. Maybe limit the amount of permits from 80 to 50? 30? Whatever your take, send an email and let them know what you think.
> 
> FWS Proposal: https://www.fws.gov/uploadedFiles/DRAFT CD-EAS - MINWRCommercialFishing20180222.pdf
> 
> ...


Thanks for sharing.


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## commtrd (Aug 1, 2015)

crboggs said:


> A big area of improvement all around the state would be breaking this mentality of "taking a limit". Unfortunately it seems like a bulk of that comes from tourists or visitors from "up North" who bring a mentality of keeping every legal fish they keep.
> 
> Alot of the locals I know here will keep a few fish every now and then but rarely keep more than what would result in a single meal.
> 
> But how many charter outfits send tourists back to their hotels with bags of fish that will ultimately go in the trash?


Should try fishing in TX. Or LA for that matter. Here if a fish is caught that happens to be legal size, it's going in the box. Period. Salt water fishermen seem to be incapable of thinking any other way. Maybe not the fly fishing guys (few and far between) but everyone else is just never going to get over the meat haul mentality. I used to be one of those guys sadly. But it is quite obvious the effect this is having on the fishery. I remember back in the late 60's how incredible fishing in TX was. Now it is much more difficult to find quality fish due to massive fishing pressure and thousands of boats that can run in inches of water so the fish don't have the safe havens they used to have. Oh well.


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## commtrd (Aug 1, 2015)

commtrd said:


> View attachment 25355


Very good article to think about.


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## crboggs (Mar 30, 2015)

commtrd said:


> Should try fishing in TX. Or LA for that matter. Here if a fish is caught that happens to be legal size, it's going in the box. Period


Yeah...and you're talking about states that still allow tarpon kill tournies, right?


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Texas waters are well on their way. Everyone wants to sell huge plots of what used to be cattle ranches that are on the shorelines and dredge out marinas. The King Ranch is supposedly selling out and building a community called “King City” right on the water between Corpus Christi and Baffin Bay. It’s sickening.


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## SomaliPirate (Feb 5, 2016)

Look for some of the progress in Tampa Bay to be lost as well. I hear they want to do a bunch of dredging so they can handle larger cruise ships...


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## 321nole (Jan 11, 2016)

SomaliPirate said:


> Look for some of the progress in Tampa Bay to be lost as well. I hear they want to do a bunch of dredging so they can handle larger cruise ships...


Hm, correct me if I’m wrong but aren’t they more limited by the Skyway bridge clearance? I’ve been on a carnival cruise out of Tampa and we were up on the top deck when we went under the skyway and it doesn’t look like there’s much room for the larger classes of ships


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## SomaliPirate (Feb 5, 2016)

321nole said:


> Hm, correct me if I’m wrong but aren’t they more limited by the Skyway bridge clearance? I’ve been on a carnival cruise out of Tampa and we were up on the top deck when we went under the skyway and it doesn’t look like there’s much room for the larger classes of ships


From what I gather they want to build a port and dredge a channel outside the Skyway. I just wish they would use existing ports. Honestly, how hard is it to drive to Canaveral or Miami?


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

Well the fish kill is starting again, FML. These things start in one area and usually spread. The IRL was already screwed to begin with but this is just salt in the wound. Hope it doesn't spread to ML.

https://www.floridatoday.com/story/news/2018/04/10/fish-kill-cocoa-beach/502823002/?from=new-cookie


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## 321nole (Jan 11, 2016)

el9surf said:


> Well the fish kill is starting again, FML. These things start in one area and usually spread. The IRL was already screwed to begin with but this is just salt in the wound. Hope it doesn't spread to ML.
> 
> https://www.floridatoday.com/story/news/2018/04/10/fish-kill-cocoa-beach/502823002/?from=new-cookie


was only a matter of time...the algae bloom was pretty widespread this year and once it begins to die off and deplete the oxygen levels in the water...well..


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

this sucks. have never heard anyone say the ocean water isn't oxygenated enough... #FlushTheIRL


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## 321nole (Jan 11, 2016)

yobata said:


> this sucks. have never heard anyone say the ocean water isn't oxygenated enough... #FlushTheIRL


doesnt help when county leadership had an opportunity to re-appropriate some money to help fund lagoon projects and instead decided that $5M worth of astro turf for viera regional was a better idea

kills me but Ive honestly considered moving to a bay boat so I at least have the option to fish offshore on nice days


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## Sublime (Oct 9, 2015)

commtrd said:


> Now it is much more difficult to find quality fish due to massive fishing pressure and thousands of boats that can run in inches of water so the fish don't have the safe havens they used to have. Oh well.


