# Tunnel, why?



## anzuelo (Feb 28, 2017)

A tunnel allows the boat to run much shallower than the same hull without a tunnel. There are benefits of this of course but there are some disadvantages. 

1. With a tunnel you can run much shallower than the boats "at rest" draft. That means if you come off plane in too shallow an area, you hull will be resting against the bottom with insufficient water to float back to deeper water.

2. Tunnel hulls have a mind of their own when you put the motor in reverse.

3. Tunnel hulls can be very unstable in high speed turns as the tunnel can grab water and flip the boat.

The question you have to ask yourself is whether the advantages of shallower running are more important than the disadvantages.


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## Vertigo (Jun 3, 2012)

I've probably owned and run more than a dozen tunnel hulled skiffs. I've never noticed any instability in high speed turns or problems running in reverse. 

The main downside to a tunnel hull is that it's a little slower and a little less fuel efficient than a conventional hull. 

To get most of the advantage of a tunnel hull, it must be coupled with a jack plate which, in turn, leads to more expense, weight and complication; but, a good tunnel/jack plate combo can get the skeg 6 or more inches higher on plane than would be possible with a conventional hull.


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## Guest (Mar 11, 2020)

Ya’ll gonna make me fat


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## Capnredfish (Feb 1, 2012)

Please tell me how to post a gif. It’s time.


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## Capnredfish (Feb 1, 2012)

Tunnel done right is purely for running shallow. It puts the motor higher and provides water to prop and cooling intake. Does not improve speed or hole shot. Depth yes. In reality hole shot ‘can’ be worse. Not written in stone. If half your prop is out of water when still. It could hurt hole shot. Again. Depends on setup. And you would have to compare same hull with and without a tunnel.


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## Charles Hadley (Jan 20, 2019)

Boatbrains said:


> View attachment 122604
> 
> Ya’ll gonna make me fat


I'd ask for some of that but it's your lap


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## commtrd (Aug 1, 2015)

I have never owned a boat without a tunnel. Never once had the tunnel make the boat handle such that it would flip over. Ever. Backing up out of a slip or boat launch, never had too much problem with -sort of- steering adequately in reverse. Not great but good enough to get aimed the right direction. Holeshot: never tried to do it with motor lifted. At that time, the tunnel is not moving any water so it does not help to have lift on the hole shot. On the other hand, I have had the joyous experience of running in 3" on plane, seeing a school of fish and shutting down, only then remembering my boat takes at least 5" to float. Whoops. And more than once has this happened, discovering I got back up in a lake and having to make a wide sweeping turn to power back out to deeper water. Pucker factor. I almost ordered my Chittum Laguna Madre 2 without a tunnel. Hal told me the difference in draft at rest is around 3/16 inch between tunnel or non-tunnel on the 2* deadrise. So not too darn much difference on the pole. The only real benefit to a tunnel is the ability to cross extremely shallow water running for extended time without burning up the power head, and not tearing up sea-grass beds. The LLM of TX is unique in that regard, as there are miles of shallow grass flats that if one had to only pole in/out, the whole day would be spent poling. 

SO is it viable owning a tunnel hull boat? Probably for most people no. I kind of half-way wish there was no such thing, just to stop the rampant flats-burning due to idiots running tunnel hulls that have no business running a boat at all, let alone burning shorelines just because they can. It will cost me an extra $3500 clams to get the tunnel. So this is not a decision to take lightly. For where I fish (a lot) I think I need a tunnel. But like everything, one has to know the pros and cons for both tunnel and non-tunnel.


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## Capnredfish (Feb 1, 2012)

I had a tunnel hull. It ran shallow. But it was a horrible design. Would I own a tunnel again? If it were a boat I liked everything else about it then yes.


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## jonterr (Mar 24, 2013)

Charles Hadley said:


> I'd ask for some of that but it's your lap





Charles Hadley said:


> I'd ask for some of that but it's your lap


Don’t worry
He’s got a hole cut out in the bottom of the bag


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## jonterr (Mar 24, 2013)

jonterr said:


> Don’t worry
> He’s got a hole cut out in the bottom of the bag


Btw
Anybody ever tried that?


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## Charles Hadley (Jan 20, 2019)

jonterr said:


> Don’t worry
> He’s got a hole cut out in the bottom of the bag


Oh it's ok then


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## commtrd (Aug 1, 2015)

vented right?


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## crboggs (Mar 30, 2015)

Tunnel, why?

Because...TUNNEL!



https://www.instagram.com/p/B69NO5RBC1D/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link


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## William Odling (Jan 8, 2020)

jonterr said:


> Btw
> Anybody ever tried that?


