# Low bow while running



## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

Im running a 14’6 skimmer and I’m having problems with my bow coming down too far after I get on plane. I have tried raising the motor a notch and had the skiff running how I’d like but it squatted the stern down a lot and also caused cavitation. I have the motor mounted with the cavitation plate even with the bottom of my hull. Should I try getting a jack plate to add setback and maybe raise the motor a few inches? Or a cavitation plate and kick the motor up a notch? I’ve already tried moving as much weight out of the bow and all I have up there is a small dry box, my fly box, and a leaf/stripping basket.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Trim her out! Do you have a pin to set your trim angle on the motor?


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## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

Motor should be a 1"-2" above bottom of boat
is the cavatation occurring when u are turning or all the time?
what rpms are u turning?
is trim vertical

options:
cup the prop for better grip
or increase pitch and get a raker style prop


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## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> Trim her out! Do you have a pin to set your trim angle on the motor?


see above...the bow being pushed down means the motor is mounted to low
and/or a severe trim angle


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## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> Trim her out! Do you have a pin to set your trim angle on the motor?


Yes, when I trimmed it up one hole with the pin that’s when cavitation occurred. I wish I had electric trim/tilt ... that would make this a lot easier 



topnative2 said:


> Motor should be a 1"-2" above bottom of boat
> is the cavatation occurring when u are turning or all the time?
> what rpms are u turning?
> is trim vertical
> ...


Cavitation occurs without turning. I have a tiny tach on the way. I’m running a super basic Merc 25 2 stroke without electric trim or tilt. I’ll look into new props.


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## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

topnative2 said:


> see above...the bow being pushed down means the motor is mounted to low
> and/or a severe trim angle


Sounds like I’ll try a jack plate and experiment with different motor heights. Would raising the motor 1-2” really make a drastic difference without creating a bigger cavitation problem? I feel like the trim angle of the motor would make a bigger difference than the height of the motor for the bow being too high or too low but trimming one notch up creates cavitation


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## lemaymiami (Feb 9, 2007)

Hope all the suggestions sort you out.... A few years back there were some small skiffs (might have been called something like a skimmer) that weren't very well designed and did have some serious running hull attitude problems. Hope yours isn't one of those...


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

I think we have our terminology confused here. Trimming out is not motor height, it’s moving the lower unit angle out or in. Trimming out will cause the bow to rise. Jacking up is motor height in relation to the transom.
-*Trim:* To adjust the position of a boat moving in the water by altering the angle of the drive unit (or motor) to the boat.


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## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

in this case cavitation while trimmed at real vertical means u need a prop w/ more pitch...and/or cup and u still have to raise the motor


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

A compression plate can help even the smallest outboards control the attitude of the boat more efficiently but yeah the wrong prop can cause all kinds of issues as well. Trim tabs won’t hell this “bow plowing” but the correct prop, motor height and possibly a compression plate will.


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## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

Jred said:


> Sounds like I’ll try a jack plate and experiment with different motor heights. Would raising the motor 1-2” really make a drastic difference without creating a bigger cavitation problem? I feel like the trim angle of the motor would make a bigger difference than the height of the motor for the bow being too high or too low but trimming one notch up creates cavitation


Yes!!!!!!but would create more cavitation....get her up and running and look down and see if the motor is vertical ....... or tucked in 

the bow going down at a true vertical means the motor is to deep and cavitation at that point means u need a prop w/ more pitch.....unusual to have a bow down issue w/ cavitation


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## Guest (Dec 31, 2018)

Post up some pics of your setup, let us know what prop you have, trim that motor and raise it. But, at this point with your current prop... raising and trimming is only going to magnify the cavitation problem. Check the hull bottom for a hook using a straight edge also.


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## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

I’ll post pics tomorrow when I’m home. When I run with the motor set in the notch that I don’t get any cavitation the bow plows but the cav plate on the lower unit is right at the surface level of the water(I can see it when I look back). When I trim the motor one notch up the boat planes how I prefer (bow not at a sketchy level) and I can still see the cavitation plate but it creates cavitation issues. If I set the pin into the higher position but add a hydrofoil will it allow the skiff to ride with the bow higher but prevent the cavitation?