I think the bays (Texas) are polluted with smaller reds, 24" and under. But I agree, big pigs on the Texas flats are few and far between. There are flats where I have seen a red over 30" only once in years.


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## Sublime (Oct 9, 2015)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> Texas waters are well on their way. Everyone wants to sell huge plots of what used to be cattle ranches that are on the shorelines and dredge out marinas. The King Ranch is supposedly selling out and building a community called “King City” right on the water between Corpus Christi and Baffin Bay. It’s sickening.


The King Ranch basically lost the lawsuit over ownership it has been fighting for years. Maybe the "new" owners are doing this. I know there has been lawsuits going for years, but there are recent developments. I know a guy involved and it is huge $$$$$$$$


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

321nole said:


> doesnt help when county leadership had an opportunity to re-appropriate some money to help fund lagoon projects and instead decided that $5M worth of astro turf for viera regional was a better idea
> 
> kills me but Ive honestly considered moving to a bay boat so I at least have the option to fish offshore on nice days


Didn't you hear, the Viera company now owns Brevard County and we are just its independent contractors?


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

321nole said:


> doesnt help when county leadership had an opportunity to re-appropriate some money to help fund lagoon projects and instead decided that $5M worth of astro turf for viera regional was a better idea
> 
> kills me but Ive honestly considered moving to a bay boat so I at least have the option to fish offshore on nice days


The thought of a bay boat or offshore boat is becoming more and more appealing. My waterman isn't going to have a lagoon worth fishing if this keeps up much longer.


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## fishicaltherapist (Mar 9, 2013)

I may be wrong but, if the "bald Eagle" wants to be Senator he needs to get with Senator "flip/flop, make a deal to TRULY start on cleaning up our DYING estuaries. He could start the process NOW as Governor and pour the $$$$ that are ALREADY there into a WORKING plan. SOMEBODY has got to have the BRASS 'ones" !! Thx for listening to an old fart that has seen the fisheries being destroyed for too long for nothing but $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.


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## 994 (Apr 14, 2008)

Put your money where your mouth is. Here are a handful of organizations that will take your tax free donations and lobby for political help or use it to fund scientific projects. 

Marine Resource Council http://mrcirl.org/

Volusia IRL Coalition
http://www.volusiairlcoalition.org/

Marine Discovery Center
https://www.marinediscoverycenter.org/

Project h2o
https://www.marinediscoverycenter.org/

Here’s a list of local legistlators if you have free time away from microskiff to send an email. They even have a draft available. 

http://www.projecth2o.net/#FLlegislators

Go volunteer with one of these organizations. Funding shortages make your volunteer hours extremely useful. 

Or spend your time on here complaining about glassed in fuel tanks how great things used to be.


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## el9surf (Dec 23, 2008)

mosquitolaGOON said:


> Put your money where your mouth is. Here are a handful of organizations that will take your tax free donations and lobby for political help or use it to fund scientific projects.
> 
> Marine Resource Council http://mrcirl.org/
> 
> ...



Did you ever hear back from your scientist buddy regarding the FIT water exchange study? Seems like we are at the point of needing some sort of intervention.


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## 994 (Apr 14, 2008)

el9surf said:


> Did you ever hear back from your scientist buddy regarding the FIT water exchange study? Seems like we are at the point of needing some sort of intervention.


Opening the lagoon, specifically Mosquito lagoon to the ocean will drastically change the naturally occurring species. It’s not as easy as putting in a culvert and opening it sometimes when the water gets yucky. Not to mention it would give the green light to local municipalities to continue, if not increase the amount of pollution released into the waterways. 

Stormwater runoff culverts are miles away from the proposed inlets. If there’s nothing done legally to combat the amount of pollution entering the waterway now, then the pollution will increase. Why go out of your way when you’re not obligated to? Not to mention, do you think the pollutants are going to magically go straight from the runoff points out the little culvert? No. They’re going to get dispersed and accumulate. The cute little tanks the corps uses that show dirty water flowing out to the other side are a far cry from what will naturally happen with the dirty water.


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## fishicaltherapist (Mar 9, 2013)

mosquitolaGOON said:


> Put your money where your mouth is. Here are a handful of organizations that will take your tax free donations and lobby for political help or use it to fund scientific projects.
> 
> Marine Resource Council http://mrcirl.org/
> 
> ...


Good info young man & kudos to you for getting involved ! There are some folks who sit on their backsides & do nothing but complain however, There are SEVERAL forum members who have been BUSTING their backsides for a long time including donating time,effort & $$$$. It is a fight that will continue as long as I'm breathing & sure others will also.


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