A tunneled popcorn bag? Hmmm


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

If I have to explain then I’m not wasting words. If you like to sight fish and want to fish the middle coast of Texas come with me and I’ll show you why and not a blade of live grass will be harmed. Message me for booking information.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

anzuelo said:


> A tunnel allows the boat to run much shallower than the same hull without a tunnel. There are benefits of this of course but there are some disadvantages.
> 
> 1. With a tunnel you can run much shallower than the boats "at rest" draft. That means if you come off plane in too shallow an area, you hull will be resting against the bottom with insufficient water to float back to deeper water.
> 
> ...


You don’t know what you’re talking about. I hate to be rude but it’s the truth. You read that and that made it true in your mind. If anyone was going to flip a tunnel hull it would be me but I’m still here and never flipped a boat. That is silly. 
Tell me what your thoughts are on three blades versus four? Which is for speed and which is for holeshot? This is very important.


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## commtrd (Aug 1, 2015)

Texas is somewhat of an anomaly, compared to many other coastal fishing venues in the US. From middle coast on down, and particularly the closer to Mexico one ventures, the shallower the waters tend to be. So having a properly set up tunnel and jackplate become practically indispensable. Especially with regards to not chopping up the bottom. Seagrass preservation is really important, and having a tunnel hull boat really helps to do that.


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## mrbacklash (Nov 1, 2008)

How on earth do you flip a tunnel hull boat?!I mean if you turn super sharp and have it trimmed up sure you could make the ass end pretty loose and the bow dig in and spin out but that comes with learning your boat. I have ran a Bluewave 189ST that had a monster tunnel, Majek 18 RFL which could run in almost nothing and my Cayenne i have now. They all have their quirks but flipping isnt one of them. Fuel economy wise i get 8.7 mpg running 30mph with my Cayenne cant complain about that


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## Guest (Mar 14, 2020)

mrbacklash said:


> How on earth do you flip a tunnel hull boat?!I mean if you turn super sharp and have it trimmed up sure you could make the ass end pretty loose and the bow dig in and spin out but that comes with learning your boat. I have ran a Bluewave 189ST that had a monster tunnel, Majek 18 RFL which could run in almost nothing and my Cayenne i have now. They all have their quirks but flipping isnt one of them. Fuel economy wise i get 8.7 mpg running 30mph with my Cayenne cant complain about that


I think the flipping thing came from the scooter boats that are more of a cat hull than a tunnel and typically short and wide. I could be wrong though.


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## Lagoonnewb (Apr 16, 2017)

Just posting this for fun, pretty bad ass if you ask me! 
https://www.instagram.com/p/BoSu2xKAjri/?igshid=xl6vcrmz36cs


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## Guest (Mar 14, 2020)

Lagoonnewb said:


> Just posting this for fun, pretty bad ass if you ask me!
> https://www.instagram.com/p/BoSu2xKAjri/?igshid=xl6vcrmz36cs


Good stuff!


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Lagoonnewb said:


> Just posting this for fun, pretty bad ass if you ask me!
> https://www.instagram.com/p/BoSu2xKAjri/?igshid=xl6vcrmz36cs


I don’t Instagram, what is it?


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## jay.bush1434 (Dec 27, 2014)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> I don’t Instagram, what is it?


Someone, who is obviously a very skilled skiff driver, spinning out a Chittum on purpose.


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## commtrd (Aug 1, 2015)

So obviously if operating the tunnel hull as a serious fishing tool there is zero risk of it "flipping over" with emphasis on operating responsibly. Like some people could figure out how tear up an anvil etc. 

Never underestimate dumbass in other words.


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## commtrd (Aug 1, 2015)

Boatbrains said:


> I think the flipping thing came from the scooter boats that are more of a cat hull than a tunnel and typically short and wide. I could be wrong though.


The Explorer tunnel-vee type hulls were the ones typically associated with digging in the bow and flipping around, sometimes throwing people out. The flatter bottoms like shallowsport, majek RFL, dargel etc dont really tend to do that so much. It's the pivot point being that sharp bow entry that grabs in chop and higher speed turns etc.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

I have been around boats on the coast a long time and the only ones I’ve seen or heard about flipping were left in a wet slip with the plugs out and no bilge pump and guys trying to anchor in the surf and a rogue wave flips them end over end because the bow noses into the first sand bar. It is just another internet lie that people believe.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

commtrd said:


> The Explorer tunnel-vee type hulls were the ones typically associated with digging in the bow and flipping around, sometimes throwing people out. The flatter bottoms like shallowsport, majek RFL, dargel etc dont really tend to do that so much. It's the pivot point being that sharp bow entry that grabs in chop and higher speed turns etc.


