# Batteries and gas tanks



## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

What is your opinion on mounting batteries right next to the gas tank in an enclosed compartment?


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## floridascuba (Mar 15, 2012)

gas has fumes. Battery can spark. equals boom

so I don't recommend.


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## BayStYat (Sep 12, 2012)

dont


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## anytide (Jul 30, 2009)

nope
i seen a boat "pop" at the ramp once, not a good scene.
:-[


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

Nope, it is definitely asking for trouble/disaster.


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## priscillatgorilla (Nov 29, 2014)

> What is your opinion on mounting batteries right next to the gas tank in an enclosed compartment?


not to confuse:


enclosed area - closed on all 4 sides -top sides and bottom,with a PORTABLE tank ?? 

if that's the case,no 

if you've got the same,completley closed area and a "built in",or "permanent" tank,yes


if you're talking about a console,like a Carolina skiff,with an open back,a portable tank and a battery -that's fine


if your battery(s) are properly installed,using stainless steel nuts and lock washers,and any in line fuses are waterproof,as they should be,there should NEVER be ANY sparking around/near the battery(s)

sparks mean a poor connection - sparks also mean heat.more boats have been on fire ,due to "wing nut" installation on battery terminals.same deal with any in line fuses...


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## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

I have seen pics of high end skiffs w/ the trolling motor batteries next to the permanent tanks----yes, installed well.

It just gives me the willies.............and i want nothing to do w/ it.


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## Godzuki86 (Nov 30, 2013)

> What is your opinion on mounting batteries right next to the gas tank in an enclosed compartment?


My troller batteries are in the same hatch/compartment as my fuel tank. Don't know where else to put them. My vent and fill aren't open to the same area though. Fortunately it hasn't killed me dead yet....


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## priscillatgorilla (Nov 29, 2014)

> I have seen pics of high end skiffs w/ the trolling motor batteries next to the permanent tanks----yes, installed well.
> 
> It just gives me the willies.............and i want nothing to do w/ it.



when installed,in the manner you described,it's within ABYC codes - nothing wrong with it


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## Godzuki86 (Nov 30, 2013)

> I have seen pics of high end skiffs w/ the trolling motor batteries next to the permanent tanks----yes, installed well.
> 
> It just gives me the willies.............and i want nothing to do w/ it.


Just as much of a chance to have a fun hole fuel leak under the cowling and have a coil wire ignite it. If done properly it's fine.


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## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

I hear ya!

But, I do not have 11gals. sitting under the cowling. [smiley=alcholic.gif] [smiley=alcholic.gif]


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

Fuel leak under the cowl and the motor might catch fire, but a vapor build up under a deck or floor and the whole boat can go boom! In the end anything can happen, but I like to minimize the risks as much as possible.


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## priscillatgorilla (Nov 29, 2014)

> Fuel leak under the cowl and the motor might catch fire, but a vapor build up under a deck or floor and the whole boat can go boom! In the end anything can happen, but I like to minimize the risks as much as possible.




countless boats out there with under deck fuel tanks - and motors below decks too...very very few go "boom" each year...


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## Guest (Dec 21, 2014)

Just by the fact that you asked, makes me think you already knew the answer.


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## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

"very very few go "boom" each year..." 

Oh! O.K. I feel much better [smiley=40s.gif]


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## priscillatgorilla (Nov 29, 2014)

> "very very few go "boom" each year..."
> 
> Oh! O.K. I feel much better [smiley=40s.gif]


tell me:

when was the last time you heard of a boat exploding ??

narrow that down some...when was the last time you heard/seen a flats boat explode - caused by a battery being in the same compartment as a permenant fuel tank - a correctly installed permenant fuel tank ??


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## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

- [smiley=1-mmm.gif]

Not. It just gives me the willies but I repeat myself.


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## Creek Runner (Sep 1, 2011)

When done right it's fine, no different than shark eyes in the front compartment with a permanent tank, or trolling motor plug, what about your plug in bow light when the tank is up front. 