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## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

usually a hydrofoil puts the bow down


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## Guest (Jan 1, 2019)

Jred said:


> I’ll post pics tomorrow when I’m home. When I run with the motor set in the notch that I don’t get any cavitation the bow plows but the cav plate on the lower unit is right at the surface level of the water(I can see it when I look back). When I trim the motor one notch up the boat planes how I prefer (bow not at a sketchy level) and I can still see the cavitation plate but it creates cavitation issues. If I set the pin into the higher position but add a hydrofoil will it allow the skiff to ride with the bow higher but prevent the cavitation?


A hydrofoil wouldn’t help stop the cavitation but a compression plate will.


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## taffrail (Dec 23, 2018)

Jred said:


> Sounds like I’ll try a jack plate and experiment with different motor heights. Would raising the motor 1-2” really make a drastic difference without creating a bigger cavitation problem? I feel like the trim angle of the motor would make a bigger difference than the height of the motor for the bow being too high or too low but trimming one notch up creates cavitation


Really kind of sounds like a prop problem. Of course you understand that prop size is the one area I am no expert in. (Until the next subject comes up.)


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

You have a very lightweight skiff and any change is going to be amplified.

Try putting the motor what're you like it and then take a bag of play sand and a bucket. Put the bucket in the front hatch and start adding sand until the proposing stops. 

Then mix some epoxy and mix the sand and put it all in a plastic bag and put it in the hatch on the hull and push it to contour the hull. When cured remove the plastic. Set this in when you are by yourself.

I say this because I did not see where you say it happens when someone else in with you.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

DuckNut said:


> You have a very lightweight skiff and any change is going to be amplified.
> 
> Try putting the motor what're you like it and then take a bag of play sand and a bucket. Put the bucket in the front hatch and start adding sand until the proposing stops.
> 
> ...


I thought he said the bow is plowing? That’s the opposite of porpoising. Hydrofoils and compression plates are not the same thing either. A hydrofoil is a flat plate that acts like a trim tab on your motor, a compression plate has sides that angle or curve down to hold water around the prop and allow the prop to grip instead of blowing out. The compression plate also acts like a hydrofoil but with an even more exaggerated effect because of the curved or angled sides holding more water than a flat plate.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

The correct prop is the first step, then the correct height for the prop while figuring out motor height and weight distribution to get the boat to level out as best as you can without creating more issues such as cavitation. There’s cavitation on hole shot, cavitation while running WOT and also cavitation while turning and most all of these can be cured by running the correct prop. A prop with the correct diameter, rake, pitch, cupping, blade shape, blade thickness and number of blades are all factors. If the boat still wants to act funny you’ll need more planing aids like trim tabs and a true custom prop. All of these things are useless without the correct prop and motor height.


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## crboggs (Mar 30, 2015)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> I think we have our terminology confused here. Trimming out is not motor height, it’s moving the lower unit angle out or in. Trimming out will cause the bow to rise. Jacking up is motor height in relation to the transom.
> -*Trim:* To adjust the position of a boat moving in the water by altering the angle of the drive unit (or motor) to the boat.


Positive trim will push the stern down and raise the bow.
Negative trim will raise the stern and push the bow down.

It can be a balancing act...especially with a jack plate / tunnel. Add in trim tabs and you're running around doing geometry problems in your head as you're navigating. *lol*


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

crboggs said:


> Positive trim will push the stern down and raise the bow.
> Negative trim will raise the stern and push the bow down.
> 
> It can be a balancing act...especially with a jack plate / tunnel. Add in trim tabs and you're running around doing geometry problems in your head as you're navigating. *lol*


Yep, nail on the head. Sorry if I’m over posting but it’s kind of my thing. Run your boat long enough in as many situations as possible any you’ll have it down so well it becomes second nature as does running a few other buddies boats. After enough time at the helm on enough boats with different motors and rigging it only takes a little while to catch on and apply what you learned from running other boats to running a new (to you) boat and being able to troubleshoot issues.


