# Gheenoe 15'4 Floor Options



## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

Do you have any photos of the crack? Also, have you reached out to Gheenoe Mfg in Titusville? They may fix this under warranty (not sure how long their warranty is)??


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## oysterhsdr (Feb 21, 2017)

Thanks for your reply Yobata! I'm not aware of Gheenoe's warranty and honestly even if it still was under warranty I would feel bad contacting them, because for one I feel like I certainly got my moneys worth out of this hull over the past 10 years, and to some degree used this boat very much outside of it's intended purpose. Not to mention the past 4 years it's been over powered by a 15hp 2 stroke I bought to replace my 9.9 4 stroke for the sole purpose of going faster haha!

In regards to a picture, it wasn't visible to the naked eye; it actually did not leak when it wasn't under power and only leaked when it was running. Initially I did mark the spot where I saw water coming in and ground a small area out and attempted to patch it with Marine Tex, however, it leaked as soon as I took it out the next time.


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

Is it possible that the crack is inside of the bench boxes? A proper fix would involve flipping the hull and fixing from the outside and then making the repair on the inside as well. 

As far as reinforcing the entire floor, you could put a layer (or several) of a biax fabric (12oz biax or 17oz biax) after prepping the area by grinding all gelcoat/paint to bare glass. That way you beef it up a bit without having to put in a false floor


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## oysterhsdr (Feb 21, 2017)

Thanks again for your reply! The crack is in the middle of the floor section between the rear bench and center box, crack may be a bad word for it as it likely a pin-hole leak. On my first attempt to fix I did flip the hull and marine tex both sides but I think I sanded too much material off and basically ended up in the same situation.

So you do think a couple of layers of biax would make the floor solid enough to alleviate most of the floor flex? A little is fine but I'd hate to do all of that work to end up in the same situation.

P.S. your build is really impressive too!


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## Hemingwhy (Aug 2, 2017)

I'm interested in reducing flex, too. 


oysterhsdr said:


> Option 2: No false floor, leave center box in and just run a couple layers of fiberglass down on the existing floor and up the interior sides of the boat. I'm not sure that this method would be rigid enough to alleviate the floor flex. Let me know your thoughts!


On my project boat, the center seat/live well has been removed, though. I'm in between on false floor v. adding a layer of 1708. My thought now is to add 1 layer of glass but to do it with 3 strips that overlap a few inches at each of the chines (or small steps in the hull).


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

oysterhsdr said:


> Thanks again for your reply! The crack is in the middle of the floor section between the rear bench and center box, crack may be a bad word for it as it likely a pin-hole leak. On my first attempt to fix I did flip the hull and marine tex both sides but I think I sanded too much material off and basically ended up in the same situation.
> 
> So you do think a couple of layers of biax would make the floor solid enough to alleviate most of the floor flex? A little is fine but I'd hate to do all of that work to end up in the same situation.
> 
> P.S. your build is really impressive too!


I am not sure. I tried to add just a single layer of 12oz biax to the floor of my skiff and while it stiffened it up a bit, there was still too much flex for me so I added stringers, ribs, foam and a sole. My boat is much wider than yours however, so keep that in mind...


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## albuilt51 (Sep 30, 2016)

I'm in the same situation, although the 'leaks' in my keel are plainly visible from years of wear and tear. New glass inside and out is a necessity. The center bench has been removed for ribs, foam, and encapsulated 3/8" ply to be put down. The factory floor is just too flimsy for me, and the idea of a flat floor is too inviting. Some reinforcement of the gunnels will also be needed after removing the center bench.
15hp 2-stroke! My 9.9 E-rude was overkill for me, and now have secured an 8hp 2-smoke which should suit my uses perfectly, but after the reinforcement and added weight we'll have to see...


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## lemaymiami (Feb 9, 2007)

Here's another few suggestions for anyone with a leaky gheenoe (or other small craft...). Before you do anything in the way of a repair -it might be a good idea to see exactly what's going on with your hull... To that end I usually do a "water test" - but not on the water... Plug your drain hole and use a hose to fill the bottom of your skiff - just to the chines (remember water equals weight (lots of it...) so be careful not to get carried away. Once your interior bottom is covered it's time to get up under your hull and carefully inspect every inch of it for any signs of water (you're looking for a drip, a lot of drips - or just a wet spot...) . Bring a dry cloth with you and a magic marker so you can locate any leaks again... With the cloth wipe away any water forming once or twice to get some idea of just how fast you've got water coming in - and where... since where you see it inside your hull might not be where it's actually coming in (particularly if you have built in bench seats that don't allow you to see up under them to the hull).... If you don't have enough light sometimes a flashlight is handy as well.... Once you marked all of your leaky areas (with luck only one - but you might have a weakened seam so you want to look all along the bottom from the transom forward to the bow...) you'll have a much better idea of what you're facing in the way of repairs...

