# Advice for River Boat: MV Jon vs. Skiff?



## JC Designs (Apr 5, 2020)

For a river boat I’d go with the mod v jon. When I think river, I think rocks and stumps/logs which don’t mesh well with fiberglass! So my pick for a jon would be in no particular order... alumacraft, sea ark, and crestliner. Or, an option for best of both worlds although not cheap would be a Sabine skiff!


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## scissorhands (Apr 8, 2012)

Sabine River skiff?


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## JC Designs (Apr 5, 2020)

https://www.sabineskiffs.com/


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## Jonathan David (Jun 15, 2020)

How much bigger do you want to go? In my experience, the width of a Jon boat pretty much determines stability. There are plenty of wider MV Jon boats out there to pick from, G3, Alumacraft, SeaArk, and the list goes on.
Jon boats pair well with Jet motors since they’re very light. They’re relatively inexpensive and you can customize them to fit all your needs. Oars and rod storage would be simple to figure out. 
Draft might be an issue for you. My SeaArk probably sits a good 8 inches in the water at a standstill (that’s just my guess, I’ve never measured it). 
I find that my jon is very stable, it’s a 1652. The 1660 is even wider and has more space. 
Hope this helps!


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## Hank (Jan 14, 2019)

I'm looking at a SeaArk 1652 jet tunnel for fishing the same areas as you. I think its just enough boat to be out on big lakes and rivers. but still small enough to row on smaller streams.

Probably rod storage is the biggest issue of the ones you mention. They build rod boxes but not long enough for fly rods. I have not completely figured that out yet, but tubes and rod hangers will get it done. I want a more elegant solution though. Like gunnels with rod racks underneath.

The boat will be plenty stable and easy to row. I've owned a similar boat (but with prop motor) in the past and it was a pretty good compromise all around boat. Stand up and cast, walk around all you want. Draft will be what it is according to load, but a wide flat boat floats very shallow.


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## TN-Fly-Guy (Apr 29, 2017)

This all really helpful. Glad to hear I’m not crazy for considering the Jon option for this setup. Sabine’s look awesome but are probably not in the budget right now. 

Jonathan David: Regarding size of the boat, I’m thinking in that range of 1652+. Really looking for more width in the boat to maximize usable space. 

Hank: You’re right on point with my dilemma with rod storage. Glad to hear you found a boat like this to be stable for walking/casting, etc. Have you ever used flotation pods on the back to decrease draft too?


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## Hank (Jan 14, 2019)

I have never had a boat with pods. I am pretty sure they will interfere with rowing. While ideally you’d row with bow against current, at times you’ll be turned the other way and anything grabby at the stern will make you hate it. A tunnel will do this too but I don’t think nearly so much as pods.

My last similar boat was a conventional mod v jon 16x48 with 6* bottom. It rowed very well with just raising the motor. Keep the hull as smooth on the outside as possible and keep the weight down as much as you can. For me that means a light boat and light motor and try not to carry anything but what you have to have with you.


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## JIMMYZ750 (Feb 20, 2007)

TN
I have an affinity for Gheenoes, that being said having fished the Riverhawk you would know if rocks were a problem for your area. They play heck with jon's too. Spent a fortune in 5200 chasing a leak in a jon. Fiberglass is cheap and fast, pretty is another story. Love the 13' but you should try out a Classic or the LT25 huge difference in room and stability and still drafts in spit. They accept oars easily and you can keep 4 flyrods under gunnels and out of the way easily.
You already know that type of boats capabilities so the learning curve will be zip.
Good luck and let us know what you end up fishing and some pics of freshwater trout!


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## TN-Fly-Guy (Apr 29, 2017)

Hank said:


> I have never had a boat with pods. I am pretty sure they will interfere with rowing. While ideally you’d row with bow against current, at times you’ll be turned the other way and anything grabby at the stern will make you hate it. A tunnel will do this too but I don’t think nearly so much as pods.
> 
> My last similar boat was a conventional mod v jon 16x48 with 6* bottom. It rowed very well with just raising the motor. Keep the hull as smooth on the outside as possible and keep the weight down as much as you can. For me that means a light boat and light motor and try not to carry anything but what you have to have with you.



That is such a great point about rowing with the pods. You're right that I would hope to row with the bow against the current, but I definitely imagine times where I would have the boat turned around incidentally. 

What about an anchor system? That would be a later upgrade but is something that I've thought about.