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## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

Thanks everyone. A lot of good info shared I’ll need to figure out a new prop and possibly a manual jack plate and compression plate which I already have in the garage.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Jred said:


> Thanks everyone. A lot of good info shared I’ll need to figure out a new prop and possibly a manual jack plate and compression plate which I already have in the garage.


You might get more use out of one of these since you are running a smaller outboard and want to be able to get the bow up. A jackplate could also be useful but being able to adjust trim on the fly might be more useful. Just an idea...
This one is rated up to 35hp, not sure what motor you have but I think I remember a Skimmerskiff 16 having 20-30hp. 
https://thmarinesupplies.com/products/cmc-pt-35-tilt-and-trim-for-up-to-35-hp


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## RunningOnEmpty (Jun 20, 2015)

I'm guessing you still have an aluminum prop?


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## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

RunningOnEmpty said:


> I'm guessing you still have an aluminum prop?


It’s stainless but that’s all I know about it without being home to look at it


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## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> You might get more use out of one of these since you are running a smaller outboard and want to be able to get the bow up. A jackplate could also be useful but being able to adjust trim on the fly might be more useful. Just an idea...
> This one is rated up to 35hp, not sure what motor you have but I think I remember a Skimmerskiff 16 having 20-30hp.
> https://thmarinesupplies.com/products/cmc-pt-35-tilt-and-trim-for-up-to-35-hp


I have a 25 2 stroke and I’ve looked into those


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## devrep (Feb 22, 2009)

Jred said:


> I’ll post pics tomorrow when I’m home. When I run with the motor set in the notch that I don’t get any cavitation the bow plows but the cav plate on the lower unit is right at the surface level of the water(I can see it when I look back). When I trim the motor one notch up the boat planes how I prefer (bow not at a sketchy level) and I can still see the cavitation plate but it creates cavitation issues. If I set the pin into the higher position but add a hydrofoil will it allow the skiff to ride with the bow higher but prevent the cavitation?


drop the motor 1 notch and try the trim at the position that cavitates again.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Jred said:


> I have a 25 2 stroke and I’ve looked into those


Being able to tuck the motor on holeshot then ease out on the trim to get the bow up might be your best bet if nothing else works. 
I know simple is best but when I see these boats made for jackplates with no jackplate it kills me. Same with no trim, some boats need it, some are balanced just right and static trim and height are sufficient. My boat is a turd without a jackplate, trim and trim tabs. It came with no jackplate, the wrong prop, a leaking trim cylinder that allowed the motor to tuck in under power and one trim tab not working. It was horrible to run but I had run the same hull set up correctly and knew it could be cured. Now my boat is pretty cherry and very fun, easy and efficient to run. It just took some tweaking which is part of the fun for me.


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## taffrail (Dec 23, 2018)

devrep said:


> drop the motor 1 notch and try the trim at the position that cavitates again.


Having given this problem some thought (and called a friend who is something of an expert at this stuff) dropping the motor a notch will probably cure your problem. And......it is fairly easy to do.


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## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

taffrail said:


> Having given this problem some thought (and called a friend who is something of an expert at this stuff) dropping the motor a notch will probably cure your problem. And......it is fairly easy to do.


Going to try this before I spend money


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## jonny (May 1, 2007)

X4 or whatever now on the prop. You can actually get props designed to raise the bow. It's partly from the rake angles. Plus cupping and all the other factors. Sounds like your prop may be raising the stern too much. The more aft rake the less lift. It will push the water more directly to the rear. If the blades have less rake(angle). It will push the water in a bigger circumference. Lifting the stern up. Most flats guys gravitate to a stern lifting 4 blade for hole shot in shallows. But this may not be a good match for your hull. Does your hull have any rocker in the running area?


