# Dangers of overhorsing your skiff?



## zeneb (Jun 20, 2011)

I've got a 13ft Riverhawk with a little 4hp motor. My neighbor just called and said he's got a guy who's selling his motor which is either a 7 or 9 hp. Given that they 13 is only rated for 5 hp, what danger is there to going to a 7 or 9 assuming I'm not going to open it up full blast. I'm thinking of getting it if I can't get the 4hp to run right, but don't want to get into trouble with the over sided motor.


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

The bad parts are the added weight and stress that the boat was not designed for. You will litterally be putting on like 40-80% more power then it needs or can handle from the manufacturer. Most guys that do this beef up the transom first to avoid cracking issues.

The other side is getting inspected on the water by FWC or the CG. I'm not sure how much, but I believe it is a heafty fine and possibly more.

I had a 4hp on my old gheenoe and it did just fine, but mine was rated for 10hp and a 7 or 8 would have been perfect.


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

Too much horsepower applied at the wrong angle can can cause hull inversion.
The prop provides so much thrust that it turns the boat upside down, before the boat can change direction of travel.


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## The_Skiff_Shop (Oct 28, 2008)

I do not advocate nor will I hanging more hp than the CG plate stipulates on a customers boat but I can offer real world experience.

IMHO the 13 needs 8 to 10 hp to pop up on plane and allow you to crack back on the throttle and remain on plane.   With a fully loaded boat w/ two hunters a 9.9 strains @ WOT.

At non planing speeds, the larger foot swinging a bigger prop offers better boat control especially in swift current.


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## jlutsey (Sep 24, 2010)

i had the same boat and ran a 2 stroke 15hp yamaha wih no problems for years. It was scary fast if you wanted it to be but i never ran it that way. i felt it actually did better for the boat because it would plane better and got it up on the pad better than when it would squat with the 4hp it came with. Weight was not really an issue either. I was going to get the 9.9 and realized the 15 was the same size so said what the hell?


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## zeneb (Jun 20, 2011)

Hum.... this response sounds a bit like this Simpsons episode.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqfxmWbelcQ

So what you're saying is that _mumbles under his breath_ hang a 9hp and she'll rock.  Of all of the potential issues/benefits, having the DNR stop me with the over sized motor being a large fine is probably the show stopper.  I don't see me flipping it by making a sharp turn at speed as I'm going to be running it in a river, not a lake.  I also don't see the need to plane it out either.  Really my thinking was get this higher HP motor then if I pick up the 15' boat I've already got the horses for it.

It does beg the question though, why does the 13 have such a low HP rating compared to the 15?  With my recent visit to Hilton Head I saw some pretty small boats with 150's hung off of the back, but here we're talking 5 vs 9 or 10 hp.

Hooching



> I do not advocate nor will I hanging more hp than the CG plate stipulates on a customers boat but I can offer real world experience.
> 
> IMHO the 13 needs 8 to 10 hp to pop up on plane and allow you to crack back on the throttle and remain on plane.   With a fully loaded boat w/ two hunters a 9.9 strains @ WOT.
> 
> At non planing speeds, the larger foot swinging a bigger prop offers better boat control especially in swift current.


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## noeettica (Sep 23, 2007)

X2 100 %




> I do not advocate nor will I hanging more hp than the CG plate stipulates on a customers boat but I can offer real world experience.
> 
> IMHO the 13 needs 8 to 10 hp to pop up on plane and allow you to crack back on the throttle and remain on plane.   With a fully loaded boat w/ two hunters a 9.9 strains @ WOT.
> 
> At non planing speeds, the larger foot swinging a bigger prop offers better boat control especially in swift current.


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## The_Skiff_Shop (Oct 28, 2008)

> Hum.... this response sounds a bit like this Simpsons episode.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqfxmWbelcQ
> 
> ...


I was just offering real world experience.

The hp rating is established from the Coast Guard guidelines / calcs.

In rigging:

FYI, the 6, 8, 9.9 & 15 share the same lower and same diameter prop.  The weight for all four are also similar.