The next tip is for gheenoe owners - go to custom gheenoe.com and browse through it to see if anyone has listed any similar repairs... You might hook up with someone that's the done the exact repair you needing for advice... Once you've done a bit of homework then contact that site directly and ask the folks that build and customize gheenoes how they'd recommend you proceed.... If all else fails you know they'll be glad to do the repair/mod for you (as would any glass shop...).

Good luck, many years ago I owned a riveted aluminum hull and learned a lot more about leaky hulls than I ever wanted to know....


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## oysterhsdr (Feb 21, 2017)

albuilt51 said:


> I'm in the same situation, although the 'leaks' in my keel are plainly visible from years of wear and tear. New glass inside and out is a necessity. The center bench has been removed for ribs, foam, and encapsulated 3/8" ply to be put down. The factory floor is just too flimsy for me, and the idea of a flat floor is too inviting. Some reinforcement of the gunnels will also be needed after removing the center bench.
> 15hp 2-stroke! My 9.9 E-rude was overkill for me, and now have secured an 8hp 2-smoke which should suit my uses perfectly, but after the reinforcement and added weight we'll have to see


Yeah, by myself I've had it up to 27mph until it starts it porpoising.... my hull is very basic with no jack-plate, trim tabs, stock prop etc. so I could prob get more mph if I tweaked the set-up. With my wife up front it goes the same speed because the extra weight up front keeps it from porpoising. It can be scary at that speed, but I honestly upgraded for when I have another person, plus fishing gear, battery, TM, cooler, etc. I was only getting 15-16 mph WOT out of my 9.9 4 stroke, with the 15 hp I can cruise around 21-22 mph which makes a big difference if you have a long run.

I think you'll love that 8hp, my friend that got me into gheenoe's had a 8hp evinrude seahorse and it was a sweet motor. We went places in that thing that only boats with mud motors would go due to submerged logs stumps etc., it was so light he would pick the motor up with ease over obstacles. You'd be worn out trying to do it with a modern 4 stroke or even my 15hp 2 stroke. It performed really well on that boat with faster acceleration than my 9.9 and only a mph or 2 off my top speed.


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## albuilt51 (Sep 30, 2016)

I've never had an 8hp but did have a good running 6hp 1970's Johnson on one of my earlier 15-4's and it moved it along very well with just myself and a 65# lab in the boat. So like a true artilleryman, with one shot at 6hp and another at 9.9, the 8hp should be the ticket to fire for effect.


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## oysterhsdr (Feb 21, 2017)

@albuilt51 Awesome man, have fun with it. I love the artillery reference too.

@lemaymiami Thanks for your suggestion as well, I have considered contacting the folks at Gheenoe/Custom Gheenoe to get a price on decks, false floor, and basic wiring for lights and a bilge, but didn't know if they would work on older hulls. I may reach out to them because I'd rather be fishing then covered in fiberglass haha.


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

I've read that at some point hp measurement changed from motor to prop measurement (or something like that lol). Not sure of year this change happened or if it affects your motor @albuilt51


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## albuilt51 (Sep 30, 2016)

I would think that any difference between motor and prop hp in a outboard this size would be minimal, but until I have the boat ready it's only speculation. One thing for sure is, that any older crankshaft hp rated 2-smoke I've had will run circles around the newer prop rated outboards of the same hp. Then there is the difference in weight when applied to a small, lightweight boat.


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## predacious (Sep 1, 2016)

what you guys are referring to as a "floor" in a gheenoe - that's the hull.those boats have no stringers,the hull WILL flex,end result of that flex is breaking.
a false DECK will stiffen up the hull considerably.use a piece of PVC,"halfed" - "halfed being,run it down a table saw,cutting it in half.lay that down,to cover the "channel",that runs down the middle of the boat.
all glass surfaces need to be prepped correctly,before ANYTHING takes place."prepped correctly",that means grinding,grinding to remove any coating on the fiberglass and rough up the glass.

run a few strips of 1708,over top of that PVC pipe,that will hold it in place.

your choice here,but you want a composite - NOT WOOD ! Penske/coosa board is the way to go.drop a piece of that penske/coosa board down and be sure to cut it @ a 45* on the sides."160 bonding putty",drop down the Penske/coosa board,drop a layer of 1708 over the false DECK,overlapping about 6" on each side...

the PVC will add a stiffener,also becomes a rigging tube,deck drain...

filling a boat with water,without the hull being fully supported,is asking for trouble ! water weighs 8lbs/gallon....a gheenoe is far from being built well...


wood:
it's 2017 - wood ?? seriously ?