Now a portable tank in a closed area with exposed anything is a no no!


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## Capnredfish (Feb 1, 2012)

Proper installation from mounting the battery in a manner which can stand up to a hard grounding and not come free. If only a strap holds the case down, another strap should hold the cover and case together if the assembly were to break loose the battery would remain contained and not short against anything. No wing nuts, perhaps tie wrap fuse holder covers preventing a possible spark from an exsposed fuse if were to blow. Proper wire size and clean contacts through out the boat. Maintained fuel system components. And 5 gallons of gas instead of 11 and you should be pretty safe.


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## floridascuba (Mar 15, 2012)

> > Fuel leak under the cowl and the motor might catch fire, but a vapor build up under a deck or floor and the whole boat can go boom! In the end anything can happen, but I like to minimize the risks as much as possible.
> 
> 
> 
> countless boats out there with under deck fuel tanks - and motors below decks too...very very few go "boom" each year...


You do realize they have blowers they run before staring right? I saw a boat blow up by not venting first just last year.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

x2

I have seen 3 inboards blow over the years, one when I was on board. Granted it just blew the motor hatch off and made a loud pop, but it still counts and could have been much worse.


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## priscillatgorilla (Nov 29, 2014)

> x2
> 
> I have seen 3 inboards blow over the years, one when I was on board. Granted it just blew the motor hatch off and made a loud pop, but it still counts and could have been much worse.



inboard boat and refueling:

if you've got

fuel - liquid fuel and a fuel vapor in the bilge - it's a direct result of a fuel leak.which in turn,is a result of poor maintenance practices ! no excuse for that ! fuel systems need to be inspected - inspections reveal problems.


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## priscillatgorilla (Nov 29, 2014)

> > > Fuel leak under the cowl and the motor might catch fire, but a vapor build up under a deck or floor and the whole boat can go boom! In the end anything can happen, but I like to minimize the risks as much as possible.
> >
> >
> >
> ...



outboard boats have built in fuel tanks as well - battery(s) are below decks - are you stating whenever fueling up,you need to vent ??

again,fuel along with vapors only develop when there's a leak in the fuel system...

we need to stay focused here - question remains:

ever see a flats boat,or other outboard powered boat explode ? ever hear of one exploding ?


installation guidelines are established for just about everything everything from battery installation to installation of bilge pumps.those guidelines are there for a reason - to help you avoid having a serious problem,leading to potential injury/death.


a correctly installed fuel system - tank and hosing,will NEVER admit a vapor - causing an explosive situation

sorry,it's just not gonna happen


failure to maintain that fuel system - allowing fuel lines/hosing to leak,tank to leak etc - that's a lack of maintenance,and shear irresponsibility !

same regarding the installation of battery(s) - if the battery(s) installed incorrectly - cheap plastic box with cheap webbing strap and the webbing clips screwed down with drywall screws,cables secured with wing nuts -this is an accident waiting to happen - irregardless if a fuel tank is in the same area or not


you may have a preference,regarding where a battery/fuel tank in installed -that's fine
however,don't allow yourself to believe it's a dangerous situation - or it's against ABYC codes,or NMMA,USCG CFR

this is a portion of the USCG CFR concerning battery installation:

183.420 - Batteries

(a) Each installed battery must not move more than one inch in any direction when a pulling force of 90 pounds or twice the battery weight, whichever is less, is applied through the center of gravity of the battery as follows:

(1) Vertically for a duration of one minute.

(2) Horizontally and parallel to the boat’s center line for a duration of one minute fore and one minute aft.

(3) Horizontally and perpendicular to the boat’s center line for a duration of one minute to starboard and one minute to port



tell me,is your battery(s) installed in accordance ??