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## TN-Fly-Guy (Apr 29, 2017)

JIMMYZ750 said:


> TN
> I have an affinity for Gheenoes, that being said having fished the Riverhawk you would know if rocks were a problem for your area. They play heck with jon's too. Spent a fortune in 5200 chasing a leak in a jon. Fiberglass is cheap and fast, pretty is another story. Love the 13' but you should try out a Classic or the LT25 huge difference in room and stability and still drafts in spit. They accept oars easily and you can keep 4 flyrods under gunnels and out of the way easily.
> You already know that type of boats capabilities so the learning curve will be zip.
> Good luck and let us know what you end up fishing and some pics of freshwater trout!



Thanks for this response Jimmy! I've thought about the LT25 because you can get it customized right out of the box. In middle TN, I have not had too much bad luck with rocks yet (fingers crossed), but I have thought about taking the boat to east TN where I would worry a bit more. I have also thought about a Santee to get a bit more width on the boat. Have you rowed a boat like this?


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## Hank (Jan 14, 2019)

Adipose out in Montana has an anchor system like you would expect on a drift boat but adapted to jon boats. Although they make drift boats they also do some jet boat work. They have oarlocks as well. https://adiposeboatworks.com/


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## JIMMYZ750 (Feb 20, 2007)

TN-Fly-Guy said:


> Thanks for this response Jimmy! I've thought about the LT25 because you can get it customized right out of the box. In middle TN, I have not had too much bad luck with rocks yet (fingers crossed), but I have thought about taking the boat to east TN where I would worry a bit more. I have also thought about a Santee to get a bit more width on the boat. Have you rowed a boat like this?


I've paddeled the 13' like a canoe which works fine but only outboard, trolling motor, and poling on the Classic and LT25. Rowing is a pretty foreign concept to my type of fishing here in Florida.


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## jcpilot (May 10, 2014)

A buddy has a hog island skiff with a Tohatsu jet drive. Has oar holders too. Great boat for Midwest rocky rivers. It bounces off of rocks.


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## Shallows (Mar 29, 2020)

Get a 1648 - thats 16 feet & 48 width, they have better balance than 14' models. The 36" wide jon boats are not stable.

Also, I'd stay away from SeaArk or the heavy gauge boats as they will weigh more; instead get a roughly .08 boat and you will save at least 100 pounds which should help draft. 

Since your on a budget I'd buy something like this Lowe - it only weights 275 pounds and costs roughly $3000 brand new;

https://www.loweboats.com/jon-boats/l1648m-jon/


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## Moonpie (May 12, 2020)

As you are from Tennessee, I would highly recommend you give Frank at Big Franks Outdoors a call. Frank is located in Maryville TN and carries a variety of boats and can talk you through the plus and minus’s of each. He is a zero pressure guy and will deliver your boat to your door.

I could have purchased my Santee here in Georgia but chose to purchase from Frank.

Below is a link to a small review of the Santee 160 CC I bought. Please feel free to PM me should you have any questions about the boat. Best of luck in your search!

https://www.microskiff.com/threads/2020-santee-160-cc-review.81492/


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## TN-Fly-Guy (Apr 29, 2017)

jcpilot said:


> A buddy has a hog island skiff with a Tohatsu jet drive. Has oar holders too. Great boat for Midwest rocky rivers. It bounces off of rocks.


Love Hog Island boats just don't love the price tag right now haha. Maybe one day.


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## TN-Fly-Guy (Apr 29, 2017)

Shallows said:


> Get a 1648 - thats 16 feet & 48 width, they have better balance than 14' models. The 36" wide jon boats are not stable.
> 
> Also, I'd stay away from SeaArk or the heavy gauge boats as they will weigh more; instead get a roughly .08 boat and you will save at least 100 pounds which should help draft.
> 
> ...



This is exactly what I've been looking at doing. Less expensive than other hulls, and I could do some work to customize it myself. Any thoughts on riveted vs. welded though? That and durability was my main concern with the Lowe boats


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## TN-Fly-Guy (Apr 29, 2017)

Moonpie said:


> As you are from Tennessee, I would highly recommend you give Frank at Big Franks Outdoors a call. Frank is located in Maryville TN and carries a variety of boats and can talk you through the plus and minus’s of each. He is a zero pressure guy and will deliver your boat to your door.
> 
> I could have purchased my Santee here in Georgia but chose to purchase from Frank.
> 
> ...