The hull that started all this nonsense was the El Pescador tunnel. Sharp bow entry, tunnel and 200 plus horsepower VMax jacked up while running in chop and the bow grabs and stern spins around and then catches and tosses people out. None of them flipped or sank. They were and still are unsinkable due to being fully foam filled. That hull has been around since the 80’s and Dave still makes and sells them.


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## TGlidden (May 24, 2013)

Having run the same hulls in Texas, with and without tunnels, including owning and using both for around a year interchangeably. Tunnels don’t have as good a reverse as a non-tunnel, prop wear is significantly worse on tunnel skiff, a jackplate-tunnel combo is a draft killer on narrower skiffs (stuff you’d want to pole). Basically, I want the ability to pole anywhere a redfish can swim. If that costs a couple inches in running draft I’m fine with it, I can pole a bit further. If you want to run shallow and fish deeper, set up down wind drifts or burn and bump tunnels are the way to go.
Areas where prop damage is frequent not with standing, if I was in a rocky area I would run a tunnel. “Run to the flats, not through the flats”


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## Matts (Sep 2, 2015)

I’ve had both. I had a tunnel Jon boat for years set up for TX and it ran in about 5-6” no problem. Now I have a non-tunnel LM2. Chittum and it runs in the same and floats in 4-5”. Like Keith, I almost got a tunnel. From what I’ve heard, it’s less work to set the non tunnel up and it does just fine for most of TX. I can jump it up clean in 8-10” no problems. It’s all about weight. I have a short shaft 50 Tohatsu on the Chittum And it floats very level, which is key for poling draft.


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## commtrd (Aug 1, 2015)

Matts said:


> I’ve had both. I had a tunnel Jon boat for years set up for TX and it ran in about 5-6” no problem. Now I have a non-tunnel LM2. Chittum and it runs in the same and floats in 4-5”. Like Keith, I almost got a tunnel. From what I’ve heard, it’s less work to set the non tunnel up and it does just fine for most of TX. I can jump it up clean in 8-10” no problems. It’s all about weight. I have a short shaft 50 Tohatsu on the Chittum And it floats very level, which is key for poling draft.


I have become convinced the key item here IS the weight. Or lack of it more specifically. And technique. A full carbon Chittum LM2 will jump up equally shallow as a tunnel will, because the tunnel is not moving any water at all from rest. The technique is to jack the motor up all the way, tilt it out so the prop is just under water, and spin her out in usually less than half a donut. I witnessed Stephen Ford do this several times back in the marsh by Cedar Bayou while floating BARELY over soft bottom. The boat ran on plane in areas I never thought I would see a non-tunnel hull boat run. Again the key is the light weight. Fortunately, the tunnel hull version of the LM2 drafts almost identical to what the non-tunnel does on the pole. So the question then becomes: do I NEED to be able to run in 3" and draft a huge 1/8"+ more than the non-tunnel, or can I get by without a tunnel, and not have that capability when fishing on grass flats that are about 8" deep (or less) for a few miles, and REALLY WISH I had the tunnel for those times when it really does matter. I personally do know that I have been in those situations fishing lower laguna madre just about every time I went down there. Heck for that matter, I have seen many areas in Port O Connor with the same scenario. Middle TX coast. 

Summary: the non-tunnel full carbon boat does an awesome job. No doubt about it. The tunnel-hull full carbon boat runs (effectively) with the air boats. To a point. *SO having the tunnel sacrifices virtually no draft on the pole, and provides the best available access to all areas that are exclusively extreme shallow-water domain.* BTW Stephen told me the tunnel hull boat tends to be a little more gentle on propellers, as it can be run above the bottom of the hull, and there is no way to do that on a non-tunnel boat. The tunnel hull boat is a tool. A very customized and special purpose tool. Like the Skil planers we used to use for mowing foam making surfboards, cut off the front couple inches to allow for smooth rail transition to cut in the subtle S-curve on rails etc. Point being, the tunnel is like that. A specialized tool. AND, if it is like the Chittum LM2, *the benefit is NOT giving up any performance on the pole.* BTW this is not an advertisement for the Chittum boats. Any similar properly designed and implemented skiff with hull weight in the mid-300 lb range for an 18' boat and the correct tunnel-bottom configuration is going to yield these same benefits. Problem is there are not too many of these type boats available. There are no TX-made boats that will perform like this. 

