# rebuild of my 1967 Supper Skeeter need opinions



## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

Hard to follow the drawings, I would just post a picture. Foam will help a little with flexing but not much, will there be stringers? Cause that is what will really do the trick.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

2 floors? Double decker? 

Stringers and bulkheads and then sole on top.


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## mudd_minnow (Oct 13, 2010)

I pulled the flooring up today. I found only 1 floor. I did have 2 stringers. As in the drawing, #1, the stringers are on each side.  I'm sorry there are no pics yet. I'm looking for my camera still. 

Under neath the hull, the wooden chimes are rotten. I was thinking of removing them from the inside. I was thinking of filling the fiberglass shell with some type of polymer I've seen made for filling a transome. Then glassing over the chimes on the inside. This will perminiatly resolve the rotten chimes ever occuring again. I have to flip the hull to repair issues underneath so I'll 
Maybe I'll put a floor then stringers and then another floor as in the drawings 2, 3,4, or mabe just build it like the next drawing #4.



















Does anyone have any other ideas?


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

More like #4. The pink lines N and S are stringers and the ones E and W are bulkheads. Eliminate the perimeter ones as this would actually be the hull itself. The brown then can be filled with foam, trimmed to fit and then a piece of wood bonded to the N, S, E and W and around the perimeter of the hull. 

The way you are drawing (new) will have a stable floor (sole) but it will not support the hull.

If you cut the top off the stringer and fill with a pourable compound you will not be happy. As good as that stuff it should be left for transom use and it is about 11lbs per gal and if you don't have a grinder you won't scratch it with sandpaper (really good at making drill bits a one time use piece of equipment). It is complete overkill for what you are trying to accomplish.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

Agreed, gotta cut it out to do it right or you will be doing it again soon. 
The double floor idea won't do anything for you accept add weight, and raise the sole which will in turn make the boat less stable. The boat is fairly narrow, I would do 2 full stringers and a cross section/bulkhead every 18-24" or so, and fill the areas not to be used for plumbing with 2-4lbs closed cell foam. Once you bond the floor down on top of that and to the sides it will creat a monocoque structure and it will be rock solid.


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## mudd_minnow (Oct 13, 2010)

Thanks for the help. I'm thinking you answer is like this in the drawing adding stringers along the full length of the hull sandwitched between to marine grade plywood sheets. 

My questions are:
1. How thick should the plywood be?
2. How thick and wide should the stringers be and set apart from each other?
3. Should the chimes be 1 solid piece (thru thr hull) or 2 seperate as per the drawing?


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

I'm still not understanding why you have a bottom piece of ply or the verticle supports as they really won't do anything but add weight.
In the picture you just posted, eliminate the bottom ply (colored blue) and get rid of the verticle supports (colored green) except for the 2 that will be your stringers. 
What you keep calling a chime, is actually a strake. chines, not chimes, refers to the bottom edge of the hull. As far as should the wood go all the way through, it's up to you, either way will be a ton of work and hard to get correct.
Personally I would cut them out, and reglass the bottom smooth, then add strakes to the bottom later on, this way if they are compromised again it won't effect the inside structure any.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

I think I got it with the new set of drawings. 2nd is what I will use.

Loose the bottom blue line and the two green lines at each side. The top blue line is depicted correctly. It is bonded to the stringers (short green) and then around the outside edge where it meets the hull (just like the picture).

What you are missing is the bulkheads - these run the width of the hull. Every 2' or so would be adequate and then 1/2" ply for the sole. 

If you are wanting no flex then run 1 stringer down the center and one half way to the side (the real chine) with 2' bulkheads and fill with 6' foam after a couple chase tubes. And none of these needs to be wider than 1/2".

The strakes- what you have called chime - they do not go through the hull if you are adding them to the existing hull.