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## noeettica (Sep 23, 2007)

Yupp


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## mark_gardner (Mar 18, 2009)

imo the hp ratings are conservative ratings designed to keep the general public reasonably safe... and because of money hungry lawyers the boat manufactures arent willing to hang their azzes out on a line while you rip it up having fun   with that said i have always felt the majority of boats can reasonably exceed the hp rates by 15-25% easily as long as they're driven by an experienced boater. me and my bro had a gheenoe knock off rated for a 7 h.p. and decided to bump it up to a 9 hp but considering the fact everything between the 9 and 15 hp mercs are the same in terms of weight and physcial size we went with the 15 on the premis that its better to have more than you need rather than needing more than you have   ;D . we are both fairly decent sized boys and figured the extra power might come in handy pushing a boat with the 2 of us and a load of fish back to the ramp  : ;D  and in all honesty the boat handled it and handled it well      i say go for it just be cool


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## AfterHours2 (Aug 2, 2010)

Ive always leaned towards the larger HP motors when dealing with two of the same weight. Overall, you do not have to run full tilt boogie all the time but it is sure nice to have the extra power in case of the unexpected storm or a larger than normal load. if it is a toss up between the 9.9 or 15, I vote 15 any day. Just remove the decals and stick some 2 HP numbers on there... ;D


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## Tom_C (Dec 10, 2006)

> Of all of the potential issues/benefits, having the DNR stop me with the over sized motor being a large fine is probably the show stopper.


This same question has been asked a hundred time here. Someone all ways states something like, "The other side is getting inspected on the water by FWC or the CG. I'm not sure how much, but I believe it is a hefty fine and possibly more. " 

I have never heard, according to FL law number xxx.xxx_xx you will be fined for having over power a boat."

Also the VIN tag on my Gheenoe states: MAX REC HP 10. Is this the recommended max or the max allowed per some law. Time for someone in law enforcement to speak up.


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

Exceeding the limits on the capacity plate is a non-criminal safety violation.



> Florida law requires that anyone convicted of a criminal boating violation, a non-criminal boating infraction which resulted in a boating accident, or two non-criminal boating safety infractions within a 12-month period, must enroll in, attend, and successfully complete a NASBLA/state approved classroom boater education course. Correspondence or on-line course applications do not meet these requirements.
> 
> Anyone who is convicted of a criminal boating violation, any boating infraction resulting in a reportable boating accident, or two non-criminal boating safety violations within a 12-month period must attend and successfully complete an approved boating safety course and file proof with the Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission. The violator's privilege to operate a vessel in the state will be suspended until proof of course completion is filed.
> 
> ...


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## Tom_C (Dec 10, 2006)

> Exceeding the limits on the capacity plate is a non-criminal safety violation.


How am I exceeding the limits [smiley=1-headache.gif] if there are no stated limits? The capacity plate does not have a limit on the HP, it has a Max HP *recommended.*


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## cutrunner (Jun 8, 2010)

Beef up the transom and put a 25 on it. Runs great!


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

Here you go Tom C-

Part 183.53 of Section 33 of the Code of Federal Regulations (CFR) gives two methods of calculating maximum hp for vessels less than 20'.  1) Computation or 2) performance.

If the boat is 13' or less it must have a minimum of 19" transom and be remote steering in order to use the performance method.  I could be wrong but I do not believe the 13 qualifies.

If I am correct in my above assumption, then the computation method is the only way to calculate max hp.

To find the value you multiply length in feet by width of the transom in feet and then use that value against the table created by the USCG.  So let's say a 13'er has a transom of 3.5'; that equals 45.  45 in the table equals 10 hp maximum by Federal Law.

In respect to the REC - it would be considered MAX as that is what would be calculated by the use of the Federal Regulation.


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## Tom_C (Dec 10, 2006)

And punishment Is????