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## jmrodandgun (Sep 20, 2013)

Every one of these I've ever seen has run real flat on the water. Even my SUV14 ran bow down, also known as bow steer city. There is only so much you can do to these short boats without adding power trim and power tabs. I was able to get my SUV to run like I wanted by setting the trim one hole out from parallel and having a prop shop perform some witchcraft on the blades. My motor height was set even with the bottom of the skiff. I gave up some holeshot with the setup but it held better in turns and was easier to drive.



jonny said:


> The more aft rake the less lift.


I think I know what you're saying but just to clarify...

Rake aft = bow lift.

With a standard three blade thrust is lost through at surface and the stern gets lifted.









Add rake aft and and the thrust vector is more linear to the prop shaft with less loss of thrust at the surface. Think of it as narrowing a cone of thrust. The more you rake the blades aft the tighter the cone and less thrust lost at the surface. The end result is lifting of the bow. It looks like this.









Continuous wave has some good info. It is where I stole the above pictures.

prop3.html


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## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

jonny said:


> X4 or whatever now on the prop. You can actually get props designed to raise the bow. It's partly from the rake angles. Plus cupping and all the other factors. Sounds like your prop may be raising the stern too much. The more aft rake the less lift. It will push the water more directly to the rear. If the blades have less rake(angle). It will push the water in a bigger circumference. Lifting the stern up. Most flats guys gravitate to a stern lifting 4 blade for hole shot in shallows. But this may not be a good match for your hull. Does your hull have any rocker in the running area?


No rocker in the hull, it’s pretty flat to the naked eye from bow to stern. 



jmrodandgun said:


> Every one of these I've ever seen has run real flat on the water. Even my SUV14 ran bow down, also known as bow steer city. There is only so much you can do to these short boats without adding power trim and power tabs. I was able to get my SUV to run like I wanted by setting the trim one hole out from parallel and having a prop shop perform some witchcraft on the blades. My motor height was set even with the bottom of the skiff. I gave up some holeshot with the setup but it held better in turns and was easier to drive.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Interesting, a new prop seems to be the consensus. I’m gonna tinker with the height of motor and more trim and see if I can sort it out before spending money testing props.


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## RunningOnEmpty (Jun 20, 2015)

My last little motor was cavitating and hitting the rev limiter. I added some cupping to the blades and it stayed hooked up really good. Props make a huge difference!


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

jmrodandgun said:


> Every one of these I've ever seen has run real flat on the water. Even my SUV14 ran bow down, also known as bow steer city. There is only so much you can do to these short boats without adding power trim and power tabs. I was able to get my SUV to run like I wanted by setting the trim one hole out from parallel and having a prop shop perform some witchcraft on the blades. My motor height was set even with the bottom of the skiff. I gave up some holeshot with the setup but it held better in turns and was easier to drive.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Trim tabs will do nothing for bow plowing, they can only lift the stern and adjust for porpoising issues and adjust hull attitude for off center weight dustribution and prop torque. No tabs at all will actually allow the bow to lift better because the water can flow off the hull as clean as possible. Even with tabs lifted at the maximum angle they will still cause stern lift and drip the bow.


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## jmrodandgun (Sep 20, 2013)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> Trim tabs will do nothing for bow plowing, they can only lift the stern and adjust for porpoising issues and adjust hull attitude for off center weight dustribution and prop torque. No tabs at all will actually allow the bow to lift better because the water can flow off the hull as clean as possible. Even with tabs lifted at the maximum angle they will still cause stern lift and drip the bow.


I never suggested adding power tabs would solve any problems with running characteristics. If you add power trim, you can lift and lower the bow with the trim switch. Lift too much and it starts to bounce. Add tabs and you can stop the bounce with stern lift. Ergo, you can run with a higher bow attitude with power trim. You can can an even _higher _bow attitude with power trim *and* trim tabs.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

jmrodandgun said:


> I never suggested adding power tabs would solve any problems with running characteristics. If you add power trim, you can lift and lower the bow with the trim switch. Lift too much and it starts to bounce. Add tabs and you can stop the bounce. Ergo, you can run with a higher bow attitude with power trim. You can can an even _higher _bow attitude with power trim *and* trim tabs.