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## mudd_minnow (Oct 13, 2010)

The floor flexes alot when running so, i want to stop the flexing. Adding stringers and bulkheads should do the trick but I don't don't want to walk on stringers and bulkheads while fishing. Adding a false floor would add weigh true but limiting the thickness to the false deck should help keep the weight down and add strenth. My only issue would be glassing the bulkheads and stringers in and making them level to mount the false floor. I guess after the stringers and bulkheads are glassed in I could add where needed to level the flooring.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

We aren't saying not to add a false floor, it's a good idea as it finished off the monocoque structure, but the bottom peice of ply won't do anything really, actually it will make a weaker structure.
Glass the stringers and bulkheads directly to the hull, make them out of cardboard first so you can find the right height to make them level, then bond the floor to them and the sides, it will be strong and rigid. Thickness of the floor isn't a huge issue, 3/8" or 1/2" will do just fine given the narrow beam.
You don't want to put the stringers in and then add to them to get the height you want, doing so will make them much weaker then if they were joined to the floor directly.


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## mmjamp (Jul 3, 2011)

What firecat and ducknut are calling a false is different than what you are. Your stringers need to go all the way to the bottom of the hull, glassed in which will be the same height as what you are calling a (Chime), you will then create bulk heads about every 2 feet running the width of the boat, in between the stringers which again will be the same height as what you are calling a chime and the stringers, you will now have the underneath floor system built, filled with foam of course. Your floor (which will be the false floor, a false floor is just meaning that it’s not the hull) will then sit on top of the stringers. What Firecat and Ducknut are saying is correct except the bottom ply should stay and the stringers should be put underneath the bottom ply which creates your floor. It’s your top ply( that should be removed) and location of your stringers need to go below the bottom ply in your last drawing.


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## mudd_minnow (Oct 13, 2010)

Here is what they are saying,








This is the setup I'm looking at doing. I'm thinking of filling the gap between the floor and the hull between the stringers. I've heard the foam in the can you get at Home Depot will fill the void and the foam will not obsorb water.

Not put in the drawing is the bulkheads every 2 ft.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

Don't use great stuff foam, the stuff in the can you are talking about from HD, many have tried, most have had very bad results. I tested some a while back after I used it in a patch job, it soaked up water like a sponge. Plus in order to fill the void that big it will cost you twice as much to buy all the cans as it would to just do it right with floatation foam. you will probably need about 15-20 cans, but you can but a 2 gallon kit of floatation foam for $70 and it is closed cell.

This is what we are talking about as far as design goes, all those stringers you have there are just added weight, remember your boat is narrow so it doesn't need all that, 2 will do just fine.









here is the stringer and bulkhead layout.









There is a reason they build boats this way, it creates a simple, yet super strong structure.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

I dug up this old picture from bateau. This boat is 17' long and 7' wide and these are the only stringers and bulkheads it needs to be super solid. This is one of there best designs, simple and strong, the floor would bond directly on top of it. No need to get really fansy, infact depending on the beam of your boat you might not even need the bulkheads.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

BINGO!

That's it muddy.

The foam in the can is very similar to the two part pourable.  The stuff is considered 2lb.  It is a little easier to use but just as messy.  It will absorb water the same as other foams and should not be considered a lifetime fix.  At 2lbs it will not add much in the way of support but the stringers and bulkheads will do that.

After you have the grid system laid out fill every other cavity with the foam and let it cure.  Go to a music store and buy a guitar or piano string that had a wire wrapped around the main wire and use it as a saw.  Pull tight and use the top of the stringers as a guide, saw back and forth across the tops and you will have a great fit.  Then repeat with the other cavities.  After you have that all done coat the top of the foam with epoxy.  The foam is quite water resistant with the skin intact, but when the skin is compromised such as cut off you will see how it can absorb water, this is why you want to coat it - don't use polyester on the foam.

The other thing you need to be aware of is what is known as hard spots.  This is when the stringers or bulkheads come in direct contact with the hull.  Over time these spots may cause cracks along the area.  To avoid this you will want a slightly flexible substance to adhere the grid down.  There is a waterproof construction adhesive (I can't think of the name right now) that comes in a tube and can be applied neatly with a caulking gun.  Then at the corner where the grid meets the floor you need a curved area (fillet) in order to allow the glass to lay smooth without any gaps.

I am sure firecat has some pictures he can share with you on the fillet.


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## mudd_minnow (Oct 13, 2010)

Yeah, that is what I'm looking to do. The boat is 4 ft wide and 15 ft long. The thickness I want between the false floor and the hull is 2 or 3 inches. I'll most likely use 3/4 inch ply for the stringers. Fill the voids with flotation foam.