"build" - i'm "building" a boat - look at my "build" - every time I click on that,i expect to read/see pictures of someone laying up a hull/deck.i've yet to see that,i see fiberglass repairs and refinishing,and in some cases,i see people installing rod holders and seats ??
"gheenoe build","ashcraft build" - tell me,how does a boat get"built" when it's already layed up,and out of a mold ? 

"build" - one of those terms people use,that just irritates me.kinda like people using the word "issue" in place of "problem" - it honestly sounds really stupid...

rant over...


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

I love wood!


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## predacious (Sep 1, 2016)

yobata said:


> I love wood!



nothing "wrong" with wood

but

it's 2017,BETTER products are available.wood requires epoxy.big differences in wood - example,cdx grade home depot pressure treated ply,is NEVER a good choice.wood is heavy,wood soaks up water like a sponge,and last point,wood rots ! Penske/coosa board will absorb no water,weighs 45% less and lasts indefinatley.

there's pros and cons on any product,however,technology has given us fiberglass,yes i'm aware of noah's ark being built with wood....


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## oysterhsdr (Feb 21, 2017)

OK guys, I've decided to just lay fiberglass on the existing floor and to get my boat back in business; I know that it won't have the rigidity of the false floor but I'm OK with that.

So my question is this; should I use 1708 or should I just use 17oz cloth on the floor? From what I've researched it appears that 1708 is a combo of cloth/mat... what is the benefit on using mat for this application. I have no first-hand experience, but from what I've read folks say mat does little in the way of adding strength but rather helps build thickness. If strength is my goal for the floor does it make sense to use 1708 that contains mat if it does little to promote strength but sucks up resin and adds weight?

Take it easy on me guys, this is my first fiberglass project, and I can't think of a better item to learn on than a boat that could leave you swimming around the tons of alligators in my area if it fails haha!


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## yobata (Jul 14, 2015)

oysterhsdr said:


> OK guys, I've decided to just lay fiberglass on the existing floor and to get my boat back in business; I know that it won't have the rigidity of the false floor but I'm OK with that.
> 
> So my question is this; should I use 1708 or should I just use 17oz cloth on the floor? From what I've researched it appears that 1708 is a combo of cloth/mat... what is the benefit on using mat for this application. I have no first-hand experience, but from what I've read folks say mat does little in the way of adding strength but rather helps build thickness. If strength is my goal for the floor does it make sense to use 1708 that contains mat if it does little to promote strength but sucks up resin and adds weight?
> 
> Take it easy on me guys, this is my first fiberglass project, and I can't think of a better item to learn on than a boat that could leave you swimming around the tons of alligators in my area if it fails haha!


Are you planning on using Epoxy or Polyester resin?

If Epoxy, you do not need the mat, so 17oz biax will do.

If Poly, I believe it requires the mat to catalyze properly (although I have never personally worked with the stuff), so 1708 is required.

Most importantly, make sure you prep the area well by sanding down the paint or gelcoat to bare fiberglass and radius any corners (epoxy + woodflour or silica beads mixed to a peanut butter consistency works well for "fileting" 90* corners). Good luck, and post pics!


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## oysterhsdr (Feb 21, 2017)

I know this is a super old thread, but I hate when I'm searching and do not see where the OP updates to let others know what worked (or didn't).

I ended up grinding down to bare fiberglass as suggested here and layed 2 layers of 17oz biax and one layer of 12oz biax with West Marine epoxy resin. This effectively strengthened the hull; and while there is a slight amount of floor flex it is way less than she came from the factory. I'm very happy with how it turned out and if anything it's given more confidence for fiberglass projects moving forward.


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## Fishtex (May 10, 2014)

predacious said:


> what you guys are referring to as a "floor" in a gheenoe - that's the hull.those boats have no stringers,the hull WILL flex,end result of that flex is breaking.
> a false DECK will stiffen up the hull considerably.use a piece of PVC,"halfed" - "halfed being,run it down a table saw,cutting it in half.lay that down,to cover the "channel",that runs down the middle of the boat.
> all glass surfaces need to be prepped correctly,before ANYTHING takes place."prepped correctly",that means grinding,grinding to remove any coating on the fiberglass and rough up the glass.
> 
> ...


.....and what the hell is a “false floor”? It’s a sole, we stand on the sole or the decks. The sole is supported by stringers. If there are no stringers just the hull, well that is your sole....rant over, got to go yell at the kids to get off my lawn.


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## predacious (Sep 1, 2016)

Fishtex said:


> .....and what the hell is a “false floor”? It’s a sole, we stand on the sole or the decks. The sole is supported by stringers. If there are no stringers just the hull, well that is your sole....rant over, got to go yell at the kids to get off my lawn.


wow,you off your meds or something ?


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