I understand where you were going, I was not implying you were wrong, just that other people that read this thread may get the wrong idea and think tabs will aid a hull that wants to run bow down. 
The combination of power trim and tabs makes sense. I run my boat with the motor trimmed out past level and tabs down some to get maximum speed. Without the tabs I couldn’t do this and would be running about 8 mph slower just to avoid porpoising.


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## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

jmrodandgun said:


> Every one of these I've ever seen has run real flat on the water. Even my SUV14 ran bow down, also known as bow steer city. There is only so much you can do to these short boats without adding power trim and power tabs. I was able to get my SUV to run like I wanted by setting the trim one hole out from parallel and having a prop shop perform some witchcraft on the blades. My motor height was set even with the bottom of the skiff. I gave up some holeshot with the setup but it held better in turns and was easier to drive.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


One more opinion:
Regarding the SUV and having had one, the bow steer is the result of the hull design not length.

http://www.ptprop.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=43&Itemid=62


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## taffrail (Dec 23, 2018)

Jred said:


> Going to try this before I spend money


Seems to me that logic would dictate the prop needs to be far enough under water to do it's job before any kind of prop change would help much. Now understand my logic has always been a bit twisted........


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> I thought he said the bow is plowing? That’s the opposite of porpoising. Hydrofoils and compression plates are not the same thing either. A hydrofoil is a flat plate that acts like a trim tab on your motor, a compression plate has sides that angle or curve down to hold water around the prop and allow the prop to grip instead of blowing out. The compression plate also acts like a hydrofoil but with an even more exaggerated effect because of the curved or angled sides holding more water than a flat plate.


He did. When the motor is tucked in and porpoises when up one pin. So I suggested to put in the position where it porpoises and add weight to the bow. This would be a cheap way to find out if that would work.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

DuckNut said:


> He did. When the motor is tucked in and porpoises when up one pin. So I suggested to put in the position where it porpoises and add weight to the bow. This would be a cheap way to find out if that would work.


Your comment made me go back and read his posts before yours and I don’t see anything about porpoising when he moves the motor up one pin, only that he gets cavitation. Please correct me if I’m wrong. I don’t like to post misinformation and if I do I will accept my mistake and edit my post.
This is what I read:


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## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

Here is how the engine is mounted. It’s also as low as I’ll be able to get it.


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## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

Prediction: Cavitation will decrease and your bow will go down quicker.


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## crboggs (Mar 30, 2015)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> Being able to tuck the motor on holeshot then ease out on the trim to get the bow up might be your best bet if nothing else works.


On my flats boat, no tunnel or jack plate, I'd bury the motor all the way down for the hole shot and then slowly raise it once I was on plane. Eventually the nose would start to bounce at which point I'd back off the trim a tick or apply a little tab to level things out. I found that I ran much more efficiently that way and gained speed.


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## taffrail (Dec 23, 2018)

Jred said:


> Here is how the engine is mounted. It’s also as low as I’ll be able to get it.
> View attachment 54688


Judging by what I see in the picture, I believe your motor is at least one inch too high. However the picture makes it look as though your motor is trimmed a bit "tucked in." If your "anti-ventilation plate" when parallel to the bottom of your boat, is not two inches below the bottom of the boat you probably need to lower the motor.


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## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

^


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## Guest (Jan 1, 2019)

taffrail said:


> Judging by what I see in the picture, I believe your motor is at least one inch too high. However the picture makes it look as though your motor is trimmed a bit "tucked in." If your "anti-ventilation plate" when parallel to the bottom of your boat, is not two inches below the bottom of the boat you probably need to lower the motor.


My eyes may be deceiving me but... it looks like the level is sitting on the top of the cav plate. If so and I am seeing it correctly the motor is an inch or so too low, James


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## Guest (Jan 1, 2019)

Ok, I looked again... raise that motor 2” on the transom and see what happens!