Conclusion: A tunnel hull full carbon boat ordered. That is (IMHO) the absolute best tool I can possibly buy for what I want to do with it. Peeps can bad-mouth tunnels all they want. Those guys are not paying for my boat. Fortunately, we can all buy what we want, assuming enough sheckels to pull it off. Since all I hear is thundering silence when it comes to someone offering to pay for my non-tunnel hull boat, I have to assume it's just not happening so might as well buy what I need. *Finally, ultra light weight is a lot more important than a tunnel is.* Even Hal has told me more than once, that he definitely prefers the non-tunnel hull, because it is a lot more hassle to build the tunnel hull. But for a price, he will build a tunnel hull.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Send it Keith!!!


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## K3anderson (Jan 23, 2013)

TGlidden said:


> Having run the same hulls in Texas, with and without tunnels, including owning and using both for around a year interchangeably. Tunnels don’t have as good a reverse as a non-tunnel, prop wear is significantly worse on tunnel skiff, a jackplate-tunnel combo is a draft killer on narrower skiffs (stuff you’d want to pole). Basically, I want the ability to pole anywhere a redfish can swim. If that costs a couple inches in running draft I’m fine with it, I can pole a bit further. If you want to run shallow and fish deeper, set up down wind drifts or burn and bump tunnels are the way to go.
> Areas where prop damage is frequent not with standing, if I was in a rocky area I would run a tunnel. “Run to the flats, not through the flats”


I'm going to respectfully disagree with you. I have an HB non-tunnel Guide that poles in ridiculous shallow water. Some say one of the skinniest HB's because of the width. Bogg's, Spear Tunnel can run shallower and pole in the same depth. If it drafts anymore than mine its 1/4" or less. His has full floor etc. and is "heavy" for a Spear with its 50 4-stroke. It can't run in sloppy water like I can but it can definitely pole ANYWHERE a redfish can swim. We take them out to the same places you would kayak. I would say it poles the same as a Pro/17.8. Whether a skiff has a tunnel or not isn't the end all be all of draft. What's the rest of the design?


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## bryson (Jun 22, 2015)

commtrd said:


> The tunnel-hull full carbon boat runs (effectively) with the air boats. To a point.


My Hewes also runs with air boats, to a point. That point is probably about 14" deep


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## SomaliPirate (Feb 5, 2016)

When the ladies find out you run a tunnel.


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## commtrd (Aug 1, 2015)

^^^Classic...


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

SomaliPirate said:


> When the ladies find out you run a tunnel.


I’m telling you, wet panties come at you like flying squirrels...my lady gets pissed.


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## SomaliPirate (Feb 5, 2016)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> I’m telling you, wet panties come at you like flying squirrels...my lady gets pissed.


This post is responsible for the half chewed chicken caesar wrap I just spewed all over my computer.


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## K3anderson (Jan 23, 2013)




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## Snakesurf (Jun 18, 2019)

K3anderson said:


> View attachment 123344


People, please quit panicking. Why did you have to remind me the store ran out of toilet paper, so I guess I can use a public fountain as a bidet!


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Snakesurf said:


> People, please quit panicking. Why did you have to remind me the store ran out of toilet paper, so I guess I can use a public fountain as a bidet!


They have a shitload of paper towels. I picked up two cases of Bounty 4 ply from Sam’s and cut them in half with my chop saw. You have to use the finishing blade for a clean edge.


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## SomaliPirate (Feb 5, 2016)

People stop worrying. After two weeks of eating peanut butter and MRE's your turds will look like a deer's and there's no need to wipe. Just drop some pellets and drive on.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

SomaliPirate said:


> People stop worrying. After two weeks of eating peanut butter and MRE's your turds will look like a deer's and there's no need to wipe. Just drop some pellets and drive on.


Your bung will just open up and pellets will fall out like pomegranate seeds.


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## Guest (Mar 16, 2020)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> Your bung will just open up and pellets will fall out like pomegranate seeds.


Damn!


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## Snakesurf (Jun 18, 2019)

Like rabbit turds?


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Snakesurf said:


> Like rabbit turds?


Cabrito


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## commtrd (Aug 1, 2015)

bryson said:


> My Hewes also runs with air boats, to a point. That point is probably about 14" deep


OK you know what I meant... wiseacre! =)


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## noeettica (Sep 23, 2007)

Love my MV Tunnel ! cav plate 11 inches above boat bottom ! 14" of freeboard runs skinny as F**K !


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## Sublime (Oct 9, 2015)

Some tunnel boats can run "airboat" skinny, but how do you guys in south Texas deal with floating grass? My few trips down there in both tunnel and non tunnel boats were hampered by this.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Sublime said:


> Some tunnel boats can run "airboat" skinny, but how do you guys in south Texas deal with floating grass? My few trips down there in both tunnel and non tunnel boats were hampered by this.


