# Long pickups with weighted flies



## tailwalk (Nov 20, 2016)

I asked this in my permit line thread but I was thinking and was encouraged that this is a separate topic. 

I'm planning on a trip next year that will have me in a situation I haven't been in before, which is fishing for permit. I understand the need for a quick recast is pretty common, which leads me to my current practice goal. Using a weighted fly I need to develop the ability to pickup and recast a long line.

I'd love to hear from others who have more experience about how you accomplish this. The tip I got in my line thread was great, start with the rod tip in the water. Looking forward to more advice!

Thanks!


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## eightwt (May 11, 2017)

No expert, but i've found to make sure no slack in line, start slow and excelerate quickly, while executing a good double haul. No false cast, seems to just screw me up.


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## 59441 (Oct 2, 2020)

A flyrod with a lot of backbone would help you pick up all that wet line.


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## Featherweight (Jan 7, 2020)

Hey just practice practice practice casting. At targets, leading targets by 5 feet, and using the wind to drift and land where you want. 

Mindset? It is a fish and you can catch it! You can cast well but you must feed the fish. Listen to your guide he is on your team.

Book 3 days don’t plan on one day. It can take some time for tide,fish, angler and guide to make it happen. 

You will do it!


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## Seymour fish (May 13, 2018)

Featherweight said:


> Hey just practice practice practice casting. At targets, leading targets by 5 feet, and using the wind to drift and land where you want.
> 
> Mindset? It is a fish and you can catch it! You can cast well but you must feed the fish. Listen to your guide he is on your team.
> 
> ...


This. And practice with the flies you will be throwing, in every wind direction, especially the one you hate. GL!


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## tailwalk (Nov 20, 2016)

The trip in question is a week in the Bahamas. If I can get one to look at my fly I'll consider it a victory. My mindset is to work for the next year to do my best to eliminate as many variables as possible. After that it's up to the fish. I like the quote I heard from Harry Spear- "success is a gift. Excellence is the only thing to strive for"


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## birdyshooter (Sep 17, 2019)

A trick I use is a roll cast into a back cast. It takes some practice, so hit a pond first to get it down.


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## Hank (Jan 14, 2019)

One or two looong haaard strips with rod tip pointed directly at the fly, with the line under casting hand index finger and then a great backcast. You are halfway there.


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## Thtguyrobb (Nov 1, 2019)

Also make sure your rod tip is in the water when you pick up... probably super basic point, but we often forget the simple things.


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## Snakesurf (Jun 18, 2019)

Hank said:


> One or two looong haaard strips with rod tip pointed directly at the fly, with the line under casting hand index finger and then a great backcast. You are halfway there.


Try to get the weighted fly to the surface as much as possible, that is what this will do, then haul it out of the water and haul on your back cast (double haul) going forward quickly like hitting the nail. The line goes where the tip of the rod goes. With weighted flies you need a little rounder cast or more open loop but not too open. You will hit the tip with the fly sometimes if not.


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## sjrobin (Jul 13, 2015)

Be aware of the speed of the skiff as you make the first cast. Pick the fly up fast before it settles if you know the cast is off target or the fish changes direction. Try not to let go of the fly line in your left hand so you can find it and reset. Very difficult if the skiff is moving down wind with the sun at your back. I like to hunt fish into the wind if possible.


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## Featherweight (Jan 7, 2020)

tailwalk said:


> The trip in question is a week in the Bahamas. If I can get one to look at my fly I'll consider it a victory. My mindset is to work for the next year to do my best to eliminate as many variables as possible. After that it's up to the fish. I like the quote I heard from Harry Spear- "success is a gift. Excellence is the only thing to strive for"


I do not know of many permit in the Bahamas. I know Crooked Island and the Abacos (on the ocean side) might have some opportunities. Focus on big bonefish. If you want permit Key West, Belize and Mexico are your best opportunities.


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## tailwalk (Nov 20, 2016)

True, bonefish will be a major part of the trip. I'm almost as excited for that. I've been lucky enough to have plenty of resources to tap into when it comes to them. Permit on the other hand, well that's why I'm here.


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## brokeoff (Sep 2, 2016)

*


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## Jason M (Aug 13, 2017)

Abaco has good permit fishing.



Snakesurf said:


> Try to get the weighted fly to the surface as much as possible, that is what this will do, then haul it out of the water and haul on your back cast (double haul) going forward quickly like hitting the nail. The line goes where the tip of the rod goes. With weighted flies you need a little rounder cast or more open loop but not too open. You will hit the tip with the fly sometimes if not.


This is good info. Reach out and get the slack out and start your back cast. I also bet you will not be picking up really long casts, rather short shots to reposition. If you have the sink tip, roll cast it up to get the fly up and begin the cast.

Look up the Belgium cast of your not familiar it h helps with weighted flies as they won't hinge around on the transition on the back cast. 

Also get really good at presenting the fly with your back cast.


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## Featherweight (Jan 7, 2020)

What’s a Belgium cast? Just practice and feed the fish!


