# Nav lights on console.



## LowHydrogen (Dec 31, 2015)

How many of you guys have mounted nav lights on the side of you center console? What are the drawbacks? I imagine there's a bit more glare at night from having more light inside the boat. Opinions and alternatives are welcomed.

Here's the back story.
I am in the process of re-wiring my Mako (https://www.microskiff.com/threads/1982-mako-224-resto-mod.44019) the problem is I am having a serious issue getting a wire to the bow. The routing on the old wire (in it's current state) won't allow removal or re-pulling a new wire. It is in a chase but does a 180 (twice!!) and the dang thing is in an area that I can touch but not with tools, and I can look at but cannot touch while looking at it, very aggravating. I am going to keep working on it tomorrow and don't plan on giving up, but am exploring options in case the situation requires an alternative.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

Mine are on the console. I did it even though I'm not sure it's quite legal cause they can be blocked by passengers and the white light is nor quite a meter above. The glare you get used to, but it does effect your night vision. I wouldn't do it again honestly.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

Try taking some thread and putting it at the beginning of the chase and use a vacuum on the other end. Once the thread comes through, tie on some heavier line and pull it through. Then do it again with the wire.

The vac should suck the thread right through...may have to make a good seal for the vac.

Lights on the console is not legal - but people do it anyway.


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

What duck said. Sometimes I tie a small plastic baggie to the end of a light nylon 'fish' line, creates more of a seal around the chase to be able to vacuum all the way in.


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## Steve_Mevers (Feb 8, 2013)

Lights mounted on the side of a console would not be in violation of USCG regulations, but they would not comply with ABYC manufacture standards. The standards are voluntary. Because of the glare and loss of night vision, I would at a minimum install a combination bow light, or even better yet fish eye lights under the rub rail. The problem with the combination lights on the bow is they have to be visible unobstructed for a 225 degree arch around the bow (112.5 for red/green) and trolling motors, and other items block the view. It will be worth your effort to get them mounted forward.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

If navigation lights were not legal boats wouldn't come with them that way. I'm about to move mine from the bow to the sides of the console to do away with the pop up light on the bow and mount a trolling motor puck there.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> If navigation lights were not legal boats wouldn't come with them that way.


I was schooled on this year's back (I think DN and Brett set me straight, lol), and can tell you that statement is very much wrong. Our old rescue boat came with a stern light mounted on the outboard cowling from the manufacturer, very much not legal because the all around needs to be 1m above the red/green navs. Also I believe Sharkeyes that come on many boats are technically not legal because they are below the rubrail/gunnels. The lights on the console are only legal if unobstructed, which means no one can sit in front of it, and your all around needs to be 1m (3.3ft) above them still. I did them on my boat out of convenience and because I was fishing solo a lot. Even though I think they are not quite legal I'll probably go with a sharkeye style light next time, most FWC/coasties don't care about being slightly below the rail as long as they can be clearly seen.
http://www.boatus.com/boattech/articles/coast-guard-requirements.asp


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## KnotHome (Jul 21, 2009)

You can't run the wires with a snake? 
I like the vac idea. 
The lights mounted into the rub rail are bad ass if you're going with a stainless insert.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

Here is the rule

(b) "Sidelights" means a green light on the starboard side and a red light on the port side each showing an unbroken light over an arc of the horizon of 112.5 degrees and so fixed as to show the light from right ahead to 22.5 degrees abaft the beam on its respective side. In a vessel of less than 20 meters in length the sidelights may be combined in one lantern carried on the fore and aft centerline of the vessel [, _except that on a vessel of less than 12 meters in length the sidelights combined in one lantern shall be placed as nearly as practicable to the fore and aft centerline of the vessel_]_._


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## LowHydrogen (Dec 31, 2015)

I'm hoping to work on this some more after the holiday weekend, I was trying to avoid just cutting the wire because I wanted to use it to pull a new one, I'm thinking now though if I can get the wire cut and just get it removed I may try the vacuum. I've seen that done before with a small tuft of cotton ball on the end of the thread but that was also bei

@DuckNut / @yobata do you guys think regular thread or GSP would be better? I have both, the GSP would be stronger for pulling some nylon twine through after but also think it may be more prone to hanging up on something.

I was able to stick my hand up in there with my phone and get a pic. I'll try and get it posted soon.

Thanks for all the input


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## LowHydrogen (Dec 31, 2015)

Picture is kind of deceptive. It's super tight in there. Took several tries to get a decent pic. The wire comes out of the chase then turns to the stern, then goes to the stbd through the glass liner, then between the hull and liner to the bow.