Frank is great and actually is where I got my current boat. I can't recommend him enough to people looking for shallow water skiffs. I'm just really trying to narrow down what my next boat will look like as I would love to get a Hog Island or decked out Santee but probably just not in budget now. May be worth waiting to make a change until it is though?


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## flysalt060 (Aug 5, 2012)

If you are talking about the south Holston or watauga, when u say east Tn rivers, you go out the lake and up south Holston some. And a little bit of the watauga. They are more drift boat or raft rivers. Towee is a good boat.


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## TN-Fly-Guy (Apr 29, 2017)

flysalt060 said:


> If you are talking about the south Holston or watauga, when u say east Tn rivers, you go out the lake and up south Holston some. And a little bit of the watauga. They are more drift boat or raft rivers. Towee is a good boat.


That is exactly what I'm talking about. Essentially my goal/dream boat will be a type of "power drift boat." Be able to run a shallow outboard and then pull it up and row it semi well (I know it will not row as well as a regular drift boat)


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## Hank (Jan 14, 2019)

TN-Fly-Guy said:


> This is exactly what I've been looking at doing. Less expensive than other hulls, and I could do some work to customize it myself. Any thoughts on riveted vs. welded though? That and durability was my main concern with the Lowe boats


This is a good idea, especially if its just you, or you and one other person. Smaller boat, smaller motor, just enough to get’r done. But if you will spend much time on the Cumberland or Tennessee rivers, a little more boat might be better.


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## Hank (Jan 14, 2019)

Those east Tn rivers might be better with a drift boat, but you will have to have a shuttle. In some places that are not commercialized a secure shuttle might not exist. Then its you and a buddy in two vehicles running your own shuttle and that is not so convenient. And that is where the motor comes into play. Be done with shuttles.

And back to middle Tn rivers - you will mostly want the jon with a motor. They row plenty good enough. And your ability to travel farther and faster can’t be beat when you have a motor.


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## NealXB2003 (Jun 8, 2020)

Around here, those sub .100 ga boats don't hold up too well. Set an .080 ga boat on a cypress knee and you've got a new hook in the bottom. But my terrain may be a little different than most.....


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## Shallows (Mar 29, 2020)

TN-Fly-Guy said:


> This is exactly what I've been looking at doing. Less expensive than other hulls, and I could do some work to customize it myself. Any thoughts on riveted vs. welded though? That and durability was my main concern with the Lowe boats


Lowe is a very good brand - I would not hesitate to buy riveted IF buying brand new. 

Riveted and welded boats can both leak the same - even brand new ones, so there is no difference there - I'd be more concerned with buying one built by a really good brand like Lowe, SeaArk etc.


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## m32825 (Jun 29, 2018)

I sold my old Highsider to someone who drove to Central Florida from Tennessee. He wanted a boat he could run up shallow rivers and drift back with.


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## Jonathan David (Jun 15, 2020)

TN-Fly-Guy said:


> This is exactly what I've been looking at doing. Less expensive than other hulls, and I could do some work to customize it myself. Any thoughts on riveted vs. welded though? That and durability was my main concern with the Lowe boats


So I’ve owned a few Jon boats and I’ve found that welded boats are a better option for durability, regardless of who makes it.


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## Richard Vizcaino (Jun 16, 2018)

TN-Fly-Guy said:


> Hey everyone, I am looking for advice for my next river fishing boat. I currently have 13' Riverhawk with 5hp prop that I've been having fun with for the past couple of years, but I am thinking about upgrading to a bit larger boat. I am primarily on rivers in middle TN but want to be able to also fish this boat on trips elsewhere. Having said that, here is what is important for me in my next setup:
> 
> More space/ability to add rod tubes/holders - (Would like to able to easily store several fly fishing rods and keep them out of the way while heading to spots)
> Oaring capability - I primarily fly fish so I would love to get a oar setup on the boat to be able to put fishing partners on good drift lines
> ...


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## Richard Vizcaino (Jun 16, 2018)

Sturgeon Marine 
352-210-6999
17 foot skiff 25hp 4stroke 
Hull weight 200 lbs.


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## Car7x (Jun 3, 2020)

O man, river boats!

Minnesota guy here, got a place in Montana and have enjoyed the good guy deals from hyde, clack and now boulder boats. I love their drift boats. No drift boats really feel good going upriver, and they aren't built for moving around in..

I also got the good guy deal on a hog island SW16 from John and put a hydrotech modified Yamaha Enduro 50 hp 2 stroke - putting out about 65 horse, so about 40-42 through the jet - on it. 