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## topnative2 (Feb 22, 2009)

I thought I was losing it.Thank you BT


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## taffrail (Dec 23, 2018)

Jred said:


> Here is how the engine is mounted. It’s also as low as I’ll be able to get it.
> View attachment 54688



Last thought although it is not mine.

Standard Mounting
A
correct conventional installation would generally place the ant ventilation plate on many
engines about even with the boat
bottom when the engine propeller shaft is parallel to the boat
bottom (Figures 7-8 and 7-11).
Lower Mounting
Setting the engine lower (deeper in the water) (Figure 7-7) tends to:
1. cause excessive spray,
2. increase gear case drag,
3. reduce underwater clearance, and
4. adversely affect handling of faster boats.
However, there are exceptions
to the above. Many small fishing engines and some larger
engines are designed to run with their anti ventilation plate an inch or two below the boat
bottom. This can assist in reducing
or eliminating propeller ventilation.
Higher Mounting
In the past, the only negative effect from mounting an
outboard or stern drive higher than
standard was an increase in
propeller ventilation, which could cause difficulty in planing,
particularly with heavier loads.

Since the boat is a 14’6 skimmer, I'm guessing the motor is not huge, or even big. 

Guys I postulated enough effervescence to fill even a large outdoor out house. My input on this subject ends here. Good luck with your motor.


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## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

Boatbrains said:


> My eyes may be deceiving me but... it looks like the level is sitting on the top of the cav plate. If so and I am seeing it correctly the motor is an inch or so too low, James


This is correct the level is on top of the cav plate. And that’s how I’ve been running it and the bow plows. When I trim it up one notch to this







it raises the bow obviously but it causes cavitation. 

I have this “hydrofoil” that is more of a compression plate from what I’ve gathered that I’m back and fourth over weather I should install. Without going the new prop route I think trimming the motor to the picture above and then adding this will fix my problem. If not I’ll cut a tunnel in my skiff throw a 90hp on it, make the decks flush with the gunwale, throw an oversized center console on it, dual power poles, and a trolling motor.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> Your comment made me go back and read his posts before yours and I don’t see anything about porpoising when he moves the motor up one pin, only that he gets cavitation. Please correct me if I’m wrong. I don’t like to post misinformation and if I do I will accept my mistake and edit my post.
> This is what I read:
> View attachment 54662


I made the inference to porpoising because of the cavitation. One notch is making a huge difference.

In his pic I think his motor looks good. Not perfect but good. If he raises it he will ventilate more. If he raises and add the weight he could fine tune from there. If his bow is plowing it is lifting his stern to the point of ventilating. 

He could also add a shim on the outside of the hull to move the motor back when clamped. 

Jared - have you taken a straight edge to the hull to make certain you do not have a hook in the hull?


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## Guest (Jan 2, 2019)

Raise that motor 1.5-2”, please just trust me. Throw your fin on it, run it and get back to me.


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## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

DuckNut said:


> Jared - have you taken a straight edge to the hull to make certain you do not have a hook in the hull?


I have not but I will tomorrow. 


Boatbrains said:


> Raise that motor 1.5-2”, please just trust me. Throw your fin on it, run it and get back to me.


I’ll try this out when the weather clears up and I get a few days off work. I think this would work if I added a few inches of setback with a jack plate and had the fin on


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

DuckNut said:


> He could also add a shim on the outside of the hull to move the motor back when clamped.


Clarification: The lowest peg and one up is the difference of bow plow. Adding a shim to this position and put the angle of the motor between the two.


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## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

DuckNut said:


> Clarification: The lowest peg and one up is the difference of bow plow. Adding a shim to this position and put the angle of the motor between the two.


I thought about doing this as I was looking at it today may try it


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## CPurvis (Apr 6, 2016)

DuckNut said:


> He did. When the motor is tucked in and porpoises when up one pin. So I suggested to put in the position where it porpoises and add weight to the bow. This would be a cheap way to find out if that would work.


This^^^ Weight dispersion is key in this skiff. I have to do this in my skimmer. I have it dialed in to where i will add or remove weight depending on wether or not i have a passenger and or conditions on the water.