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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

That is a bit of a quandary. I used dental floss before with the vacuum and it worked well. I would use LED nav lights and get the smallest diameter wire I can find, making sure it's appropriate guage naturally. I mean don't use 12ga when 20GA will work. Do one section at a time, pull through all the slack you need then pull the next section. Trying to pull through that many turns as you know is hard to accomplish.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

Steve_Mevers said:


> Lights mounted on the side of a console would not be in violation of USCG regulations,





DuckNut said:


> unbroken light over an arc of the horizon of 112.5 degrees and so fixed as to show the light from right ahead to 22.5 degrees


You can't get unbroken light if there is a console between the lights and in addition if a person were to be standing on the side of the console the light is again broken.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

LowHydrogen said:


> Picture is kind of deceptive. It's super tight in there. Took several tries to get a decent pic. The wire comes out of the chase then turns to the stern, then goes to the stbd through the glass liner, then between the hull and liner to the bow.
> View attachment 10831


Just out of curiosity - exactly where is this and would it be possible to drill a hole near the opening of the chase? If it is in the corner of a bulkhead then it would never be seen.


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## LowHydrogen (Dec 31, 2015)

DuckNut said:


> Just out of curiosity - exactly where is this and would it be possible to drill a hole near the opening of the chase? If it is in the corner of a bulkhead then it would never be seen.


Thought about that. Unfortunately, it's in the upper corner of the gunwale, front stbd bow. I considered just installing a small access hatch but the inside of the boat has a strong curve and I'll never get it to look right.


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

Def do one section at a time if possible. There are two types of fish thread that I have used, the first is a nylon line that suitable for most things and looks like:









The second is also a tougher version that is capable of much more pressure/ able to withstand more turns. I would use multiple half hitches to make several point of contact with whatever wire you're pulling (maybe 3' down the line and 3-5 half hitches). It looks like:









If all else fails, use the metal versions, but the metal version is not able to be vacuumed to you, and usually you just have to electrical tape the wire to the metal fish tape...


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

They also make a "lube" that can be used with any fish tape/cable that helps move it along any chase, looks like:









Usually you only need this in really old or really tight chases... but sometimes it's worth its weight in gold.


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## Steve_Mevers (Feb 8, 2013)

DuckNut said:


> You can't get unbroken light if there is a console between the lights and in addition if a person were to be standing on the side of the console the light is again broken.


You can get an unbroken light with the side lights mounted on the side of the console, they have to be mounted toward the front of the console. The lights that are designed to be mounted on a horizontal surface have a designed bleed over of the light to be in compliance. You can add all kinds of variables, like passengers standing, aftermarket equipment, etc... that may affect the visibility of your lights, it is the operators responsibility to make sure nothing effects the visibility of there vessels lights. I once saw a flats boat that had factory installed side lights on a center console, but the owner had installed a tower on the boat and the tower support poles were mounted in front of the lights making them non-compliant. Only reason I mentioned it in an earlier post is that someone stated you legally cannot use them, you can legally use console mounted side lights, but it would not be my choice, fish eyes under the bow rail are best.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

I don't write the rules, just read them.

"Sidelights that are installed in the contour of the bow without providing a mounting surface tooled to be parallel with the fore and aft centerline of the vessel are not in compliance with the Inland or International Navigation Rules. Depending on the breadth of the vessel near the bow and how far aft from the vessel's stem the lights are mounted, this shift can be more than 20 degrees in some cases. Installing the fixtures too far aft of the vessel's stem may result in the sidelights not being visible from a position dead ahead.

Another factor in proper installation of sidelights is that they must maintain their required minimum intensity in a vertical sector from 5 degrees above to 5 degrees below the horizontal. They must also maintain at least 60 percent of their minimum required intensity from 7.5 degrees above to 7.5 degrees below the horizontal. Installing flush mounted sidelights, designed to be mounted to a vertical surface in the hull contour, without providing a mounting surface tooled to be vertical, shifts the vertical coverage sector. This also results in a noncompliance with the Inland or International Navigation Rules.

Additionally, most of these flush mounted sidelights are installed below the vessel's rub rail. International Navigation Rules require that sidelights be installed above the uppermost continuous deck. Therefore this configuration would not be in compliance with International Navigation Rules."


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## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

The whole idea is to determine a vessels direction to avoid a collision ...... I would go for the mounting that gives the most visibility so one's "arse" does not get hit!


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