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## cutrunner (Jun 8, 2010)

Fire is something i dont play with. But i will, and have no problem putting batteries next to a sealed fuel tank if everything is proper. I still try and avoid it if possible though. I cant tell you how many times ive seen people doing heat shrink work in a bilge after they just changed the fuel ater seporators or a fuel sender, some people only learn the hard way.


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## priscillatgorilla (Nov 29, 2014)

> Fire is something i dont play with. But i will, and have no problem putting batteries next to a sealed fuel tank if everything is proper. I still try and avoid it if possible though. I cant tell you how many times ive seen people doing heat shrink work in a bilge after they just changed the fuel ater seporators or a fuel sender, some people only learn the hard way.



you can't teach common sense - and there's no cure for stupidity


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

We are getting a bit extreme here and I think your focus is way to pinpoint. Ranting that things can never happen is just ridiculous, and saying having an issue is just shear irresponsibility is a bit narrow minded imo. 

Things can happen! Even though some situations seem unlikely, it doesn't mean impossible. My entire career as a firefighter is testament to this fact. Standards are put in place to minimize issues that may arise, but nothing is foolproof! I have seen leaks in brand new fuel tanks even after a pressure test, and I've seen batteries short out the first time they are connected. Stuff happens, Topnative was looking for an opinion, anyone can google current regs and standards, weather you agree with them or not is why we have discussions like this.


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## priscillatgorilla (Nov 29, 2014)

> We are getting a bit extreme here and I think your focus is way to pinpoint. Ranting that things can never happen is just ridiculous, and saying having an issue is just shear irresponsibility is a bit narrow minded imo.
> 
> Things can happen! Even though some situations seem unlikely, it doesn't mean impossible. My entire career as a firefighter is testament to this fact. Standards are put in place to minimize issues that may arise, but nothing is foolproof! I have seen leaks in brand new fuel tanks even after a pressure test, and I've seen batteries short out the first time they are connected. Stuff happens, Topnative was looking for an opinion, anyone can google current regs and standards, weather you agree with them or not is why we have discussions like this.




yes,things can happen

however

I've NEVER seen a failure of fuel related components without prior signs - "signs" being,hosing cracking/splitting
tank leaks without prior signs - areas of corrosion/slight fuel odor

the above are the only ways,short of actually pumping fuel into the bilge,to get fuel,or fuel vapor into a hull's bilge/fuel cell area - to get an explosion,from an inboard powered boat.and at that point it's still pretty difficult - inboard/stern drive motors - the starters/alternators are "sealed" - meaning,they will NOT emit a spark - that's part of being "marine starters" "marine alternators"


I've never seen a tank pass a pressure test,and then leak - in order to be tested correctly,in accordance with USCG CFR it needs to hold pressure for a specific amount of time and pressure,aong with either an immersion test or coated with soapy water - done in the method described - the tank will not be leaking - if a new tank leaked the next day - well...you be the judge the judge...

regulations and standards are set in place for a reason - they're not for"opinion"


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

I'm not gonna sit here and debate all day. I'm glad you have never seen a failure, but that really doesn't mean much to me as I have. The tank in question was made by a reputable builder and did pass the pressure and dunk test, however since they are tested to pressures much greater then they should normally see a weld developed a micro-fisher when the metal relaxed. It happens, you deal with it and move on. You also need to realize just because someone installs everything right does not mean that over time damage won't happen. It's a boat, it constantly vibrates and is in contact often with water. Even Hells Bay has had issues at one time or another

And despite your belief, all regulations and standards are subject to constant opinions and scrutiny, that is why they get updated frequently even without evidence based studies.

Lol, ok I'm done. 

Welcome to the forum, have a nice day


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## noeettica (Sep 23, 2007)

Firecat IS a trained* PROFESSIONAL* with years of experience !!!


That's enough for me !!!


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## jimsmicro (Oct 29, 2013)

No problem with mounting fuel and batteries in the same enclosed hatch as long as it has an external vent.  Venting the tank into an enclosed hatch is a good way to cause an explosion and huge fire.


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