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## CPurvis (Apr 6, 2016)

Aslo 


CPurvis said:


> This^^^ Weight dispersion is key in this skiff. I have to do this in my skimmer. I have it dialed in to where i will add or remove weight depending on wether or not i have a passenger and or conditions on the water.


why i went with a cooler as a front casting platfornm intead of an aluminum. If i am by myself i will put 2 gallon water jugs in the cooler. If i have a passenger i will remove the water jugs. I have my trim pin set on 3rd pin. and 22 lb battery up front under bow.


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## crboggs (Mar 30, 2015)

CPurvis said:


> If i am by myself i will put 2 gallon water jugs in the cooler. If i have a passenger i will remove the water jugs. I have my trim pin set on 3rd pin. and 22 lb battery up front under bow.


Its interesting how these small skiffs feel weight distribution.

On my Spear something as small as an 8# mushroom anchor helps me balance the fact that I stand off center to run the tiller.


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## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

DuckNut said:


> Jared - have you taken a straight edge to the hull to make certain you do not have a hook in the hull?


Took a straight edge to it and there’s no significant hook. The last 1-2” on the transom does angle down a tiny bit but it’s really barely noticeable with the straight edge to it.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

crboggs said:


> Its interesting how these small skiffs feel weight distribution.
> 
> On my Spear something as small as an 8# mushroom anchor helps me balance the fact that I stand off center to run the tiller.


Try this. Get yourself on a gentle plane and lock the outboard straight ahead. Then move a couple inches to one side. You can steer the skiff by moving just a couple inches.

Edit...move to the bow and stand on one corner and you will turn pretty quick.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

Jred said:


> Took a straight edge to it and there’s no significant hook. The last 1-2” on the transom does angle down a tiny bit but it’s really barely noticeable with the straight edge to it.


Please clarify...take a three foot straight edge and how big is the gap?

If the bottom of the hull is the long part of the letter J and the very last 2 inches is the curve in the J.


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## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

DuckNut said:


> Try this. Get yourself on a gentle plane and lock the outboard straight ahead. Then move a couple inches to one side. You can steer the skiff by moving just a couple inches.
> 
> Edit...move to the bow and stand on one corner and you will turn pretty quick.


Haha ok I’ll do this infront of the coast guard station just Incase...
I’ve tried moving weight around a bunch already and pretty much have no weight in the bow. The only options I haven’t tried are moving the motor straight up or down, new prop, and adding a compression plate. 

The “hook” in the hull is so small that there’s no way it would be causing the skiff to plow. The problem lies with the motor angle/height/prop.


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## kylet (Jun 29, 2017)

Jred said:


> Haha ok I’ll do this infront of the coast guard station just Incase...
> I’ve tried moving weight around a bunch already and pretty much have no weight in the bow. The only options I haven’t tried are moving the motor straight up or down, new prop, and adding a compression plate.


You can get whatever change you want by changing the prop to a more appropriate prop. 

Changing your height or adding a compression plate may or may not provide a performance enhancement but, just from what I’ve gathered from this thread, I’d be shocked if it’s going to do what you are wanting to do.

I’d consider adding an electric trim like a cmc tilt and trim for the added benefits of being able to trim your engine. 

Is the boat biting when you turn or hit a side wave?


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## Str8-Six (Jul 6, 2015)

Lots of microskiffs ride bow down especially with the motor trimmed all the way down. I think raising the motor will help your bow issue since motor does look like it is mounted to low but it might cause other issues if you go to high. I would ask the builder of there opinion.


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## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

kylet said:


> You can get whatever change you want by changing the prop to a more appropriate prop.
> 
> Changing your height or adding a compression plate may or may not provide a performance enhancement but, just from what I’ve gathered from this thread, I’d be shocked if it’s going to do what you are wanting to do.
> 
> ...