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

waiting on email response for RFI sent to FDLE/myfwc.com


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## Brett (Jul 16, 2008)

*Exceeding the Capacity Plate*

FDLE got back to me and sent me this link.
In it are all the regs and the consequences for non-criminal violations.
These apply to Florida, I'm sure other states have their own similar regulations.

http://www.myfloridahouse.gov/FileStores/Web/Statutes/FS09/CH0327/Section_0327.73.HTM

Exceeding the horsepower rating is a non-criminal violation ($50 fine per violation)
unless (and this is the part that can bite ya') the citing officer
decides you were operating the vessel in a reckless manner.
Then it becomes a first degree misdemeanor 
which can result in up to a $1000 fine and/or possible jail time.
Not to mention having to appear in court and paying court/attorney costs.



> 327.73  Noncriminal infractions.—
> 
> (1)  Violations of the following provisions of the vessel laws of this state are noncriminal infractions:
> 
> ...





> 327.52  Maximum loading and horsepower.—
> 
> (1)  Except for sailboats, canoes, kayaks, and inflatable boats, this section applies to all monohull motorboats less than 20 feet in length that are: manufactured or used primarily for noncommercial use; leased, rented, or chartered to another for the latter's noncommercial use; or engaged in the carrying of six or fewer passengers for hire.
> 
> ...





> 327.33  Reckless or careless operation of vessel.—
> 
> (1)  It is unlawful to operate a vessel in a reckless manner. A person is guilty of reckless operation of a vessel who operates any vessel, or manipulates any water skis, aquaplane, or similar device, in willful or wanton disregard for the safety of persons or property at a speed or in a manner as to endanger, or likely to endanger, life or limb, or damage the property of, or injure any person. Reckless operation of a vessel includes, but is not limited to, a violation of s. 327.331(6). Any person who violates a provision of this subsection commits a misdemeanor of the first degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083





> 775.082 states:
> 
> A person who has been convicted of a designated misdemeanor may be sentenced as follows:
> 
> For a misdemeanor of the first degree, by a definite term of imprisonment not exceeding 1 year;





> 775.083  Fines.—
> 
> (1)  A person who has been convicted of an offense other than a capital felony may be sentenced to pay a fine in addition to any punishment described in s. 775.082; when specifically authorized by statute, he or she may be sentenced to pay a fine in lieu of any punishment described in s. 775.082. A person who has been convicted of a noncriminal violation may be sentenced to pay a fine. Fines for designated crimes and for noncriminal violations shall not exceed:
> 
> ...


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## zeneb (Jun 20, 2011)

For those of you in Georgia who are interested, I just talked to a DNR guy about this and he stated that as long as you're within reason, they don't go hunting for over horsed boats to write up. he recommended that I slap a 6 HP on it and have fun.

Hooching


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## TomFL (Oct 2, 2007)

Dude just put a V-Rod 300 on the back and be done with it. The downside is nil. 

The officer won't be able to get a good look at who was driving, and even if he did the skin on your face would be so distorted from wind (and fun) that you'd look rougher than Merl Haggard and Keith Richards put together. 

Second, he wouldn't be able to catch you to write the ticket!

Third, if for any reason they did actually catch you scuttling the vessel shouldn't be hard since it'd be one big stress crack and then they'd have no evidence against you! 

My $.02

-T


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## firecat1981 (Nov 27, 2007)

> FDLE got back to me and sent me this link.
> In it are all the regs and the consequences for non-criminal violations.
> These apply to Florida, I'm sure other states have their own similar regulations.
> 
> ...


Don't forget the field day the blood sucking personal injury lawyers will have with you should you hurt anyone in a collision, even if they are in your own boat.


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## DuckNut (Apr 3, 2009)

> blood sucking personal injury lawyers


For convenience here is their phone number 1-800-AXE-GARY...oh wait, they don't defend stupid - they repersent stupid.


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## TomFL (Oct 2, 2007)

> > blood sucking personal injury lawyers
> 
> 
> For convenience here is their phone number 1-800-AXE-GARY...oh wait, they don't defend stupid - they repersent stupid.


They don't just repersent stoopid, they also chase 'em down in the ambulance...

-T


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