Never felt right, rowed awful with that big motor and they are just plain slow. Soft, wavy hulls. You can hit anything you want though, can't hurt 'em. I had a trip about 4 years, just sold it.

I found a Scott duck boat, which I believe is the progenitor for the towee boats and am going to pimp it out with decks slightly longer into the cockpit from both ends but otherwise like a towee. 

I bought a 15 horse, 74# Johnson - 20 years old but in perfect shape - for my duck boat build. Put on a rock hopper Skeg and prop guard from the inventor. He's right here in the Minneapolis area. I went to a jet after my fabrication shop offered me a volume discount on skate repairs. Now I'm back to a prop but with a rock hopper, but then again I know my river stretches a lot better now having blasted thru them the last four or five years with the jet.

I'm designing normal oarlocks versus that spider frame Todd uses on the towees. Look at one of those if you can find it. 

We row a lot.

I could spring for a brand new towee, but I would still delete the rowing frame and figure out my own. This Scott is kind of a test bed to make sure that if I order one from towee It will be exactly what I want because at my age that might be the last boat. Hell this could be the last boat...

My fishing buddy just stands back and watches all this in alarm. He's got an old G3 1648 with a remote controlled troller up front, cuz he fishes by himself a lot. He's got a old Merc jet on it. That is a fast on step, flat running rig that I don't think he's got three grand in. Just a super good riverboat. 

The decks get hot and he's got to do some metal cutting to get his gas tank under the front deck and some other piddly stuff but it is a great river rig. Very stable left or right. Heavy compared to a skiff or drift boat, but wouldn't row too bad with some counterbalanced oars or some Sawyer square tops. 

A quality Jon will get you a lot of boat for the money. I think you could run some tubes up under that front storage area in a Jon or otherwise figure out safe ways to store em. In between rafts and boats I've used a lot of PVC pipes. Sometimes just for half the rod, sometimes cut in half lengthwise and lined with neoprene to lay the rods in with a totally open top. I'd spend some time looking at boats and you'll figure out a way to rig those rods. 

Rocket launchers mounted on bench or deck walls for upright storage works pretty good too. I'm a fly fisherman so even with three guys the boat we rarely have more than four rods in the boat.


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## Finatic7 (Feb 14, 2020)

In the midwest most of us were running drift boats with a small 6 or 9 hp motor when we couldn't shuttle. Not a ton of fun to motor around in, but it would get the job done when needed. Most were running Clackacrafts, but Stealthcrafts and Hydes were popular too. Stealthcraft is in Michigan and has a ton of experience in making boats for your kind of water. You can get into one of their 11' Stalker drift boats for $4,500 and it'll take a 4hp outboard. The ATB sounds like just what you are looking for...reasonably priced, durable and relatively inexpensive. I spent some time at the sticks of one and you'd be surprised at how well it rows. The best thing about a drift boat style is that it will slide over rocks where most aluminum boats will hang up and potentially get some damage from them. Towards the end of my time up there some friends went crazy about fishing the White river...one went with a Supreme L60. Probably the best river boat I've been in that can have oars but would slant toward being much better on the motor than the oars and at the high end of the cost spectrum. Another friend had the Towee Calusa. I didn't spend any time in it, but he loved it and if memory serves they are based out of TN. There's a bunch of good options, but IMHO it's hard to beat a drift boat for shallow moving water.


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## Richard Vizcaino (Jun 16, 2018)

Sturgeon Marine
352-210-6999
17 foot skiff 25hp 4stroke
Hull weight 200 lbs


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## Car7x (Jun 3, 2020)

Hey Richard, that's a sharp hull - what is it? Thanks

Craig


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## trekker (Sep 19, 2015)

jcpilot said:


> A buddy has a hog island skiff with a Tohatsu jet drive. Has oar holders too. Great boat for Midwest rocky rivers. It bounces off of rocks.



They are pretty heavy though. He's looking for shallow draft. Agree, they are tough boats, though.


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## Car7x (Jun 3, 2020)

Yep. John's specs would put the weight comparable to a 1648 jon, but mine sure felt heavy. With a roto cooler rower's seat, bowmount troller, 50hp 3cyl/2 stroke Yammy w/power T&T, (right at 200#) and the necessary 10' oars, my scum line was always 6 - 10" up. 1 - 2 guys at around 180# and the dog would be 55. Can't recall having 3 guys too often. The draft specs are optimistic, as well.


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