It turns fine and takes wake fine at the right angle. I’m saving up for the cmc tilt bracket


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## CPurvis (Apr 6, 2016)

For reference. Also i doubt it has anything to do with the prop. It does seem your motor is sitting too low.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Str8-Six said:


> Lots of microskiffs ride bow down especially with the motor trimmed all the way down. I think raising the motor will help your bow issue since motor does look like it is mounted to low but it might cause other issues if you go to high. I would ask the builder of there opinion.


You guys are killing me with the terminology. Trim is not motor height, trimming the motor in causes the skeg to be lower and trimming out past level causes the skeg to be higher but it’s not changing the actual height of the motor as it is mounted on the transom. A jack plate that is raised and lowered is not trimming up and down. Not trying to be a jerk but the correct terminology will help everyone and if someone else uses the Search function they won’t be confused. Same thing with hydrofoils and compression plates, two totally different things.


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## Str8-Six (Jul 6, 2015)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> You guys are killing me with the terminology. Trim is not motor height, trimming the motor in causes the skeg to be lower and trimming out past level causes the skeg to be higher but it’s not changing the actual height of the motor as it is mounted on the transom. A jack plate that is raised and lowered is not trimming up and down. Not trying to be a jerk but the correct terminology will help everyone and if someone else uses the Search function they won’t be confused. Same thing with hydrofoils and compression plates, two totally different things.


Read my post again. I’m talking about two different things.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Str8-Six said:


> Read my post again. I’m talking about two different things.


Gotcha


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## goon squad (Jun 5, 2013)

Hopefully I can shed a little light on your bow down situation as I have a 2013 IPB witch I'm 99% sure was pulled from the same mold your skimmer was. I originally hated the boat for running bow down but have learned to love it. 

Look at the bottom centerline of the boat from the front and you will notice that the forward 1/3 bellies down deeper than the aft 2/3. Take a spoon and hold it loosely, turn on your kitchen faucet and touch the backside of spoon to the water and see what happens. That is why it sucks the bow down. 

I have a 25 Yamaha 2st. Mounted on a mini-jacker w/4" of set back and motor is 4" above transom which puts my cav. plate about 1" above waterline when running. You will need a good prop, I'm running a PowerTech SRA 3 blade.

In my experience, conditions will dictate on how it will perform also. Example: You can run these boats into the wind with some chop and it will haul ass and handle great, go the opposite direction and it's a totally different animal and will need to back of the throttle a little to get the bow up. 

In short, my suggestion is get a jackplate, raise your motor about 4", get a good prop with some cup in it and adjust your trim so the prop shaft is as close to parallel with the bottom as possible then start fine tuning it.

Hope this help


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## CPurvis (Apr 6, 2016)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> You guys are killing me with the terminology. Trim is not motor height, trimming the motor in causes the skeg to be lower and trimming out past level causes the skeg to be higher but it’s not changing the actual height of the motor as it is mounted on the transom. A jack plate that is raised and lowered is not trimming up and down. Not trying to be a jerk but the correct terminology will help everyone and if someone else uses the Search function they won’t be confused. Same thing with hydrofoils and compression plates, two totally different things.


True!


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## Sympleman01 (Jun 17, 2014)

Did you ever get it figured out? What did you find that worked?


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## Jred (Sep 22, 2013)

Sympleman01 said:


> Did you ever get it figured out? What did you find that worked?


I got an oz hydrofoil and moved the motor up a little and it it better now


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## Backcountry 16 (Mar 15, 2016)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> I understand where you were going, I was not implying you were wrong, just that other people that read this thread may get the wrong idea and think tabs will aid a hull that wants to run bow down.
> The combination of power trim and tabs makes sense. I run my boat with the motor trimmed out past level and tabs down some to get maximum speed. Without the tabs I couldn’t do this and would be running about 8 mph slower just to avoid porpoising.


I don't like this new softer side of Smackdaddy bring back the old smack sorry to derail carry on.


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## Derek Radtke (Feb 24, 2018)

Backcountry 16 said:


> I don't like this new softer side of Smackdaddy bring back the old smack sorry to derail carry on.


Smackdaddy 2020! Make Microskiff Great Again


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