This is where the fun begins. Fiberglass, saw dust, resen and paint fills the air. Glue in every crevis, nook and cranny of clothing, hair, skin, ears, nose, and other areas not mentioning. 

I can't wait.


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## mudd_minnow (Oct 13, 2010)

I wonder is the flexable adheasive your refering to is 5200? I'm curious about the hard spots you discribing. I'm rebuilding this 40 + year boat and I don't want to do something that in the future Damage this ventage boat. 

Any other tricks of the trade I should know about?


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

> I'll most likely use 3/4 inch ply for the stringers


That is heavy stuff. Think skinny.

No it is not 5200 that I am thinking of because that stuff is more expensive than my wife's lipstick. I'll eventually think of it.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

here you go 
http://www.microskiff.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1297188235/6

1/2" ply should be good for the stringers and bulkheads. 3/4" is a little heavy. I'd go with 3" tall since 2 won't give youmuch to work with and 3" will be nearly twice as strong as 2". Hard spots can be handled by limiting flex in the hull, using the stringers and bulkheads, with nice wide fillets and fiberglass tape will help alot. Adding the foam, either tight fitting block or poured in foam, will help as well, but shouldn't be relied on heavily.


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## mudd_minnow (Oct 13, 2010)

Sorry for the delay with pics. I found my camera but could not download to my computer SO! I got a new camera and 

WALA......Here's my pics.

Here is my Super Skeeter











Here is a picture with the building table. I've used 4 trailer jack stands so I can roll it outside.



















Here are the after effects of sanding down the old paint and bad fiberglass repairs done prevously. In the center left of the hull, the side is damaged and there is a hole in the side I need to repair.

I'll send more as I build.


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## mudd_minnow (Oct 13, 2010)

Hey everyone,
   Here are some more photos of my rebuild. These are shots outside showing better details of my super skeeter.


















Here is also a shot of my boat building rolling table. It is very portable.  I cleaned the boat, table and cleaned my shop. ANYONE who grinds on fiberglass.....COVER EVERYTHING WITH A TARP BEFORE SANDING AND GRINDING. I didn't but I will remember in the future. WHAT A MESS.



















Here is a hole, and a crack in the side of the hull, and just below the crack near the bottom of the hull I just found a huge crack ablut 3 ft long. I'll fe reparing for weeks,  Oh well, thats ok.




















I'm going to repair the side and hole in the boat then I'm going to cut the transom out and replace it.


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## mudd_minnow (Oct 13, 2010)

Hello everybody,
   Here are some more pics of the on going refurbish of my skeeter boat. Also, I have several questions of repairing and strengthing of the hull to cap connection.

First,, the grind..   


























Now the questions:
   I'm finding cracks, holes, and other damaging covered by painting. I think I'll just remove all the paint, gelcoat (if that is what it is in blue) and anything else under there. 
I need to repair the sides that attach the cap and hull together. Parts are missing so I need to find out what I SHOULD USE (MARKED IN BROWN) to fill the missing fiberglass, or gaps. Marked in Blue are where I'm putting the heavy structural fiberglass to completely close the hull/cap section. The piece marked in red are the fiberglass missing in areas around the hull, See pics.

























I think it was torpedoed...DAMM JAPS!!! ;D ;D ;D


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

What did you need to know?


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## mudd_minnow (Oct 13, 2010)

What I should use to put in the gaps and replace the missing areas in red, then fiberglass in blue over the area to seal it.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

Do the inside blue repairs first to seal off the passage. Then flip and use some thicked something to put into the gap - do not have to completely fill it. Then rebuild the edges where it is broken and transition to the bottom half. Then do outside blue repairs.

That will hold the two pieces together.


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## mudd_minnow (Oct 13, 2010)

Sorry guys, I've been very busy with life, so I had to put off working on my project. I'm back in the saddle getting fiberglass everywhere.  I've patched the torpedo shot in the hull, repaired the crack down the side, patched small holes and such. 
   I've read on other posts here about the old school boat builders building a curvature in the hull. The last 2 ft of the aft to the transome has a curve. The rest of the hull is like a wave on the ocean. So I want to level this out, add stringers, bulkheads, ect... a layer of glass on the floor to fill unseen holes , and add strength.