My low water pickup doesn’t catch grass, it goes right past it.


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## Sublime (Oct 9, 2015)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> My low water pickup doesn’t catch grass, it goes right past it.



I had problems with it just hanging on the front of the lower unit and then I would start cavitating. Stop, clear grass off, jump back up, go 500 yards and repaeat.


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## Guest (Mar 18, 2020)

Sublime said:


> Some tunnel boats can run "airboat" skinny, but how do you guys in south Texas deal with floating grass? My few trips down there in both tunnel and non tunnel boats were hampered by this.


I have run a lot of outboard jets and while not the same I do have to deal with a whole lotta floating grass! I watch for it and when I get close, I trim the bow down effectively parting the grass before it gets to the pick up.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Sublime said:


> I had problems with it just hanging on the front of the lower unit and then I would start cavitating. Stop, clear grass off, jump back up, go 500 yards and repaeat.


Most of my favorite back lakes are covered with it in summer. It’s that snotty moss like salad that used to shut me down for the same reason. Jack that motor up high enough and it can’t stick to the nosecone.


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## Mike Haydon (Dec 19, 2019)

crboggs said:


> Tunnel, why?
> 
> Because...TUNNEL!
> 
> ...





Guys thanks for all the replies. I now understand the tunnel essentially throws water up to allow your outboard to run higher than the bottom of the skiff and not overheat. Very cool and if you run like this Instagram post your a bad ass. I'm sorry but I WONT be doing this. That's crazy. I dont need to break something. I'll just fish somewhere else. Lol


That being said the james bond move is pretty cool. I'm sure your chick is excited! But she isnt wet from that, it's from all the spray! Lol, and her excitement is her yelling at you all the way home and swearing she will never have her bikini and bare feet on your boat again!
Thanks, michael


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

They really slow you down...
They make the boat hard to handle...
They are baaaad mkay?


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## Guest (Mar 20, 2020)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> They really slow you down...
> They make the boat hard to handle...
> They are baaaad mkay?


Scootin’ right along.


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Boatbrains said:


> Scootin’ right along.


15 feet of water, you should see that ass pop up in less than a foot.


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## LowHydrogen (Dec 31, 2015)

Smackdaddy53 said:


> They really slow you down...
> They make the boat hard to handle...
> They are baaaad mkay?


Wow plate looks WAY above water line. Is that jacked all the way up or will it go higher?

Tail looks like a surface drive!


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## Guest (Mar 20, 2020)

LowHydrogen said:


> Wow plate looks WAY above water line. Is that jacked all the way up or will it go higher?
> 
> Tail looks like a surface drive!


Imagine a surface drive adaptor that slips over the propshaft and attaches to the gear case somehow “maybe welded on like a nose cone” on a set up like this! Would only need about another 10”-12” and @Smackdaddy53 has a hovercraft!


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## LowHydrogen (Dec 31, 2015)

Boatbrains said:


> Imagine a surface drive adaptor that slips over the propshaft and attaches to the gear case somehow “maybe welded on like a nose cone” on a set up like this! Would only need about another 10”-12” and @Smackdaddy53 has a hovercraft!


I was thinking if the plate wasn't there and you could see the wheel it would prob look like an Arneson drive on a race boat.

Edit: Like this. About 1:35 in


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## Sublime (Oct 9, 2015)




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## Guest (Mar 20, 2020)

LowHydrogen said:


> I was thinking if the plate wasn't there and you could see the wheel it would prob look like an Arneson drive on a race boat.
> 
> Edit: Like this. About 1:35 in


I know, ran one years ago! But think about the performance increase capabilities of a surface drive gearcase like I mentioned? I would be interested in the results and might have to try it!!!


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

LowHydrogen said:


> Wow plate looks WAY above water line. Is that jacked all the way up or will it go higher?
> 
> Tail looks like a surface drive!


That’s where I run it in deep water, 3 on the Bob’s so it’s halfway up. I don’t play when I say my motor is as high or higher all the way down than most are all the way up!


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## Smackdaddy53 (Dec 31, 2012)

Sublime said:


>


Pfffft I’ll get a video of my prop from the side soon. If I’m still allowed to launch my skiff.


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## Mike Haydon (Dec 19, 2019)

That surface drive video: I think the boat is out of the water totally. I would really have to know someone to go that fast and me not driving


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## Guest (Mar 20, 2020)

Mike Haydon said:


> That surface drive video: I think the boat is out of the water totally. I would really have to know someone to go that fast and me not driving


Ya better come get to know me more if ya ever wanna go fishen with me then! I’ve been know to jump oyster bars and slide up on the bank!


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