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## tailwalk (Nov 20, 2016)

Best description I can give is a Belgian cast is a method of casting in more of an oval shape allowing constant tension and helping to beat wind. Also good at keeping weighted flies from "kicking" as mentioned


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## jay.bush1434 (Dec 27, 2014)

Some good info above, especially the part about regular practice. As said, tip down to the water, strip tight and make sure to lift the rod up for your back cast. This seems obvious but most folks cast partially side arm as it feels more comfortable but you will get a lot more lift going as straight up as possible. You can also extend your arm out before you start to lift the line but make sure you get your elbow back to your body so you can use your shoulder and core muscles to finish lifting the line. While extending your arm out may increase your casting stroke, leaving your arm extended with your elbow out from your body causes you to use smaller muscles in your arm and lose leverage against the weight of the line. You can add a haul as the line lifts out of the water to help load the rod. If you haul too soon before the line lifts out of the water, the line will slurp across the surface making a bunch of noise and potentially spooking or at least alerting the fish that something is up. Make sure you don't lean forward much though as this tends to push down on the bow of the boat and push a pressure wave from the boat potentially spooking the already tough to catch fish. You guide will likely let you know if you start moving around too much up front...


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## lemaymiami (Feb 9, 2007)

That mention of "body english" when trying to drive a fly is something I've noticed over the years - particularly with fly anglers from the northeast aboard. Being able to toss that fly without moving your body makes a real difference in skinny waters where bouncing the bow of the boat as you cast will alert fish - maybe spooking them.

I don't think fish know what a boat is - but if they sense something large coming their way they will scoot (or die in their world...). That's one of the reasons I make a point of fishing big tarpon in rivers by coming at them with the current and not against it...


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## crboggs (Mar 30, 2015)

For a good water haul with a heavy fly I like to recover enough line that I can smoothly pick the line up off the water and haul the leader+fly in one smooth motion.

Think of it like a slow haul that accelerates as soon as the end of your fly line is off the surface. But with more of a vertical lift than side armed...

This results is less of a ripping sound and less commotion IMHO while using the friction between the line and the water to pre-load your rod before you accelerate the haul to get into your back cast. @jay.bush1434 did a good job describing this in his post as well.

As others have mentioned...the rod is a huge factor in this...my Sage Maverick doesn't pick up nearly as well as my Loomis NRX. But then very few rods pick up as well as an NRX, which is what makes it such a beast on an open flat.


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## mro (Jan 24, 2018)

Hank said:


> One or two looong haaard strips with rod tip pointed directly at the fly, with the line under casting hand index finger and then a great backcast. You are halfway there.





jay.bush1434 said:


> Some good info above, especially the part about regular practice. As said, tip down to the water, strip tight and make sure to lift the rod up for your back cast.


I cast using my right hand.
When I'm in a hurry to make a second cast, as I'm stripping the line back with my left hand I'm pulling it through the index finger of my right. I gain about an extra two feet each strip by extending my rod arm toward the fly, clamping the line with the index finger at the end of the strip and pulling the rod back into position to either go for a back cast or another strip.
Every little bit helps...


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## Jcflyfish (Apr 5, 2021)

Hi guys. I’m new to microskiff but I’m not new to fly fishing. I’ve got a couple of additional thoughts to add on this topic. First, know your fly line taper. If the head of the fly line is 40 feet it’s really difficult to pick up 50 or 60 feet of fly line. You’re better off stripping in quickly until the end of the head is just outside of the rod tip. This means a line with a longer head makes it a little easier to make those really long pick ups. Todays multi color lines make it really easy to know where the end of the head is. The second tip is called “bracing”. Basically, when you’re making your backcast haul and pulling all the line off the water (not to mention your heavy fly) you tuck your fighting butt against your forearm. This gives you an added measure of power and makes the long pick up that much easier. Hope this helps. 

Jake


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## birddog (Feb 21, 2019)

I find that every sink tip line has a "sweet spot" where the weight of the line really helps shoot the line. Typically, I strip back until I'm close to that point, give two very quick strips to get my fly up in the water column and start a slow haul as someone else mentioned while raising my rod tip. I think this is the most important part because I've seen fish spook if you water haul too early, raise too much line from the water, and make too much noise. Better to take an extra false cast than to spook a fish! Once I can see my fly at the top of the water, I accelerate my haul and back cast, let the tension with the water load my rod. One good haul and forward cast is usually enough to shoot the line back to where it was before I started stripping.

Btw, saw a permit while wading a well known flat in Eleuthera in the summertime. Good luck on your trip!


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## tailwalk (Nov 20, 2016)

Thanks everyone for chiming in on this! Lots of useful tips. Been practicing in the pond out back and getting more comfortable. A couple things I've noticed while working with my 8 weight meridian and some bonefish flies:

the line matters. Previously I was using sa saltwater, which is a great line for general use. I'll be keeping it for certain situations. I strung up some cortland bonefish line and noticed an improvement in control and stability on the longer pickup. I attribute the difference to the longer taper of the bonefish line as well as the fact that it's a true to weight line therefore it doesn't overload the rod. With the increased mass out of the rod tip I feel like the 1/2 over feature of the sa saltwater works against the goal of control on the initial back cast. The meridian seems happier with the true to weight line when dealing with the bonefish flies.

The leader construction also matters. Following the guidelines in chico's book I've found that the appropriate material and butt length plays a role in the leader properly laying out and again contributes to control. 

Practice! Haul timing, stops, all the fundamentals. Can't overstate the importance of learning the components of proper casting and putting in the work to drill them in and make them second nature. Thinking about the cast while doing it screws me up sometimes. 

Still going to work with the 8. More progress is needed. Next up is the 9, with heavier flies.


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