My Question,
   Should I rip down several 1/2 inch or 3/4 marine ply to make my stringers. I want the stringers to be wide enouph to perminately attach the false floor to the stringers using  screws.  The floor would be glassed in. I believe that 2 stringers should be enouph running the full length of the hull. 

What do you think?

NOTE: 
   1. I need them to hold the weight of the boat motor when traveling or while in storage.  ( I want to be able to completly stow away the motor inside the hull of the boat.)
   2. I will be filling the voids betwees the stringers, bulkheads, and false floor by pouring foam into holes cut into the false floor.

I'll make pics soon.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

You can rip wood and attach it to the stringers at the top to make a "T" shape. The deck can be held down by gluing. Screws won't be much use in the end grain of the wood.

As for the waves in the hull. Some of them will disappear when you add the straight wood to the boat. I wouldn't even attempt to add the hook to the hull, just repair what you have.

#2 -


> false floor


 Not going to have one if you build as described on page 1. Your floor will be strong enough to carry your motor.


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## mudd_minnow (Oct 13, 2010)

I have a question about filling an area with 2 part mixed foam. What is the weight displacement of using the 2 part foam? For example, a 2 ft x 2 ft x 2 ft square will hold ? weight. 

I want to compensate for the weight of the 35 johnson motor and me standing on a polling platform. Thinking of filling an area from the transome to about 1 or 2 ft out. I need to know what amount of foam to use to make this happen.


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

I can find it faster than I can type it... 

http://www.shopmaninc.com/faq_foam.html


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## mudd_minnow (Oct 13, 2010)

Thanks Brett. This is very intresting.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

> I want to compensate for the weight of the 35 johnson motor and me standing on a polling platform.


Please explain further then we can help you out.


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## WhiteDog70810 (May 6, 2008)

Foam doesn't increase flotation until something goes wrong. Extra foam is put in the stern to support the engine and float the hull level once it is full of water. If you aren't sinking, it just takes up a lot of space and prevents you from putting more heavy crap there, which is a valuable asset in its own right. 

I doubt you'll be on the platform if your boat is sinking. I'd be somewhere near the bow alternating between paddling toward the shore and bailing frantically... and cussing. The only reason I point this out is that it helps you decide how to best distribute the foam. You need enough in the stern to float the motor, batteries and whatever else you have back there. Adding enough foam to float a 200# person in addition to everything else might take up more space than you really want to give up. That foam might be best used if distributed throughout the rest of the hull.

Nate


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

Thank you Nate...that is what I was getting at. In a little boat like that it would not take alot of foam to make it unsinkable and that is advisable. You have a lip over the cockpit, fill it with foam. That along with the foam under the sole will not allow your boat to go completely under.


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## mudd_minnow (Oct 13, 2010)

Well, the skeeter was not designed to have a polling platform mounted at the rear. So, I wanted to have something to compensate for the added weight of my 240 lbs plus the platform and motor. This same type of boat I had (when I was growing up) had an old 50 merc hp so it can handle the weight. I just wanted it to sit and ride shallow.

Any ideas?


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

On any hull, balance/trim is everything. Once you get all the basic components installed,
put her in the water and see where you'd need to stand in order to keep her level,
then figure out how to mount a platform centered slightly forward of that location.
Some hulls just don't do well with an over transom platform.
But move it forward a foot or two and the center of load works.

Make sense?  :-?

Here's a 'noe that figured this out...


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

If you are trying to keep the stern from squatting when in the back of the boat, foam will not work at all. The foam will help if the boat fills with water but not if standing in the rear fishing. There are two ways to help with the squatting. The first is what Brett said- move weight forward and balance the load. The other is to increase the displacement of the hull and this is not something you want to tackle. So do what Brett sadin or live with it.


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## mudd_minnow (Oct 13, 2010)

Yeah, one thing I was thinking about is to have the polling platform able to move forward and aft. This would center the weight and reduce the squat. I'll see about doing this after I complete the rebuild.


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